Episode 64 - Interview With Wes And Cullen Of Nodus IWatches

Published on Wed, 15 Jan 2020 22:45:00 -0800

Synopsis

This is a podcast episode where the hosts Andrew and Everett interview Wes and Colin from Notice Watches, a microband company. They discuss the design and development process behind Notice Watches' latest release, the Sector dive watch collection, which includes a field watch and a diver. They talk about the inspiration, prototyping, finishing details, and design philosophy that went into creating the Sector watches. They also touch on Notice Watches' plans for future releases like a dress watch, a pilot watch, and a GMT watch. The conversation covers diverse topics such as beer, TV shows, and experimental mushroom use.

Transcript

Speaker
Andrew Hello, fellow watch lovers, nerds, enthusiasts, or however you identify. This is the 40 in 20 podcast with your host, Andrew and my good friend Everett. Here, we talk about watches, food, drinks, life, and other things we like.
Everett Everett, how are you? I'm kind of, I'm kind of exhausted.
Andrew Kind of exhausted or, or actually exhausted. You look pretty good given, given what you've told me. Yeah.
Everett Yeah, no, uh, I mean, kind of, kind of, yeah, I'm kind of exhausted.
Andrew At least it's Sunday. Yeah. You only have a whole work week to look forward to.
Everett And I didn't really have to do anything today. Today was just sort of, uh, recover, recuperate. Uh, but yeah, I, I, I did get housed last night after the Oregon, Oregon basketball game.
Andrew Good for you.
Everett Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was, it was actually a little too housed. Uh, uh, so like, enough house that I don't really remember getting home. And then I woke up and ran 10 miles this morning. Jackpot.
Andrew That's the best way to clean that system out. They always say sweat it out. That doesn't work for me. I need to lay and wallow.
Everett The one thing I do remember from being at the house last night from getting home is I did remember to take four Advil and four Tylenol. And a couple of Tums? Yes. I took everything with a giant glass of water. and then passed out. Do you do the Pedialyte? I have. I don't really like the way it tastes.
Andrew Well, neither do I, but I also don't like being hung over. So, you know, you got choices in the world.
Everett Yeah, no, I was I was actually pretty good today. I wasn't hung over. I was just sort of I was just like day after having drank way too much.
Andrew So I had a boss. I don't know. He's 15, 20 years older than me. And we went out drinking one time and on the way back, we were walking back to our hotel and I stopped at a 7-Eleven to pick up Pedialyte. And he's like, what are you doing? It's like, bro, what am I doing? I'm saving my life right now. And I explained it to him. And I went to his house a couple of weeks later and he and his wife both had a marked, like their bottle of Pedialyte for just in case when they got accidental drunk, they would be Pedialyte right up.
Everett It goes in the liquor cabinet. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, how are you?
Andrew Well, I'm tired. I switched sides of the week. So usually I work four 10s and I am on my fifth 10 in a row because I'm working on the other side of the week. So that's okay. Powering through. Powering through. Doing well. You know, we have a newborn at the house, so I was going to be tired no matter what, but he's doing well. He's growing, he's eating, he's shitting, he's doing all the baby things you'd expect a baby to do. So he's not fun to hang out with because he, I really can't do anything for him. besides like hold him and let him throw up on me and wipe his ass, which are all important things for a dad to do. It's just, it's not very much fun. So I've, I found myself playing with my four year old quite a bit more because he's fun. He interacts. Yeah. Like he's cool to hang out with. And he says things like, let's bro out, you know, those kinds of things. So, uh, doing well, good. Did not get housed last night. So that's part of the other reason I'm feeling well is I'm not hung over.
Everett I'm sure. Yeah. Yeah, I'm sure. Well, well, we've got some folks, we've got some folks on the line and I, and I'm kind of excited. So I'd like to just introduce them.
Andrew Let's bring it in.
Everett Let's, let's start the party. So, so, uh, Wes and Colin, are you there?
Wes Yes, we are.
Everett Can you hear us? I can. I can hear you. So, uh, Wes and Colin of Notice Watches, welcome to 40 and 20. Finally.
Andrew I know we've been trying to make this happen for years.
Wes Yeah, we've been talking for a long time over Instagram about us coming on the show. So thank you for finally getting us on.
Everett And so you guys are in Los Angeles, correct?
Wes Yeah, yeah, we're in L.A.
Everett Okay. And what's the weather like?
Wes Amazing, as it is the entire year. Yeah. Can't complain.
Andrew Yeah.
Unknown It chilly 74 degrees right now.
Colin It's really cold. It's it's about like 60 degrees. Oh, geez. Sounds terrible. You got to get the thick jacket out and the scarves and the boots and everything.
Everett So I don't know if you guys heard. I don't know if you heard me say I ran 10 miles today, this morning. I'll say it a couple more times throughout the show. But when I when I was done, I was wearing gloves because it's it's cold enough that you need gloves. And I was wearing, you know, socks, normal running stuff. And I I had to go outside after I got home to wring everything out, to wring out all my clothes, like a gallon of water that I was carrying on my body.
Andrew I had to wring out my shirt today after work. It's real rainy, real yucky, and 40 degrees.
Everett And really cold, yeah. So we're jealous of your weather.
Colin Everett, are you Iron Man?
Everett Because, damn. Because I drank and then ran?
Colin Yeah, come on. It's reckless is what it is.
Everett Yeah, it's reckless. I'm not. No, it was actually probably really embarrassing looking, all of it.
Andrew Floiling. He's crying a little bit.
Everett Fortunately, it's raining, so. Starting at about nine o'clock last night.
Wes Nobody wanted to see any of that. Are you a big runner? 10 miles is no easy feat, man. You can't just do that. You have to build up. It requires real training to get up to that.
Everett I think most people could fake a 10 mile run, but I do run. Yeah, I think you could fake it.
Andrew I mean, I know people who've who've just got up and run a marathon before and it's not good.
Everett Yeah, you can't really fake a marathon. I mean, that's people die when they do that.
Colin All right. Well, what was your what was your mile run back in high school?
Everett Like I did. I did a five K. I mean, I didn't I didn't run a lot in high school. I wasn't really a runner at the time. I was a swimmer, but I did five K. I did run cross country. My five K time, I think, was uh high 17s.
Andrew 5k that's uh that sounds like my mile run is that that's two miles yeah that's horrible you could walk that man yeah there's just i don't i don't know any reason why you'd run a run 10 miles but i tried to talk andrew into running with me and he does he won't do it i don't know i won't running is for survival only not recreation yeah yeah and any in any environment where i'm gonna need to run i'm gonna be faster than at least someone around me or I'm alone, in which case I'm dead. Problem solved.
Everett Well, so, gentlemen, we brought you on the show today because we wanted to talk about some new watches that you guys have. In fact, we have got one of them here in our hands. Andrew has spirited it away and it's been on his wrist all week, but I'm going to have it here for a couple days before this thing has to move on. We've got your new skin diver watch, your sector dive watch.
Wes And this is being... What do you guys think? Are you guys enjoying it?
Andrew I would say you should just leave it with us because I don't think anybody else is going to want to see this. Yeah, these are terrible.
Everett You guys should give it up.
Andrew I would just cut your losses on this one and just move on.
Wes So let me interrupt you guys real quick just to explain to everyone who's listening how all this came about. Uh, it must have been over a year ago now, but you guys did an episode talking about watches that kind of fell out of fashion. Um, and we're not talking about specific models. We're talking about styles of watches. And one of those styles was the skin diver. And you guys, I remember we're having a lot of trouble thinking of skin divers that are modern day skin divers, right? I mean, we have like the 65 we have, uh, laundry and skin diver reissue.
Colin Yeah.
Wes a lot of the traits that they had didn't really have that much in common with the traditional skin divers. So that's kind of what started the, uh, the, the snowball, um, for us to want to put something out that actually represented a lot of the things that old vintage true skin divers had. Uh, so we owe you guys a huge thanks for starting that, starting the ball rolling on that.
Everett And, you know, when you told me that, I thought, gosh, this is just the most fun thing in the world. And to have that watch. To be looking at it, to have worn it. Show up in the mail was pretty neat. You know, obviously we didn't do anything besides make a bad podcast where we talked about nonsense mostly. But to see the evolution of, you know, that conversation has been pretty special. I will say, my first reaction in taking this thing out of the box is that, you know, we've had a Trieste in, we've had a Contrail in, we've had an Avalon in. What else have we seen? That's like the catalog, right?
Andrew No, we've seen one more.
Wes We'll get you guys a Duality.
Andrew Yeah, we had a Duality. No, I don't think we have seen the Duality. We have. It came with the Trieste and the Contrail. No, it wasn't out then.
Wes It wasn't out then.
Andrew Yes, because we had three. And then we had the Avalon back then. Yeah, the retrospect.
Everett OK, OK, OK.
Wes Yeah, because we'll have a duality sent out to you guys once it's ready.
Andrew We cannot wait. Does it does it have to come back?
Wes We'll talk about that often.
Everett OK, so my my first reaction when taking this thing out of the box is and we're going to ask you guys to talk about this in length, but how how, uh, all of the tolerances, the machining, the finishing, uh, is just next level. I assume that the duality has similar finishing quality as, um, the sector, the sector watches, but it seems like each watch, you know, you've, that you've come out with has, has been, uh, a significant step up in terms of quality finishing, um, and overall fit and finish. Is this approaching the final evolution of that?
Wes I think the interesting thing about this kind of work is that it never really stops. You know what I mean? No matter how good we get, there's always going to be something we can improve on. In terms of the quality, at least. Cullen and I have actually had discussions about what's our contingency plan when we find that our designs are kind of plateauing. our cap on how good or how wide our market can be in terms of our our design. We don't really have an answer, but at least we know that the quality is something we can always be working on, whether it's the the style of brushing or the transitions between the different finishings or the tolerances. There's always something that can be improved on. So as far as quality goes, we can you know, there's there's no ceiling on how far that can go.
Everett And so you guys have I've heard you talk about this a number of times, but you sort of have this three-tiered approach to notice the product, the brand, and then the business side. Am I getting those right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so when we're talking about these finishing details and the brushing details, I assume that would be in the product side.
Wes Yes, yeah, that's correct. Obviously, there's a bit of overlap, I think, between the three that has to be addressed. But for the most part, yeah, when we're, when we're talking to our engineers, uh, that all really falls into the product development.
Everett So let's talk a little bit about the sector, what, what it is, because this is not, it's, it's not one watch now, uh, rather it's two watches, but eventually I understand it's going to be four watches. Um, the pilot watch, the dress watch, the, the, and the, and the field and diver, which have just been, uh, just been sort of rolled out. Um, Tell us about that idea. Tell us about how that came to be and besides the obvious, where you're going with that.
Colin I think, so it all started with a case. Wes and I, we designed a case that we just both really, really freaking loved. It just had the right curves. It had the right contours and the right, you know, just the right shape for different styles of watches. And then we also really loved different styles of watches, but like, we're not comfortable just making them from the ground up. Therefore we had this, this, this idea that maybe we could just take this one mid case and then make different types of watches out of it that, you know, we're not our typical bread and butter type of watches, dive watches. So we would make a field watch. We would make a, a dress watch, a pilot watch eventually. So, um, that's, that's pretty much how it started, right? Like, uh,
Wes Yeah. To add onto that, the example that Cullen gave me when we sort of started the whole design process was Grand Seiko. And the reason why is because pretty much all their mid cases have the Grand Seiko look, you know, like you could have the divers, you could have the dressier pieces, but they all kind of are all based on the same DNA. And that was what Cullen wanted to try to achieve. He wanted to have a watch DNA that underlies the entire family of watches. Um, but it needed to be perfect for every single style, which is, that was really what the challenge was. So we had to pretty much design everything in beginning just to make sure that it worked with all the different styles of watches. And, um, for us, because our specialties dive watches, the limiting factor that we thought would kind of hinder that, that progress was the fact that, you know, now, nowadays people think dive watches need to be two to 300 meters of water resistance. Sure. And, uh, and that sort of, when I thought back to that podcast that I listened to, I mean, I still remember listening to that podcast. You guys did, I was in the gym and I had to pause it just to text Colin. I was like, yo, listen to this podcast. These guys are talking about skin divers and they're having trouble thinking of a skin diver. Can you think of a proper skin diver? So that kind of gave us the, uh, the affordance to say, all right, now we can still make a diver, but it doesn't have to be the two to 300 meter water resistance. And that type of specification can be applied across the board for dress watches, pilot watches, and field watches, as we can see Grand Seiko doing. And I'm sure if you guys know our approach to how we run this business, you probably know that we're fanboys of Seiko and Grand Seiko. Yeah, it's just completely reasonable.
Andrew I love that you're talking about the DNA of your watches, because that's something we talk about a lot, is you can look at a watch from a distance and almost immediately pick out the brand that it was born out of. With some brands, right? Yeah, with the brands that are really true to them. And I think that's really evident in this. It has all of your guys' DNA for this whole family of watches. And I like that you're staying true to that. You're not trying to go in every kind of wild direction and chase the trends that are out there. You're sticking with what you're doing well, and you're growing from that I almost spilled my beverage. Uh, you're growing from that because I'm really animated right now. Um, you're growing from that point of what you guys are doing exceptionally well and, and growing from there, as opposed to just taking a piece here, taking a piece there. Um, I, I really appreciate that you guys are staying true to your, to your design aesthetics and to, to your passion for, for design.
Everett Well, and so let's talk a little bit about the number, the 150 meter water resistance number is now is that a is that a water resistance figure that's going to be present in all four of the sector watches?
Wes We don't know yet. We don't know yet.
Everett Okay. Okay. I guess we can leave it at that.
Wes A lot of, well, a lot of the water resistance, and I think this is something a lot of people don't know about watch engineering, but a lot of that water resistance comes down to the crystal. It's not really in the design of the mid case or the case back. It's mostly in the crystal, to be honest. Um, so far the crystal that we're using is, uh, we're, we're calling it a tapered crystal and it, it works with the current two designs that we have. Um, but we don't have the actual prototypes for the dress and the pilot yet. So we're not sure if we're going to keep the same crystal. It might be less. It might be more. We're not sure yet.
Andrew Are you guys going to go really traditional dress or you guys are going to go dress sport with that, uh, with that dress option?
Colin Um, probably definitely towards the, the grand Seiko side of the dress watch. So definitely it's, it's going to be sporty. Um, it'll be more like a, It'll be a sportier, sportier SARB actually. So SARB 33, SARB 35. Um, it'll be a bit sportier than that, but it'll be just as water resistant. Um, so at least a hundred meters, um, but like the whole dress, um, aesthetic is honestly, it's, it's not very versatile. It's, um, it's kind of outdated. So we want to make sure that it's a dress aesthetic that can be used in everyday life. Not just like with a suit, you know?
Andrew You guys are talking our language right now.
Unknown Yeah, that's right.
Colin So it's still in the works, but we're pretty confident that we can make something that is quite like formal, but at the same time versatile.
Everett So let's talk about these last two sets of watches, the duality and the sector. I've heard you guys discuss your sort of main line watches. So, I think it's the Avalon, I think it's the Trieste, and I think it's the Contrail, or maybe I'm getting one of those wrong. But you have this idea to keep three watches sort of as your staples and always in rotation. Is that still the case, or are those ideas evolving?
Wes The Trieste is a bit of a different story. The Trieste was kind of our way of testing the market. It's not what we would consider part of our core lineup.
Everett So it's the Retrospect instead of the Trieste?
Wes Yeah, yeah. So the Retrospect was actually our second watch that we ever put out. So right now we're coming up on three years of being in business. So it's still a little bit early for us to really have a, you know, a very strict output. But so far, what we've been trying to do ever since last year was we want to have three new releases at least per year. Wow. Um, but it's, it's not going to be like, we're going to put a watch out, let it sell out and then never make it again. I don't think that really makes sense for what we're trying to build with notice. Um, but we're going to introduce it, see how it does. And we're going to make tweaks based on the feedback and, and sales figures, bring it back with improvements. And we, we do want it to be a core part of our lineup. So the retrospect is going to stick around, uh, the Contra, the Avalon, the duality. These, these are all watches that we want to keep in under the notice umbrella. That's not to say it's always going to be in stock. You know, like the Avalon, it might sell out tomorrow and it might not come back for a year or two, but it's going to be, you know, one of the pillars of what this company is.
Everett I like that. I like that. That's hard on consumers too, right? When there's a watch that, Oh, you should get one of these, but they've been, they haven't been making them for 10 years. So good luck finding one. Uh, I like the idea that there's going to be There's always going to be the ability to know in the future that that watch you want is going to come back and it's going to and you're going to be able to buy it from from you guys in this case.
Andrew I like the idea of the spring catalog and the summer catalog and the fall catalog. I kind of like that idea. Spring is, you know, coming to you spring 2021 and then, you know, fall 2021. Having that idea of it's coming back and that revolving door of of growing and developing and tweaking and coming back to things as you as you just revolve through them. I like that marketing strategy.
Wes Right. Yeah. I mean, I think I also have to say something about the design process. It's really difficult in the beginning when we're coming out with a new model to kind of formulate what this is going to look like, what's going to make this watch a notice watch. But once it's out and it starts getting out into the world, it becomes very, very easy for us to just look at the comments on Instagram and on YouTube and make tweaks based on what people are saying and what they're talking about, uh, in, in regards to whatever model that, uh, that's being reviewed or, or, uh, whatever's in the photo. So for us, we, we definitely want to have a regular output just so that we can get regular feedback and, you know, evolve based on what people are talking about.
Everett What, what, what people want. So, yeah, exactly. So aesthetically, I see aesthetically, it seems to me that the, duality and these sector watches are significantly different than, I think, the Contrail or the Avalon, perhaps. And not in terms of branding or anything, but it seems like this is a real evolution in what you guys are going to be putting out in the future. Am I picking up on something that's not there or is that a thing?
Wes Well, the way I want to try to think about it is It's a bit like how, when star Wars first came out, it was episode four, five, six. So you kind of already knew from the beginning that there's going to be a little bit more to the story than what you're watching. Right.
Unknown Sure.
Wes Right, right now with, uh, with what we have out, it's. It's cool. Like it's a cohesive design. I like to think it's a cohesive design and all the models that we do, but it's really just part of the story that we're trying to tell ultimately over the next 10, 20, 30 years. Uh, and I think over time, you're going to start to see a few design elements Come back in in ways that make sense, right? It wouldn't make sense for example to put the Avalon hand set on the contrail because the whole point of the Avalon hand set was to be big wide readable whereas a contrail we want it to be a little bit more Refined and have a bit more finesse to the look right But you can still see the shape of the contrail indices and the hands it does make a comeback on the duality not in the same kind of treatment like the the Um, the duality is, uh, applied plus sandwich doll. Whereas the control has a few more cuts out here, here, here, and there. But for the most part, the shape of it is the same. And the shape of the handset is the same. That is us trying to channel the same kind of aesthetic, the same kind of refined, uh, dressier aesthetic that we had on the control, trying to channel that into the duality. You actually see the same handset shape, but not the same color on the sector series.
Unknown Sure.
Wes When it makes sense for us to come out with another. professional dive watch that's not the Avalon, you might see that same thing come back, you know. But it's, again, it's all just part of a small part of a larger story that we want to tell over the next 10 to 20 years.
Everett I like that. The, the idea that, that, uh, you guys are, you guys are programming, programming that DNA and, and developing your story, although it's not a story exactly, but developing that in a deliberate, in a deliberate fashion. I like it.
Wes Could you talk to us a little bit? You might not see that consistency right now because of how young we are. But over time, we hope that, you know, like the goal for us is to eventually keep on bringing things back that people like and things that we decided on consciously to have a very specific purpose. We want to bring those things back. And I think over time, people are going to start to see that.
Andrew Could you talk to us a little bit about what your design process looks like so we can start here with the sector. You guys had nothing. You guys started from the ground up. What does that design process look like? What's that collaboration look like? You're really turning me down. I thought you were about to mute me. Yeah. So I just wondering what that process looks like for you guys.
Colin I think, first of all, it starts with a lot of beer. Yeah, that helps. Lube it up. Speaking of beer, what are you guys drinking right now?
Wes Yeah, you guys mentioned you're drinking beverages. I want to know what you guys are drinking.
Andrew I'm drinking, because Everett, you know, he's not. So I'm drinking some famous grouse blended scotch whiskey. And I'm going to owe you a handle of this if I'm not careful.
Everett And I'm actually dry tonight because of yesterday's debauchery.
Colin So what'd you have last night at the game?
Everett Man, there was a lot. There was a lot of different things. I had some bubble stash. Who makes bubble stash?
Colin Who makes that? What is that?
Everett Hop Valley. Is it Hop Valley? Okay, that's a Hop Valley IPA. I had some citrus mistress also. Some more Hop Valley. Hop Valley IPA. And then we went to a bar. At the bar, I believe I was taking shots of Pendleton, although I cannot confirm that because I neither ordered them nor paid for them.
Andrew Jackpot. That's the real winner right there. What are you guys drinking right now? Because you got some good local beers in L.A. too.
Colin Yeah, there's a well, I'm drinking actually a Seattle thing. It's just the Elysian Space Dust IPA.
Andrew That's one of the best beers on the market. Love it.
Colin It's it's deceptively strong.
Andrew Oh, it's a puncher. Yeah.
Colin It just says IPA. So like you're thinking, Oh, it's maybe 6%, maybe 7% at most. But then you see it's like 8.2. Yeah, it's pretty much a double IPA. But it doesn't really say it that it is. So like, when you drink it, you're like, Oh, man, I could have 12 of these.
Unknown But you cannot.
Wes And I'm actually taking a beer break. I'm drinking a George Dickel rye whiskey. 90 proof. It's one of the more affordable whiskeys. Yeah. Um, but it makes a great Manhattan. If you're into cocktails, it makes a great Boulevardier, uh, which is just a Negroni, but you replace the gin with bourbon. I like to put this rye instead. So taking a bit of a break.
Andrew It does a good old fashioned too. I have had that as an old fashioned.
Unknown Yeah. Yeah.
Everett Yeah. I think Dickel is probably my, uh, preferred Manhattan whiskey.
Colin Yeah. I got to try that in Manhattan.
Everett Although I'm kind of a heathen and I'll make a Manhattan with wild turkey too.
Andrew Or vodka, just whatever.
Wes As long as the wild turkey is 101. I don't know what you're doing with vodka, but if it's the 101 wild turkey, then that makes a great Manhattan too.
Everett Yeah.
Andrew And that's what's in the, in the cupboard right now. If the famous grouse goes away.
Everett Yeah, we, that's pretty much all we drink in terms of booze is famous grouse and wild turkey, at least when we're here. Cause that's pretty much the only thing I keep.
Andrew Yeah. Your keto life is. because I stopped bringing beer over because it's not that I was tired of ultra and hard, hard seltzers, spiked seltzers, but I was tired of Michelob Ultra and spiked seltzers.
Wes So yeah, sorry. I'm back on track the design process. I'm going to let Cullen take this one, especially because we're talking about the sector and this was really his brainchild. Was it?
Colin Man, I don't remember anymore.
Andrew It's your beer brainchild. That's the best kind.
Colin It's blurry as hell, like thinking back to it, like when we started this and why? Yeah. I mean, when did we start this? It was over a year ago. Jesus, really? Yeah, it was over a year ago. But essentially, like, I guess how it normally starts out is we have a beer or two or three, and then we just, we have a concept that we want to like design. And then once that concept is solidified, we then go into the details. It's kind of like a sculpture. It's like, you start with a block, like a, you know, just like a nice big block. And you just carve it down until or you sculpt it down to something that that resembles what you want. And Wes pretty much, he does a lot of the small details, which we mentioned in other podcasts, it's like, we start with the concept and then break it down to small details. And then we come up with an end product. I think we did this, the diver first, right?
Wes Because yeah, because that's what we're used to.
Colin Yeah.
Wes So it was easier for us to do that.
Colin But then we're like, we know we need to start branching out into other styles of watches simply because, well, A, the market is asking for it, and B, like it's... Diver fatigue, right? Diver fatigue is a real thing. It was a real thing. Maybe it's coming back again. I don't know. And then C, like we need to challenge ourselves. We've designed maybe like three divers already, so maybe we need to try something new, be a bit uncomfortable with our design choices. to really push the boundaries and then make something, uh, you know, fresh, you know, so that's, and so in the end we came out with the, uh, with the field watch. And I think we came out with that. We've, we've finalized that before the skin diver. Yeah. Yeah, we did.
Andrew So, and so when you, when you started on this case design, you, you were really deliberate with, with knowing that it was going to be several different styles of watch with this case as its foundation, as the heart of that collection. Yes. Yep. And so what was the thinking on doing that? Was it like a, was it a manufacturing perspective or was it really just to create that DNA for that family of watches as this is the foundation in the case and everything is going to clearly be related, whether it be brother or cousin, but still related by that case?
Wes Well, it's actually, it's a bit of both. So in most cases, manufacturing is a much bigger hurdle because there's what's called an MOQ, minimum order quantity. We're not really limited by that. We don't work with OEMs. And OEMs are the ones that really put that limitation on. Factories, for the most part, they say things like, yeah, you can only make 300, 500, 1,000. They all have their own MOQs. for the most part, if you develop some kind of relationship that you fostered and they know that you're a long-term client, they'll be like, all right, you want to make 50 pieces, a hundred pieces. Yeah. I think we can do that. Um, so for us, we wanted to make sure that we reduce risks, not so much in the number of watches that we're producing, but more so in the style of watches, right? Because our it's as our first field watch, um, I shit you not, man, like up until the day we actually launched it. we were nervous about the field watch. Uh, we were, we were like, is it going to sell at all? Which color is going to sell better? Right?
Everett Like, do people want a field watch from notice?
Wes Right, exactly. And, um, you know, within, within a couple hours after I, I hit publish on our website, Colin texts me and he's like, dude, we should have made more field watches. Um, so we, we tried to be conservative in, um, you know, that, that's the thing about running a business like this, where it started out as a passion, but then it slowly evolves into an actual business. We need to balance the two. And that's, it's a bit of a struggle for us because we don't know, like we love the field watch and we've always loved it, but we don't know if people are going to love it. So, you know, we, we produce less, not, not by a huge number, but we do produce slightly less than the, than the skin diver. But when we launch it, the field watch fucking kills it, right? And, and every single day we're getting a handful of orders for the field watch. And, you know, we, we, the, the dive is still, it's still selling, but not at the same rate as a field watch. So that's kind of why we kind of miscalculated it in that, um, in regards to how many field and how many dive that we make, but it's kind of to be expected when we're doing something for the first time, because we saw the exact same thing happen with all of our other watches. Right. We, uh, more so with the colors, right, where we're like, all right, let's make a brown or yellow or orange. And we really have no idea how it's going to perform. So that's why it's important for us to issue all these, all these new models really quickly, because then we can get that feedback and get that data. And then we can move on from there to listen to what people are asking for. Um, but with, in, in regards to the sector specifically, yeah, we definitely miscalculated, but it's not like. It's not like we can't make more later on with the feedback that we get.
Everett Sure. And you're able to tailor that based on sales, the ultimate data point, right?
Wes Yeah. I guess the ultimate data point should on paper, it should be sales, which one sells the best. But as a matter of fact, I try not to track that as closely as I do the more dynamic kind of feedback, which is the comments that we get or the DMs that we get or the emails that we get. That, in my opinion, means a little bit more because these are the people that care enough to write out a paragraph about why they want an Avalon with a date or why they want a sector dive without a date at 430 and why it belongs at six o'clock, right? Like the people that care enough to go in depth and really explain to us their reasoning why we did something wrong and why they want us to correct whatever it is that they want to buy. That to me says, okay, they care enough that they're actually going to put money down because I can't, I can't start to tell you guys how many people comment or DM out there like, yo, you guys really fucked up the date or you guys, uh, messed up the Pantone. And then when we come back and, and come out with, uh, a new, you know, a new model with the correct Pantone, do I see that name pop up in our invoices or do they ever come back and talk to us? Say, Oh, Hey, thanks for listening to my feedback. Of course not. No, no. Yeah. So we need to have some kind of system where we filter out the feedback that actually means something and put that in one bucket and all the feedback from the bullshitter is we just toss that.
Andrew Yeah, you got to balance that line between what the market is actually asking for versus what are the 50 loudest assholes who you can hear over everyone else who absolutely loves these watches and would change nothing about them.
Wes Exactly. And actually the best example would be the date versus no date argument. And the only reason I say that is because I've asked pretty much every micro brand owner that you guys can think of the exact same thing. I asked them what sells better date or no date. And it's almost always date. Even though the vocal minority are the ones that are like, can you guys just make a no date version? Just get a new dial, dick. Yeah. And then when we, when we do a no date version, like the Avalon, we see people coming back and asking for a date version. So it's one of those things where you can never please both sides. We just need to stick to our guns, give up as much as we can where it makes sense for the business, but retain as much as we can where it's still very much notice.
Everett So now are you suggesting that someone has said they don't like the date on the sector?
Wes Um, yes.
Andrew Give you his name and address. I'll find him. We'll beat him up for you guys.
Wes So actually, this is a funny story because we literally just talked about, um, our, our friend on the podcast that we just recorded. Um, I made him a promise. It must've been like two years ago, but our, our original model, the tree has had a date at four 30 and I made him a promise that we're never going to do that again. And we broke that promise. Yeah, we, we broke that promise and we did it knowingly. And the reason why is because I thought specifically about this guy. And, um, I knew that this kind of application. would make him proud and without even addressing it with him. I didn't, we, we didn't talk, we released the watch. I didn't send him any message. And sure enough, he placed an order for one, even though it had a day at four 30. So I guess we made him proud.
Andrew Is it because it's so subtle that he didn't notice it?
Unknown Like, is he going to get it in the mail and be like, you motherfuckers.
Wes I think, um, I think what it was is that he saw that it wasn't just an oversight, right? It's not, it's not like we just cut a hole in the dial to expose the date. We actually put a little bit of thought into it. We, to, to be honest with you, the original iteration of the sector dive did have the date at six o'clock, but that means we can't put the actual six there, the, the numeral itself. So it, to us, it looked like utter trash. So we were like, you know what, let's try to put it at four 30, but let's do it right this time. So shrunk the tech size a little bit. made it a porthole, put that little chamfer there just to hide it as much as we can. But when it's there, you need it. I think that's kind of the secret to a good date window. Either it's symmetrical so it hides itself or you have to do something to it so that it's there when you need it and it's not when you don't.
Everett Yeah, no, I think it's I think it's really it's really well executed. So one other design element I'd like to ask you about. And when we had when we had the Avalon in one of the one of our comments about it was we didn't we didn't love the fitment on the end links. The transition from the end link to the mid case really is, or to the lugs. And we know that other people in the community have given us similar feedback about that watch.
Andrew And also called us assholes about that feedback.
Everett Yes, people did call us assholes about that feedback. Take your pick. Here, you guys have, I think, almost gone in the totally other direction. Instead of having an ostensibly uneven transition. The transition from the end links to the case is so deliberate and so painstakingly done. Tell us about that process, because I think it's the most deliberate part of the case. I think it's maybe not the most obvious part of the case, but when you really get into this watch, it's such a deliberate application. Tell us about how you got there.
Wes Well, as far as the Avalon goes, I think One of the big challenges with the Avalon is that the case itself is already very complex, not just in terms of, um, the design, but the whole manufacturing process was pretty difficult. Uh, you know, that's why it took us two years to do it. The whole point of that kind of that lip that overhangs, I think that's what you're talking about, right? The, the lip in between the lug that overhangs a little bit that the, the whole point was to try to cover up if you're putting it on a rubber strap, because we know that a lot of divers after, after talking to a few divers, we know that Yeah, bracelets are cool, but sometimes it does make more sense to put it on rubber or to put it on NATO or something like that. So it was a lesser of two evils. We definitely could have made the end link fitment flush like it is on, uh, on the duality, for example, but it made more sense in terms of a function to have it so that you can switch out straps and still have it look, you know, some somewhat decent.
Everett Sure.
Wes Part of the,
Andrew Part of it, too, was the transition on the inside of the lugs. And I'm just trying to think back because it's been a while since we had that. But the way that you've integrated the end links into the case, and it's not integrated by any means, but the way that you've made those transitions such that this can go on rubber or nylon or this bracelet and it'll fit all of them perfectly. You guys knocked it out of the park with that. And that was the only And we're grasping at straws to find something we did not like about that watch. And that was, that was what we could come up with. It was just that one tiny little piece and it is wholly corrected.
Wes Right. I mean, I, and I appreciate that honesty. It really does help us. And, um, you know, not, not just from you guys, but from anyone that sends in messages, it really does go a long way. I think more so than people might think. Um, but moving forward from the Avalon, we knew that one of the things that we wanted to improve on was to bring our quality up. And that's not just in the way we make our dials and construct our dials and loom application, but it is in the things that are a little bit more dynamic, which for the most part, the case would probably be the most dynamic part of any, any watch. Right. Um, in terms of manufacturing. So. The sector came after the duality and correct me if I'm wrong. I don't think I'm remembering everything, uh, accurately, but I think the duality came before the sector and we were super happy with the way the duality fit. The, the, the one that actually made it to production, but what people don't know is that that's actually like the third or fourth prototype that we made. The original duality had that inner chamfer that you see on the sector.
Unknown Yeah.
Everett That's almost like a twist, almost like a twist.
Wes Yeah. It's like a, like a modern take on twisted lugs. So the original duality had that, but just because of how, um, how thin the lugs are, it just, it made it feel very dainty. It didn't really make sense with the design of a watch that was meant to be a professional diver. So we kind of got rid of it and it made the proportions all sorts of fucked up. But on this sector, Again, Grand Seiko, that was the main inspiration for us wanting to have a core DNA that's super versatile. And one thing that Grand Seiko does really well is adding all those crazy chamfers. So you can have a very sporty case, but you add a chamfer on the middle. Another brand that does it really well is Manta, right? They have that chamfer on the lugs and it makes, for all intents and purposes, a watch that's meant to be taken out into the field and beat up. It makes it possible to wear something like that at a wedding or at a fancier event. The ability to dress a watch up, that's way harder than being able to dress it down. So that's kind of what we were trying to channel with the sector. It's not so much about capability, it's more about intent. And the intent for the sector was just totally different from the Avalon.
Everett You know, uh, I've heard you guys talk about your prototyping process in the past. Um, I know with, you know, some of the earlier watches, there was a two or three prototype, uh, cycle. And then, and then with, with these sort of, um, newer watches, I understand that that, that number has gone up quite a bit for four or five prototypes. What does that look like? You get a first prototype. I mean, what, what types of things are you tweaking from prototype to prototype?
Colin The main thing about prototypes is that what you see on the 2D rendering, or what you design in the first place, really doesn't translate to real life. And you really don't really get that until you get experience. You don't realize what your 2D decisions will look like in 3D, in real life. So when we first started out, we would do multiple rounds, simply because we didn't have that knowledge or that experience. For example, like the Avalon, it's pretty well known that we went through multiple stages of prototyping simply because the case just didn't come out the way we wanted to, as well as the bezel proportions. So essentially, what we're finding with every iteration of prototypes is that the smallest change, whether it's a fraction of a millimeter, changes the largest of things. Um, and that's something that's quite hard to grasp at first, but once you get the experience and once you do it multiple times, you really start to understand, um, how that affects your design process.
Everett Um, so is, is the, is the degree of prototyping being affected by your experience and your, and your skill level and doing this?
Colin Uh, 100%, I would say, um, we're doing less prototyping now simply because we now know what to look for and we now know how to design around certain things. Whereas like if something, if we design something in 2D, say before, if we designed something in 2D, we would think it would come out looking like that in 3D, but it wouldn't. But nowadays we now know how to, how to go get around that hurdle and design something in 2D that will actually look like what it should be in real life. And that's, you know, something that we, really struggle with in the beginning, but I think that's, that's common with everyone who starts out, um, designing products like this. Um, but I can give you like an example, um, of proportions and something that like, didn't really work for us. And that was like the first iteration of the Avalon where the first prototype that came out, it just ended up looking really bulbous and like a plate. Um, and we needed to figure out why that was the case because in 2d renderings, it looked perfect. But then you realize, you know, in real life on the wrist with three, three dimensions, it's, uh, like there's more than just proportions. It's, it's, it's like lighting affects a lot of things, for example. So you then have, you have finishing that, that you need to take, uh, take account for. So like polished, uh, like polished edges on the bezel versus brushed, um, maybe even like a millimeter more of bezel material versus less. Like all of that stuff really affects the way it looks on your wrist in real life. And, uh, we've learned a lot from going through multiple iterations. And I think, uh, like now, like we've, we've kind of honed down on, on, on how to translate a 2d rendering into 3d, like, uh, accurately.
Everett Fantastic. Fantastic. So, uh, 2020, we're going to have, well, the, the duality was released in 2019, I guess. 2020 we've, say it again.
Wes Yeah, it was, uh, released in 2019. So technically it's a 2019 collection, but we intend for it to be a stable for this year. And, uh, like we really haven't even started the review circuit yet. I think Mike from two broke watch knobs has one and then average bros on YouTube did a review, but for the most part, we haven't really promoted it yet.
Everett And so we've got the duality. We've got this two sector, the field watch and the dive watch. Yeah. Um, we have, pending projects regarding a dress watch and a pilot watch. Are those 2020 releases or are those sort of end of year announcement rollout and then 2021 watches?
Wes No, it's going to be a 2020 release. We're going to get it out this year.
Everett Fantastic. Cannot wait to see this. This is going to be a big year for you guys.
Wes Yeah, we try to say that every year we want to every single year, we want to kind of up the standard that we're we're currently pushing.
Everett Anything besides these five watches that's in the kitchen getting toasty right now?
Andrew Yes. Is there bagel bites or something or what's going on?
Wes We're going to do a Contrail 2. Cool. So yeah, so we did the Contrail 1. It was When did we come up with that? I don't even remember now. It was 2018, the original one. 2019, we did a second version with the one piece bezel. Now we're going to redo the entire thing from the ground up for a proper reintroduction of the Contrail. As we mentioned on our first episode of Long Roads, we're working on a high-end luxury sport watch. Aesthetic. Yes, aesthetic. We're looking along the lines of AP or Patek. I'm Uh, well, I guess technically our set, we use the STP one 11 for the tree is again, it's a trial run. That's not our first watch. We don't want to talk about it ever again, but, uh, just joking. But, um, yeah, we, we want to start using Swiss movements again. So we're currently in talks with a couple of Swiss companies about sourcing their stuff. Um, we may or may not do our first GMT proper GMT. Again, we're talking to movement suppliers on, on what we can get from them. But for now, that's the plan. We're going to do the two sectors, the contrail. I think we're going to be able to get the GMT out. We have one or two surprises that we're holding back that we don't want to talk too much about, but it's not like a totally new model. It's just kind of a limited edition on something that we've put out that we'll talk about in probably like a month or two. Yeah.
Everett Cool.
Wes Yes. It's going to be a busy year, but it's not going to be any busier than last year's. We're going to try to maintain the pace that we have right now.
Everett Well, so one of our, one of our predictions for one of our predictions for 2020 was that this is going to be the year of, um, micro GMT, the micro GMTs. And I know you guys aren't a big fan of that, that word, but, but we use it. Um, but yeah, you know, the boutique GMT watch, I think is going to be a thing this year. So I'm excited to, to hear you guys are throwing your hat into that, into that ring.
Wes Yeah. It largely depends on the movement itself, right? We don't have access to that many movements. And of the ones that we do have access to, there are certain design flaws that Colin and I don't really feel comfortable working with. Um, you know, and it's not like we worked with it before, but a lot of our friends in the industry that have worked with these GMT movements, they've told us to try to stay away from it if possible.
Everett And are we talking like 2893 or 330-1, um, these movements or, or specific movements?
Wes Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Those are actually the exact movements we're talking about. And yeah, those are the only movements that we have access to. But, um, you know, I think what, what was the brand that did the so proud one?
Colin There was, um, so like another option that we've looked into that's quite intriguing. is the new SOPRA GMT. So like Mercer, they've been, they're using it in their upcoming models. And then Ocean Crawler has used it in one of their new models that they just came out with. And then Okanosker was like the first to use the SOPRA GMT movement. So I don't know, like if that's, I mean, that's obviously that's a, that's an option for us, but we don't know how reliable it's going to be or There's just not enough data on it, like whether or not to use it.
Wes Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So we've been talking about a GMT for a long time, but we haven't done it because we want to have a little bit more experience kind of, you know, actually working with the movement itself rather than hearing anecdotal evidence from from some of our fellow micro brand owners.
Everett You know, I really like that. I really like that Mercer GMT.
Wes Mercer is one of the best, I think in terms of design, is one of the best micro brands that have ever been around. I know they kind of pivoted. They're doing more leather stuff now, but in terms of just pure design aesthetic, my God, they're fucking, they're crazy good.
Colin The new GMT that they have, I think it's called the Nomad. It's so nice.
Everett You know, it does that thing where it makes you feel really... It feels really familiar. It feels really familiar, which, you know, I guess that could be an homage type of discussion, but it's not an homage, right? Or maybe it is in the more colloquial sense of the word, but it feels really familiar and good, but also new and different and unique.
Andrew I think because it is so... simple. There's nothing that makes it stand out as a GMT. It could just as easily be a three-hand kind of field-inspired watch, but they integrated a GMT into it, and they did it super simply.
Unknown Yeah.
Colin I think they did a really good job along the lines of the Chris Ward C65 GMT and the Grand Seiko SBGN, like, The 9F GMT series, where it's like an explorer to homage, but it's an homage in the truest sense where it's not a copy, but it's merely a tribute where it has some characteristics, but it's its own thing by itself.
Wes It has its own identity.
Everett It's been inspired as opposed to actually aping the source material.
Colin Yeah, you got the steel bezel, like the black dial on the orange hand, but everything else is quite different. So it's, it's super awesome.
Everett I will say their white dial is called polar white.
Wes Hmm. Oh, okay. Sounds familiar. It sounds like Rolex.
Everett It is called, it is called polar white. So, uh, well gents, I hate to do this, but we're going to have to sort of wrap up the conversation. Cause we're going to, we're, we're approaching getting long in the tooth tonight. Um, Can I can I give you guys just a few minutes to wrap on anything that you guys want to talk about?
Wes Yes. So watch podcasts, they usually start with a risk check, but I'm kind of curious what you guys are wearing right now. So let's we can end the podcast on a risk check this time.
Everett Well, why don't you start? I'm wearing I'm wearing a watch, kind of a newer company. I've been around for about three years called Notice. It's a sector. It's the carbon dialed sector. dive watch. It's fantastic. You can hear 120 clicks. So yeah, I'm wearing the sector. Andrew was wearing the sector when he got here and I was wearing an EMG Nemo.
Andrew I have this thing where when I record, I actually take my watch off. It's it's super bizarre. I'm rarely ever without a watch, but right as soon as we start recording, unless we're recording a podcast, I take it off. But I so I came here and I returned your watch to to Everett. Uh, and I, uh, I've got on the, the black EMG Nemo because Eric sent us the whole collection of Nemo's, uh, barring the yellow. And I think it's because we already had the yellow, but we've got the whole color lineup. So I've got the black on well on it's on my hand. I don't wear watches when we record. I don't get it. I don't it's whatever.
Wes So out of all the Nemo's I have to ask, which one's your favorite?
Andrew You know, we were talking about that literally before we came into the office. Cause we were just standing over them. We weren't even wearing them. We're just, hovering over them staring. And I, um, I think I tend towards the blue.
Everett And I think I'm a, I think I'm a Boba Fett man. Although the white, the white, it's good. The white's really good too.
Andrew So I think I'd like a stainless bezel on the white.
Colin I think that would, Oh, that'd be nice. I think that'd get it for me.
Wes I actually have a Nemo too. I have the yellow one. So that's my favorite.
Colin Where is that? I haven't seen it in a long time.
Andrew I did not expect to like the yellow as much as I did. I loved that yellow Nemo. I wore it a lot when, uh, when he let us keep it for way too long. We went to Mexico with it.
Wes Mine is beat to shit. I, uh, I sent it out, but yeah, you know, just for some friends on Instagram to play around with, but, um, up until I sent it out, that was kind of the watch I was wearing for like three weeks straight. I love it.
Everett You know, I think between this sector and the Nemo, when people ask us, what dive watch for an affordables collector? These two watches. I just don't think that there's anything else. There really isn't. Right now for guys like us, with our taste, obviously divers come in many different flavors, but we both tend towards the smaller, more compact, you know, skin diver, if you will. And I think these two watches, the Nemo and this Sektor, you guys are, you know, between you and EMG, just, I think you should own that market.
Wes Thank you very much. That means a lot. As for what's on my wrist right now, I'm actually wearing the Sektor Field Vapor on a Erika's original, sort of like the classic green with the yellow pinstripe.
Everett It's a great combo. Yeah. That original pair of military. And Cullen, what are you wearing?
Colin Yeah. I am wearing, I'm double, double fist, double wristing. Sorry, not double fisting, double wristing. On my right, on my left wrist is the Seiko Marine Master. It's the MM300, the really thick, thick with two C's dive watch.
Andrew I think it might even be three C's. Two thick, girl.
Colin But I'm a skinny boy with two ends, so it's a good... Variety is good for life, right?
Everett Yeah. That's a killer watch, by the way. It's on my, the next time I get hit by a car list.
Andrew Oh, it's... I close my eyes before I walk into the road, just in case, just on a hope.
Colin And then on the other wrist is actually the prototype of the Contrail 2. So That's, you know, we'll just leave it at that. How is it? It's good. It's very good.
Everett And so when you guys are prototyping, do you regularly wear two watches? The one the one you want to be wearing that day and then the prototype watch?
Wes Yeah, yeah. We try to wear the prototype as much as we can. And then, you know, after a couple of weeks when we've kind of gathered our thoughts and, you know, send feedback to each other, we do send it out to some insiders that, you know, they kind of lend their thoughts on design and quality. So we send it back out to these guys. It's a really small group of guys from Instagram that we met. Uh, and if you follow us on Instagram, you probably know exactly who they are. Cam and Jake. Yeah. Um, yeah, they, they lend a huge help for us when we're really trying to formulate what makes this watch special. So we wore it for a bit, send it out to them, get their thoughts. And then after that, we, Send all that over to our engineers and start production.
Everett Awesome. Awesome. So this is the time of the episode where we transition into other things we like. I've been told by Colin that you guys have other things.
Unknown Mm hmm.
Everett We're going to kick it off. Andrew, what's your other thing for this week?
Andrew My other thing, as per usual, is a television show. And it is it. This is the first time I've ever experienced this. I found a show that was streaming. I started watching it and I liked it. And I watched the whole season. I was like, holy fucking shit. I'm going to get in the next season and watch the whole second season. And then it ends. But it didn't end because the show got canceled. I have never liked a television show that got canceled before it ended. So I'm on this huge cliffhanger of what's going to happen next. And it's over. And there will never be an answer. And the show is called Outsiders. And it was one of WGN's like first original shows. And evidently it didn't do very well. But it kind of had the kind of Sons of Anarchy feel where you've got these antiheroes, but also kind of the Justified feel where you're in Appalachia. And the whole conflict surrounds these mountain people who live on the mountain. And this coal company is coming in to blow the mountain and mine all their coal. And it's the conflict between these mountain men who you hate, but you also kind of love, like a very anti-hero show, which is the, the, the trend of the time in, in TV right now. But the problem is that I really liked the show. The acting was good. The story got a little bit stale, but they, they kept it moving and it was just enjoyable. It was, it was actors you recognized, even if you didn't know where from, uh, and I liked it, but now it's gone. And I will never have resolution. And I'm the kind of person I need resolution of things.
Everett You should write fanfic.
Andrew I would like I've suffered through shows I no longer enjoyed for the purpose of finishing it. I watched True Blood, man. I watched all of them. That was good. True Blood was really good. I mean, I was deployed at the time, so that's my excuse. You watched it here. It wasn't good. Not at all. Like after season three, you're like, God, this is bad, but I'm going to finish it. But Outsiders. Don't watch it, because you're gonna like it, and you're not gonna get resolution. Avoid it. It's on Hulu. Don't watch it.
Everett Don't watch it. Did you ever watch that HBO series Luck?
Unknown No.
Everett It was just one season, and it was really good. It was really good. But they kept killing horses, and so they canceled it because... What? Yeah, they kept killing horses. It was a show about racehorsing. Racehorsing? Racehorsing. Horse racing.
Andrew Is that a euphemism?
Everett Horse racing. No, literally horse racing. And yeah, the horses kept dying. And so they canceled the show. Like during the course of filming? Yes. PETA didn't like it. Other people didn't like it. They canceled the show.
Andrew Do race horses die?
Everett Yes, a lot.
Andrew I mean, besides like getting put down, I didn't realize they died over the course of their racing. Yeah, they die. It's really hard for them.
Wes Racing. We don't have time to watch TV.
Colin Aren't they being roided up?
Andrew Yeah, they get juiced and stuff.
Everett They're juiced and they have like abnormally large hearts. And yeah. Yeah. So well, well, so my other thing is also a show.
Unknown OK.
Everett Shocker. That's all we do. I mean, I have an excuse. We should just change the section to what we're watching. Yeah. TV shows we like. My my other thing is a show called Witcher. Oh, yeah.
Wes Witcher. That's with Superman, right?
Everett With Superman. Yeah, that's right. It's good. With Henry Cavill. So I don't know. It is good. It's compelling. It's bad, though. It's bad. And it's really, really hard to follow at first. Yeah. The first episode is borderline in a different language, even when you know it's in English, because some of it is in another language.
Andrew I don't hear well, so I always have subtitles on.
Everett I mean, it's just like, what are you talking about right now?
Andrew And it was a cold start. You get dropped into it. There is no buildup, no introduction.
Everett hey, we're here, but then you get into it and then you sort of start to make connections and you sort of, and now, now I really want to watch it. Now I'm like borderline wanting to stop recording so I can go watch an episode.
Andrew You can wait. You're probably gonna have to wait for Kim, aren't you?
Everett Yeah. Yeah.
Andrew I, uh, yes, you should. That would be ill advised to not.
Everett Okay. The Witcher. Fantastic. You should watch it. Wes. Other thing. Go.
Wes So I'm actually dabbling with nootropics. I'm not sure if you're familiar what that is. With what? Nootropics.
Andrew Is that like a health supplement?
Wes It is a supplement. It's basically for the brain. So I've been taking lion's mane mushroom a lot lately. Dabbling with cordyceps and reishi for various different effects.
Andrew And psilocybin.
Everett This is like a Ken Kesey thing.
Wes So those that know me well know I'm a big fan of Kevin Rose. He's the guy behind Digg. But he started a podcast and he recently moved out to Oregon. He's like an investor dude. He's way smarter than we are.
Colin He invested in Watch Bill, right?
Wes He actually was, I think he was one of the guys that started it and then bought by Houdinki or whatever. So I'm a big fan of him. He kind of stepped away from the watch game a little bit and went into the whole tech entrepreneurship recently moved to Portland, Oregon and he started growing his own mushrooms. And they're all like, they're all nootropic mushrooms.
Everett As you do in Portland. Yeah.
Wes Right. Um, so he's been having, he has his own podcast. So he's been having a lot of guests on who are specialists in kind of natural remedies, which I, I tried not to talk too much about because when you think about like Eastern medicine, you're thinking, you know, snake oil, for the most part, all of these doctors are from the U S and they've, they actually do proper studies and see the actual health benefits and they gather real data. Um, as opposed to the Eastern practice, which is more anecdotal. Um, so I've been, I've been trying to experiment a little bit with the stuff that he's been talking about and you know, some stuff is, I think I don't feel anything, so I have to believe it's bullshit, but there are some things like lines main, for example, that I do feel like my sentences form a little bit better. Probably not when I'm when I'm drunk. So we just did a podcast. We've been having a little bit of alcohol, so it's not really working right now. But for the most part, taking taking some lines mean every morning, it helps my brain kind of screw on a little bit straighter. So I've been dabbling in that, doing a lot more research and reading white papers on that.
Andrew So I lions mean a mushroom or are you like are they out there like shaving lions in Africa?
Wes No, it's it's a mushroom.
Andrew OK, I'm down with either, just to be clear.
Everett And and do you get high?
Wes No, you don't get high. It's not the high type of mushroom. Boo. Pass. It's not. Yeah, it's not the psilocybin type, which I think has its own benefits. But we can get into that in another episode. Yeah.
Everett All right. Well, I did not expect to be talking about experimental mushroom use on this episode. So that's that's a plus. Colin, other thing.
Colin What do you got? I'll steer the conversation back to TV shows. Fantastic. That's our conversation.
Everett We just sigh of relief.
Colin Yeah. So, uh, the good place, uh, so it's about to end season four. Um, but the finale is coming up. So, uh, I've been following, following that really closely. It's a fricking awesome TV show.
Everett Do you think they're going to be able to, do you think they're going to be able to bring it together in any sort of coherent sense?
Colin I, I, I have a lot of faith in Michael Schur cause he's, I loved all his, his TV shows. So I think he'll do, you know, a fantastic ending, but, uh, a happy ending, a good ending, a good place ending. So yeah, uh, I'm pretty excited, uh, to see what happens. I haven't gone around to watching the first episode of, of when they just came back.
Andrew So, uh, I just watched it when it, when it came out on Thursday. Very good. This is, it's one of my favorite TV shows. It's been on network television.
Colin It's, it's, it's, it's awesome. Like who, who, who are you? Uh, who's your favorite character?
Andrew Ooh, Favorite character has got to be Jason because Jason is is an absolute moron, but he's like this wild card like. He doesn't just bring comedic relief, he brings a superhuman, not superhuman, but a really human aspect to it where all these other characters are. They have a really clear purpose and he's just there. He's just there to bro down and blow shit up. And I love that that part of it because everything else is so deliberate and he's you just don't know what you're going to get out of that guy.
Everett Yeah. I think he's objectively the best character on the show. Yeah. I think my favorite part about that show is how, you know, really each season they have to sort of completely rewrite the rules of the universe. You know, I can't think of another show quite like that, where it's the same, it's the same thing that's happening, but in a completely different universe. You know, new rules, Uh, new dynamics, you know, power dynamics. Uh, I think that's really fun. I think they've done a really good job with it so far.
Colin Yeah. I'm, I'm just, can't wait for the ending.
Andrew Get on the Hulu, watch it.
Colin I'm going to do that tonight actually, like right after this.
Andrew Enjoy.
Everett Well, gentlemen, we're going to wrap. Anything else you want to add before we go? Um,
Wes No, just, uh, thank you guys. I want you guys to know that you contributed more than you think with, especially with the sector field. You, uh, I know like just to be transparent, you guys didn't have any say in, uh, in like specific design features, but again, back to that podcast you guys had, it really made us think a little bit harder. And I think that's a demonstration of how important it is, uh, for people like you to do the things that you're doing. Uh, I just, I want you guys to know that. Not only us, but other people are listening. people are creating and designing. We're all paying attention to the stuff that you guys are saying. So, so yeah, thank you guys for the work you do.
Everett Well, thank you so much for saying that. And thank you guys for the work you do. Speaking of which, tell these people who are listening today who maybe don't know how the Google machine works, how to find you.
Wes Instagram is our favorite at notice watches. That's N O D U S watches. We just started a new podcast called Long Roads. So that's Long Roads podcast on Instagram.
Everett Which is a ton of fun. That first episode I listened to really well done you guys.
Wes There's a lot more debauchery that's going to come after that. So don't don't get your hopes up. We have our own Instagrams as well. Mine is Wes underscore Kwok. W-E-S underscore K-W-O-K.
Colin And Cullen's is... C-U-L-L-E-N-C-H. Cullench. Cullench.
Everett Cullench.
Wes You know, so Instagram is our favorite, but you guys can reach us on email or through our website forum. We're the guys behind the keys. So just if you email us through our website, we're the ones that reply. Facebook, Instagram, that's all still us.
Everett And obviously if someone wants to buy a watch, noticewatches.com.
Wes Yeah, but don't buy a watch. It's not worth it. Go to someone else.
Andrew Or do and then send it to us.
Wes Or do and send it to you guys. Yeah. Give us give us a good review.
Everett Yeah. All right, you guys, thank you so much for joining us. And thank you for joining us for another episode of 40 and 20. Check us out on Instagram at 40 and 20. Also, check us out on Patreon.com. That's where we get the support for the show. A very small donation on a monthly basis from you actually helps us pay for hosting, pay for the ideas that makes Notice Watches come to life. Don't forget to tune back in next Thursday for another hour of watches, food, drinks, life, and other things we like.
Unknown Buh-bye.
Wes Farewell.