The Grey NATO – 321 – CWC & The CWN1 With Malcolm Bliss
Published on Thu, 06 Mar 2025 06:00:00 -0500
Synopsis
In this episode of The Gray NATO podcast, hosts discuss winter weather conditions before diving into their main topic - an interview with Malcolm Bliss from CWC (Cabot Watch Company). The interview covers the history of CWC, its connection to Silverman's military surplus business, and details about their recent collaboration on the CWN1 titanium dive watch. Malcolm shares fascinating stories about the company's military watch heritage, including buying surplus watches by the hundreds in the 1980s. He discusses the challenges of creating their first titanium watch for the TGN collaboration and reveals plans for future titanium models. The hosts also cover their personal updates, including Jason's start in Krav Maga classes and James' first chiropractic experience. The episode concludes with their "Final Notes" segment discussing recent content from Watches of Espionage and a nature documentary about polar bears in Churchill, Manitoba.
Links
Transcript
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| Jason Heaton | Hello and welcome to another episode of The Gray NATO, a loose discussion of travel, adventure, diving, driving, gear, and most certainly watches. This is episode 321 and it's proudly brought to you by the always growing TGN supporter crew. We thank you all so much for your continued support. And if you'd like to support the show, please visit thegraynato.com for more details. My name is Jason Heaton and I'm joined as ever by my friend and co-host in wintry Toronto, James Stacey. James, uh, we're still in the thick of it here, aren't we? |
| James Stacey | Uh, it's different. It's a different zone here, man. It is a very rainy. I think the snow will rain pretty soon. It's been pouring for not pouring, but like it's been raining pretty hard for two days now. Uh, it's keeping the Jeep clean, which is nice. I'm seeing, I'm seeing, you know, elements of body panels and the damage they're in, uh, that I haven't seen since the snow came. We're at seven degrees celsius which is uh yeah we're in the we're shooting into the towards the 50s here yeah um which is nice uh but it is raining pretty solidly so that's a little bit less fun but yeah as far as our very important weather updates i think you're having a tougher time than i am uh it's i was shoveling for a while and then i saw a picture of you shoveling in what looked like a you know like a base camp three suit from heli hansen |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, we got a full on blizzard last night, you know, and our winters have changed so much in the past decade. I mean, two winters ago, we had a lot of snow, but last winter was a non event. And then up until now, we just had the little bits here and there. And this was a proper, proper snowstorm. And the sad thing is, is that it's, it's enough to enjoy for maybe 24 hours, but then it's supposed to get above freezing tomorrow and then be super warm on the weekend. So it's going to be an absolute. And I say this as a recent dog owner, it's going to be an absolute mud pit in the backyard and I'm going to be wiping paws, you know, like many times a day. Oh man. |
| James Stacey | I mean, watching clips of Ruby like go Tasmanian devil in your backyard, I can't imagine the amount of mud she must be able to move around. It's going to be a mess. Like having a little excavator. There's something so funny about a dog in the mud, though. It just delights me. They're having such a good time. |
| Jason Heaton | And we went for our morning walk this morning and she's oblivious to the weather. She's totally immune to the cold, doesn't care. And I've got these Boggs boots, you know, they're like kind of Wellies, you know, neoprene knee-high boots. And I'm wearing that full foul weather suit from Helly Hansen and we head out for a walk. And, you know, we got a foot of snow and it's like we're both postholing and she's Not a big dog, you know, and I'm like, she's just bounding, you know, leaping through the snow, and I'm just trudging along. It was such a workout, so. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | But, and then, of course, shoveling, so. But anyway, enough of the weather. |
| James Stacey | All of that, for sure. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, look, aside from your massive blizzard, I would say, from my side, the weather is mostly keeping me inside, but I am thrilled that when I go outside, I don't have to scrape the car, and it doesn't take the Jeep, you know, 35 full minutes before it willingly goes into fourth gear. It'll go, it just doesn't stay. It likes to just wiggle its way out as you let the clutch out. So all things that you deal with with a somewhat older vehicle. How's your week been otherwise? You've started a new sort of physical practice, I see? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, it's something I've wanted to do for for a couple of years and decided to kind of take the plunge. |
| James Stacey | We talked about this years and years ago when I was still in Vancouver. |
| Jason Heaton | I think, yeah, yeah. Has it been that long? Wow. I started taking Krav Maga classes. Krav Maga is a nice Israeli derived, I think it was kind of their military or special forces something or other kind of self-defense or martial art program or practice or discipline. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, Musad close quarter combat formatting. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And there's a gym in town called Krav Maga Minneapolis that specializes in it, and they've been doing it for over a decade. It's a husband and wife that own it, and they've got a few instructors. So I took my first class last week. I skipped this week, not to give too much information, but I had to purchase some groin protection. Um, before I could take another class and that arrived a little late and then we had the blizzard last night. So I thought I'd wait a week, but, uh, yeah, I'll be, I'll be back next week. They offer a number of classes a week and it was fun. It was, it was really fun. I've, I've, I've had an interest in it for years, as I mentioned. And I think it's because as martial arts go, it's not set up for kind of competition. There isn't really a spiritual element to it. You know, it, it, it's really all about, like you said, close quarter self-protection. combat, and I say that more like self-protection, self-defense, and it relies largely on your own instincts on how to move if you're being confronted or attacked and not in a way of like winning a fight, but winning enough to get out of the situation. And I kind of like that. And there's a physical element to it that is a little more blunt than graceful, I would say. And, you know, look, I've only taken one class, so I can't speak that intelligently about it, but so far so good. So I'm going to keep up with that. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I mean, I would highly suggest if somebody's curious, one, this is a great, it was very popular in the years that I was in Vancouver. There was a couple gyms. I know we talked about it probably pre-episode 100. And the other thing that I was told by a practitioner, I don't know that this is accurate to the original format of the practice, is that there's not really like a top. It's not like you become a black belt and you're done. uh you you just always kind of keep training and then he you know i they i was being sent links to videos of like people actively training like how to fire a sidearm off the back of a motorcycle oh i was like okay that sounds amazing yeah it's about as useful to me as a healing escape valve but Yeah, right, but yeah, it's a that's a good one. I mean if there's a gym nearby I would definitely be be Interested I've been googling That and boxing in areas gyms in my area Oh, yeah, just as just something to get me out of the house and doing doing a little bit of stuff Yeah, you know kind of on the opposite and end of the cool spectrum from starting Krav Maga I had my first ever chiropractor appointment |
| Jason Heaton | Well, I might be going for one if I keep up with this Krav Maga, you never know. And how did it go? |
| James Stacey | It went well, yeah. Largely, they said I'm not as banged up as they might have expected. I'm nearly 40, and probably those years I spent in Vancouver, essentially just waking up to work out and run, I'm maybe still getting the benefits from. But in the last six months or so, and lots of you listening will know that I do comment on kind of my workload these days being kind of high. I just sit at a desk all day. And a couple weeks ago, I started actually tracking it and like it is about nine hours a day at the desk. And I tried to alternate between sitting and standing, but I was still getting this really intense pain kind of off the right side of my back, right shoulder. So I thought I would try and be proactive. To be clear, this is the first medical professional I've seen in 20 years outside of a dentist. I borderline have a phobia of stuff like hospitals and doctors and that sort of thing. It's very much an area of discomfort for me. And I had an absolutely awesome experience yesterday. The doctor was amazing. He did a very straightforward assessment. He showed me what the joints look like. It was very much like a science class. I had a good time. He's a nice guy. And then I had my first ever like proper massage along with it. And I feel good, feel loose, feel a little younger. I definitely have some stretching and probably his main recommendation for somebody with my relative just tightness across my body, but no actual damage to speak of, is yoga. So probably going to try and start a bit of a yoga practice. Those Jean Vigues videos I used to recommend, they're all still online. Oh yeah, right. Yeah, just trying not to be... I mean, my posture's real bad. and sometimes I see it in a video like it looks fine from the front and then from the video you go like wait why is he like why is his head that far forward what's up with that guy's shoulder one's higher definitely higher than the other and so we're gonna work on that and we'll see how it goes but uh yeah the the so much sitting dude |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Yeah. That's tough. And I'm, I'm a big, I've become a big convert to chiropractic care and kind of, I guess what you'd consider alternative medicines or practices or alternative in the way that, you know, they're not so far afield that, you know, people are rolling their eyes in a chiropractor. |
| James Stacey | Like an acupuncture or something? Cupping? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. But, you know, I mentioned I did dry needling a while back and that was something that my chiropractor actually, um, uh, administered and, and she's been great. I've gone to her a few times. She's helped me with my, I had some vertigo issues. She's helped me with runner's knee. Um, you know, I used to just think chiropractic care was just for your back and your neck. But, um, one thing I've appreciated is this, um, what I, I don't know if it's the right term, but sort of assisted stretching and mobility where, you know, she'll do a back adjustment, but then kind of have me do certain stretches and then assist and invite, you know, pushing a little further beyond what I could do. And that's been really nice. And then there's a great massage therapist in the same building. So I get kind of this all-in-one help there occasionally when I need it. And it's been great. So I'm glad you're into that. Is that going to become a regular thing? Do you have a few appointments lined up? |
| James Stacey | I think so, yeah. So it'll be a couple times a week for the next little while until I show that I'm absorbing what he's suggesting and that sort of thing. And then the bigger issue, and those of you who have known me and hung out, is I have fairly bad TMJ. So I clench my jaw, and if I'm angry or stressed, I do it a lot more. And if I'm not sleeping well, it just gets progressively worse. he was able to show me a few things that I could do myself as far as like therapies. I'm pretty sensitive as far as the hearing goes. I have my TMJ feed tinnitus in my ears. And so after a couple of these sort of stretches and massages that he was able to show me, it's definitely quieter. So I'm gonna definitely focus on that kind of stuff. But Well, I mean deep down it's attempting to not put myself in a scenario where my stress is like caught like an anchor That's holding me back from things. I want to do right. I don't mind being stressed. This is life Yeah, but I do mind that if it ends up being like a pathological. |
| Jason Heaton | I I think to myself that you could almost trace the our growing history in TGN through our medical ailments. And I bet somebody like Tom Place probably knows better than anything, not only through his own, you know, beating up his body through his stunt work, but just he's listened to, you know, TGN episodes multiple times going back to the beginning. And we can kind of trace our aging and our different medical ailments over the years as we've gotten older and grown through the podcast. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, for sure. I mean, absolutely. Yeah. Same with fitness. It comes and goes, and you and I are on different phases. Yeah, right. Look, we've talked about derivation. None of this was written down at the top. But look, we've got a great show today. We had an incredible... We just finished the sit-down with Mal from CWC to give us kind of a background on CWC, what they're working on, and of course, our partnership with them to create our own watch. And I think on that topic, why don't we jump into wrist check? Because it's pretty straightforward. I'm not wearing anything else. Yeah, yeah. I put it back on the, I've got my CWN1, I have it on the stock NATO because I thought that made sense for the talk, but I've really just been, sometimes multiple times a day, and I see this on the slack so I don't feel bad, but multiple times a day I'll change the strap. And it's so easy. I mean there's no, there's no tool involved. Oh, it's simple. Yeah, for sure. But I've got those RDX straps, the Redux ones we talked about last week, and I just keep switching between them. Yeah. The leather's really nice. The extreme, I really, really like. And then I've got, I got it like a yellow version of their paratrooper style. Oh, right. It's an open, what I would call it, I guess we'll call it open loop paratrooper, unlike the Erica's, which are captive. But it's the comfort level is very good. And I don't know the the titanium for me, and it obviously comes down to personal preference alone. The titanium really just looks so cool on on like a warm yellow. Oh, yeah, color. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've been I've also been wearing Obviously the CWN one on a redux strap. I've had mine on this Horween for a while and it's it's cool. It has the kind of the Hints of the printing that came from that the tannery, you know, you can see where the last part of the word cordovan Oh, yeah is on there and some other text and whatever and it's it's it's it's already starting to patina a little bit as I'm just wearing it a lot and Yeah, like you I just can't take this watch off and I've tried the other day. I pulled out the the old Navitimer and I think I had it on for four hours and you know, great watch, but took it off. I wore the Pelagos for a day over the weekend thinking I'd give that a go because that's got to be my one month watch according to our tournament, but I'm going to hold off on that for a while. But yeah, it's the CWN1 for me, not only because I love the watch, but because of our main topic today. Yep. Awesome episode with Malcolm Bliss from CWC themselves. I mean, what a cool thing to have him on. And he mentioned that it's just not something he does. So I feel like this is like a first. It was their first kind of titanium watch and his first appearance on a podcast. So we feel very honored about that. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I agree. I think it was a really good chat. I had only conversed with Mal over email. Obviously, you've met Mal and have had more time to develop a relationship with him. And just so warm, so just exactly kind of what you were hoping for like a family guy that runs a family watch brand and then obviously the Silverman's connection. We get into the history, we get into the kind of the backstory to the CWN one. Don't worry, we don't go too hard. And then we also talk a little bit about the future of CWC working with titanium. So I know for those of you who are listening, who, you know, either didn't want the CWN one, which is fine, or weren't able to get one because of the, you know, the week long pre-order and maybe you missed it. Uh, there is, uh, you know, uh, a timeline presented in the chat for the presence of a, of a kind of standard catalog titanium diver from, from CWC, which is exciting. So why don't we jump to the tape? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, let's do it. Okay, well, Malcolm Bliss from CWC. This feels like an episode we've been waiting to do for about a year or more, maybe. So Mal, welcome to The Gray NATO. Really good to have you. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Well, thank you very much for having me on here. It's taken a while, and this is the first podcast we've done, so very, very excited to do it, actually. |
| Jason Heaton | Well, I think, you know, CWC is one of those brands that, that has grown in reputation and kind of renown over the past few years. And I think it's still exists. I don't want to say in the shadows, but, um, as a mystery brand to a lot of people and a well-kept secret. So this will be a bit of a coming out party for. for you and we're looking forward to chatting not only about CWC but also our collaborative watch. I think that's what everybody really wants to hear about. Yeah, that's been fantastic. Before we get into the new watch, maybe you can go back a bit and tell us about your history with your brother Richard and your late father, I'm sorry, who passed away recently. Condolences for that. And kind of the family history with Silvermans and with CWC and how that all came about. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Well, there's a lot of history there. My grandfather, who was heading up a factory in Wales, he was sent there by the MOD to head up a factory making bow for guns during the war. So the family moved down there. After the war, they came back and, um, my grandfather had an interest in lots of different, uh, things, um, antiques and I suppose, uh, an interest in, in the military equipment and, um, started buying and selling, you know, the surplus steam mob, um, clothing. Um, and, uh, it kind of built from there really. This was your grandfather. This was my grandfather. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Now, was this on your mother's side? I'm interested in the name Silverman versus your last name is Bliss. What's the origin of the Silverman's name? |
| Malcolm Bliss | I think my grandfather at the time went into partnership with a guy called Silverman. And my grandfather, he had a heart condition, had a major heart attack at a football match one day, was taken very ill, couldn't work. And at the time, I believe my grandmother went to a meeting with the solicitors to sign over the business to Silverman. And he was fully expecting to pay my grandmother off. And it turned out that she decided she wanted to keep the business and went into the meeting and said, well, no, we're going to pay you off and made him an offer he couldn't refuse. And we ended up with the business called Silverman's. |
| Jason Heaton | Okay. All right. And then that was passed down to your father, right? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah, well, my father was at school and he was studying medicine, wanted to be a doctor. But as my grandfather was so ill and couldn't work, he came into the business very early, 16, 17, and carried on. Wow. |
| Jason Heaton | Well, I had the pleasure of meeting your father when I was over there. a few years ago, you gave me this great tour of the business there on Mile End Road. And your father was there in the back room, you know, chatting up a storm with everybody there. And he was such a kind old fellow. Yeah, he was great. Yeah. And when did you and Richard then get involved with Silverman's? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Uh, well, I came into the business, um, around about 17, 18, um, and learned from the ground up really. Um, the business was certainly not what it is today. It was very much, you know, army surplus. Um, that was our roots. And as surplus became less and less available, we started buying new military equipment. And we had various contracts with the military supplying all manner of boots, clothing, and We were, at the time, buying a lot of equipment from the government. They had auctions all over the country. And my father didn't particularly like traveling, so he used to send me off with a budget and come back with the best kit I could buy for the money. That's how it really developed. At that time, the government was selling off, um, military watches. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I remember, I remember you telling me something, this, this blew my mind. You've got to, you got to talk about the, yeah, this is like the mil subs that were sold on just a ring from a ring. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Don't get me going, Jason. The amount of Rolexes and Omegas and Hamiltons that have passed through my hands that were just of no interest at the time. There was no internet, there was no Instagram, there was more interest in the G10s and the more accessible watches. So we were buying them on rings and wires, sort of a hundred at a time. taking parts from one, you know, making out of a hundred watches, we may get 20 or 30 good ones. And, you know, for us, it was, you know, it was interesting. It was quite a good way to, you know, sell watches. And there was quite a, always been a big interest in CWC as, you know, historic military watch. So, Yeah, we did quite well with those. |
| Jason Heaton | Wait, to be clear, when you said you would buy 100 watches and then you piece together, you're able to make up 20 good ones. What brand watches are we talking? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Which ones? Mostly CWC, but there was Persisters, there was Hamilton's, there were even some of the old WWWs, there was Vertex, there was Amigas. But, you know, mostly at that time, we're talking sort of mid to late eighties, they were mostly the CWCs because, you know, that was all the contracts that were being fulfilled at the time. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And did that lead then to the connection with CWC? Because when did Silverman's become, when did you become involved or your father become involved with CWC? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Well, we couldn't find CWC. He, um, Mr. Miller, just, he, you know, he didn't really want to be found. He was, he wasn't in the phone book. |
| Jason Heaton | He, uh, he, he had to, this is just to be clear, this is Ray Malor, who was the founder of CWC. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Pre-Instagram, you couldn't just stalk his page, I guess. |
| Malcolm Bliss | No, you couldn't. We had a big contract with a clothing manufacturer. We were buying a lot of new military kit. And they had a contract with a Kenyan military contract. And they said to us one day, you know, do you want to buy some watches because we've got a contract for Kenya and we can supply you? So we said yes and turned out to be CWC watches. So we were buying indirectly, you know, new watches from Ray. And that carried on for a good while, a few years, until the government decided they were starting to buy offshore, cutting cost, you know, and this company that we were buying from shut down their military operations, their military factories. And at the time they gave us Ray's details. Yeah. We said, we can't supply you anymore. Here's his number, best of luck really. So we got in contact and for a while we were buying directly from Ray and selling new watches. |
| Jason Heaton | Directly to the MOD or was this publicly? |
| Malcolm Bliss | We were to the public and he was still supplying to the MOD. Round about what year was this? This would have been late 80s, early 90s. It was when the government was starting to try clothing from China and boots from Europe rather than from buying from the UK. With this carried on for a while, we were buying and we got on very well. And then he became unwell. He had heart problems. He had a heart triple bypass and he felt that he couldn't continue the business. I think his wife at the time wasn't very well either. And he was, you know, sort of approaching his 70s. So he decided he wanted to sell the business and would we be interested? So as we had that long kind of relationship anyway, we bought the company. But rather than retiring, he got better. And he carried on with us for another 20 years or so. He couldn't give it up. He just loved it. And he knew everyone in the industry. He used to take us to Switzerland, introduced us to everyone. And he still carried on with the contracts in our building, which we're moving back to very soon. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, really? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah, it's being renovated at the moment. |
| Jason Heaton | Now Ray was, um, you know, I had done some research, this was years ago when I wrote that first story for Hodinkee, um, when you were just about to re-release the 1980 reissue, but maybe you can provide a brief intro or background on, on the origins of CWC itself, even before you became involved, like Ray founded the company in 72, was it? |
| Malcolm Bliss | That's right, 1972. During the war, he was on the troop ship, the Queen Elizabeth, and he was transporting troops between New York and the Clyde in Scotland. After the war, he had no real connection to the watch. industry, but he worked for Zenith and also Certina. And then he saw a little advert in a newspaper for a watch company and he applied for it. And it turned out to be Hamilton. And they were looking for someone to head up their UK operation. So he was the man, he he took on the role. He had 180 shots, doing a whole range of what he used to tell me about a range of gold watches they used to do. And he did all the military contracts. And one day they decided either the, you know, it wasn't that viable to have a UK operation. They came over, the way he explained it, they walked into the office, said, right, we're shutting you down. You've got a few months to do it. And so he was out of a job. He was in a bit of a quandary as to what to do. was taking his son to Bristol University, driving down in his Morris Minor, I think he had at the time, chugging up the hill in Bristol. And as they got to the top of the hill, they saw the top of the Cabot Tower, Cabot the Explorer, who went from Bristol to Newfoundland, founded America. And he decided that was the name he was going to call the company. And it went from there, really. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, that's great. Yeah. I mean, CWC existed for decades as strictly a military provider, just a supplier and largely under the radar of the average person. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Totally under the radar, yeah. No sort of desire to branch out into retail or Um, he was solely, you know, for the military. |
| Jason Heaton | And we had those great asymmetric, you know, RAF chronographs. We had the G10s sold by the thousands, I'm sure. |
| Malcolm Bliss | In the, in the seventies, it was the, the first contract was the W10, the, uh, the cushion shape case, mechanical, um, and also the, the asymmetric chronograph. Um, And then in 1980, he developed the first quartz watch supplied to the British forces, which was the G10. The quartz movement was supposed to go into the W10 case, but it didn't fit. So he had to come up with a new case design, and that was the G10, which we still make thousands today. It's still just as popular as ever. And the Rolex Millsub was issued for 10 years through the 70s, and in 1980, he won the contract for the automatic diver, the 1980 diver, and the 81. Then there was the Falklands War, and in 83, the first quartz diver to the Royal Navy. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And then I guess it wasn't long after that when, when the MOD started experimenting with Pulsar and Seiko and some of these, the Japanese brands. And then I suppose CWC had to pivot a bit, adapt and, and look at new ways to sell watches and compete. And is that a fair statement? |
| Malcolm Bliss | During the 80s, Seiko did win some contracts for the chronograph. There's a whole long story about that. We actually were awarded the contract. I'm not going to go into any further details, but then Pulsar Pulsar came later in the late 90s, 2000s, but Persista had a few contracts in the 80s and 90s. So really, we had a pretty clear run from all through the 80s, 90s, and the early 2000s until the contracts started to become less and the quantities were less. I mean, we had quantities for 20,000 watches at a time. Some of them, the 1990 G10s was 20,000. Yeah, there's a lot of watches. |
| James Stacey | There's a lot, wow. Yeah. So I'm curious, when did your specific tenure start with CWC from like a leadership platform and how much of it was kind of informed by your own experience watching your family go through this and develop your own tastes in watches and that sort of thing? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Well, we took over in 96. Well, we didn't so much take over, you know, Ray still had a very big role to play. My interest in watches, I've only ever worn CWC. I did have a couple of Timex's and Seiko's in my teens, but from sort of early in the eighties, yeah, I had CWC and just that's all I've ever worn. |
| Jason Heaton | Were you a watch person? I mean, you kind of, came into this via your family. And I'm just curious, was it, did you have to kind of learn to like watches or were watches just so much a part of your life that you were interested right from the beginning? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah, I suppose it started when I was, you know, going to all the government auctions and seeing all these amazing watches that have been through, you know, God knows what. Some are, you know, just bits and, you know, smashed glasses and some are still ticking away, even though they look like they've been through, you know, a battle. And that kind of got me pretty interested. I did buy one Millsub. They're cool, aren't they? I never heard the end of it. They were a few hundred pounds. Wow. And I went to the, I went to the, auction. And we were buying all the military webbing, pouches, belts, harnesses, that sort of stuff. At the time, there was no mobile phones. I phoned my father and I said, you know, I've got the opportunity to buy this watch. He said, don't buy the watch, buy the webbing. Buy as much webbing as you can. So I bought the watch and I bought the webbing. And we don't have the watch anymore, but we still got the webbing in the basement. Does that make you weep? |
| Jason Heaton | It does. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Every time I think about it, it makes me weep. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I mean, there's this there's two sides. I mean, the webbing and watches. I mean, I when I was at Silverman's and went to the basement there, it was absolutely mind blowing. It was like an Aladdin's cave of everything from pith helmets to high altitude pilot suits to World War One and Two, you know, pouches, ammo pouches and clothing. I mean, Yeah. It really is a remarkable business to be in. And then you've got both sides of it. I mean, you're dealing with Silverman's on the one hand and then CWC, which does CWC kind of operate under the Silverman's umbrella or is it still, is it kind of more standalone? |
| Malcolm Bliss | It operates standalone. Yeah. I mean, we have to separate it. My brother, Richard, concentrates more on the Silverman side and I concentrate more on the watches. But yeah, it works. It works well because there's that history there. that, you know, the watches were worn with everything else, you know, they were a part of the kit. So, you know, the straps, everything, you know, has that military design to it. We've got all the, you know, my microphone's sitting on a whole stack of MOD specs for all the watches and straps and everything. It's just inherent in what we do. |
| Jason Heaton | And is it difficult, the fact that there's this long history of military spec watches to move into an era when you're selling more to the public, that maybe you might have a desire to design something different. And maybe this is a good segue into our collaborative TGN watch that veers a little bit from all these specifications in this history, there's a bit of a risk there, right? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah, I would say that there's a little bit of a risk. Yeah, it's something I'd like to do. I'd like to develop it, but keeping it within the parameters of, you know, the military heritage and the military style. Yeah, I mean, you can take a military watch and put a nice fancy dial in it and a nice set of fancy hands and, you know, polish the case up and it won't look like a military watch, really. It'll look like something completely different. But as long as it's got that heritage there and that the integrity and the reliability of it, then we'd be happy to do it. |
| James Stacey | So I'm curious, let's definitely jump into kind of a more specific chat about the CWN1. But before we get to that, I'm curious, previous to working with a silly podcast from two guys that you know from the internet, what was sort of the scope of CWC's sort of thinking when it came to collaborations? |
| Malcolm Bliss | We weren't really thinking about it. It was people coming to us. We've had a lot of requests for specials, for, you know, customization. And that's really, I mean, we are busy with the military. You know, the Black Divers watch, the SBS watch that we make, quantities are increasing and they're demanding earlier delivery, so we're very busy with that, and they're being now issued right across the board. It's not just the SBS that are getting them, it's, you know, the commander of the HMS Queen Elizabeth was issued one, so Yeah, people are coming to us for collaborations. And so we're having to be a bit choosy as to who we go with. And when you approached us, we were at the time considering doing a titanium watch. I've wanted to do a titanium watch for a long time. And we were in the sort of early stages of putting one together when you... came to us with the idea. So it was great. It was perfect timing, really. |
| James Stacey | Weirdly, the perfect timing element, obviously, it took nine months to make the watches and that sort of thing, but all of that worked out really nicely because this is something that people have been asking Jason and I for for years, probably since about 2017. Like the first 50, 60 episodes of the show was like, when can I get that? You know, we launched a new logo. that was designed by a listener of the show and people were like, oh, you should put that on a watch and that sort of stuff. And like, I've been very vocal about this and I have nothing, I don't have a problem with other brands that just put a logo on a watch. And actually when it's a military outfit, I think that's really cool. You have an insignia, put it on the face of the watch, it makes sense. For Jason and I, this is just a podcast that's meant to be like a group of buddies that would go to a bar on a Friday, but instead of being six or seven friends, it's, several thousand. And like I do, we still want things to feel cool and sort of insidery. And over the course of sort of my relationship with Jason, I think that one of the core brands that we, that Jason kind of translated for me and really brought me into the fold was with CWC. I was aware of the brand, only a piece of the history. Then he wrote the story for Hodinkee and it kind of unlocked this thing where I go like, oh, this is a brand that feels like they don't get the attention that other brands who had the same history would be commanding. And it's just because you guys are very subtle in the way you do things. And Jason and I really don't, you know, if the show's good, that's great. People will listen to it, but we're not going to like, we don't, we don't really promote the show. We like, we like it to find the audience that it would naturally find. And we kind of felt a kinship. And then, of course, a couple years ago, Jason gave me his 1983 reissue, and I wore it for like seven months straight. And it kind of rewired my brain. I've always loved quartz, but it was usually on a fully digital model, or maybe an anti-digi, like the Aqualands that we love and that kind of stuff. But you'd get this watch, it had this incredible loom, it's got one of my favorite bezels, which is one of the things I'm most happy with with the new one, is that despite titanium and all these pieces being largely novel to the watch, that click is still there because it's one of the best clicks in a bezel of any price point. |
| Malcolm Bliss | It's really. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, not at its price point. I think as far as a 60 click bezel goes, it's a flex for brands because it's so much easier to maintain the tolerances of 120 clicks. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Of course. Yeah. |
| James Stacey | And so any brand that goes 60, and for me, it's, you know, it comes down to two favorite brands here, CWC and Tudor. They do such a nice job, but I do think there's two different sort of executions. I believe Tudor's is, I think, supported by ball bearings. and not the spring alone. And I think that with the CWC, the click is so good and so distinctive, and especially on the steel ones, and then to have it again on the titanium, it just brings me joy every time I turn the bezel, which is frequently, I love using it. Oh, that's fantastic. And then I had this dream for a long time of like, and I think Jason does, and to be honest, I think the reason the watch exceeded our expectations for pre-orders was because, you know, I think a lot of people want what this watch represents. And certainly if you love a silly podcast like TGN, you probably want what this watch represents, which is it's like a zero fuss. This watch wants nothing from you. Set it once, maybe once a year, if you're picky, and just wear it. Turn the bezel if you travel, turn the bezel if you're diving. It's become my daily, and because it is so light, I can sleep with it on. but the loom is so good that I actually have to put my arm under the pillow or like adjust my blanket because every now and then I'll roll over and like I wear an aura ring which is like one of these digital rings and it has these crazy LEDs under it and every now and then I'll be like rubbing my face in the middle of the night and the LED will turn on and just like oh goodness and it's not that bright but in a dark room right and it's kind of the same thing with this it's uh I'm just so I'm so happy with how it came together and I'd always wanted to to make especially after having an experience with the 1983 and you go like all right well obviously it's good enough for the sbs so we can't i've got nothing to stack up there i'll never i'll never stack up so it's definitely going to cover my bases it'd be so nice to see this as light as possible as accurate as possible and and travel ready with the 12-hour bezel And when Jason and I put the sort of spec together, the brief, our ask, if you will, I didn't think we would get a yes to all of it. I thought there'd be two yeses and a no, a no and two yeses, that sort of thing. And you came back and you said, yeah, I think we can put that together. And I can't tell you just like the joy that I've had watching this come together, get the packaging from Stay Calm Industries and Evan, and I think seeing them arrive and seeing the CWN1, the feed and the slack is just, you know, it's too many messages to keep up with, but seeing them arrive and seeing the joy, and mostly, and I think this is something that maybe I didn't understand because I've never made a watch before. Obviously, I've been involved with Hodinkee's limited editions, but not at like a personal level. I kind of get there's like there's a buzz to making a watch that somebody gets and then writes you a message and says like it's everything I was hoping for. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah we've had a lot of messages like that. |
| James Stacey | So I guess a very long way of saying like thank you for taking the chance with us on the titanium case and the fixed lugs and the 12-hour bezel and all this and for being open to us being like how little text can we put on the dial? How pared back can we make it? But it was a partnership that I think we were on the same wavelength from the start. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah. Well, thank you for giving us the opportunity to make it. It has come out very well. |
| Jason Heaton | I remember, Mal, you told me that during the early production days, you had a few sleepless nights. You're a small team. I mean, you're a small company. And this was a new watch, a brand new watch from the ground up when you consider your very first titanium cased watch. And then all the other elements we asked for with fitting the 12-hour insert, which you had on the Sea Falcon, but not the same size and the little tweaks we had. |
| James Stacey | My demand for a very specific movement. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. The high accuracy movement and the orange tip on the sweep hand and things like this. And tell us a little bit like... Yeah. How hard did we make it for you? Yeah. What were the biggest challenges in the creation of this watch? I'm guessing the case. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah, the biggest challenge was the bars. I mean, all our watches, we've never produced a watch with spring pins, spring bars. Every watch has fixed bars. You can't weld titanium. So that posed the first major problem. First prototypes did have spring bars. Removable ones. Yeah, removable ones. We hummed and hawed and decided we wouldn't go with that. Then we tried screw-in bars. We didn't like the look of those and the practicality of them. discussed it with you and from memory, yeah, we decided to go for fully integral machine bars, part of the case. And that went right back to the drawing board, complete redesign of the case, getting, you know, the fit, the curve to make it comfortable. And yeah, that's how we did it. |
| Jason Heaton | it was probably via Instagram direct message that you and I started communicating. And I remember, I, I still remember that moment when I said, have you ever considered making a titanium dive watch? And you said, as a matter of fact, we're working on something now it's being prototyped and, and the timing. And I think I was so excited because James and I had just started considering doing a watch collaboration. And we talked to a few different small brands that we like, and, And I remember telling James, you know, they're working on one and the excitement level just got so big. And I don't remember the date of that first exchange, but this has been a long, it's been a long process. Some people don't realize how long it takes to craft a watch. |
| Malcolm Bliss | It really does. Yeah. Nine months was actually quite quick. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, yeah. |
| Malcolm Bliss | I mean, we were, we were in discussion before it and, and a few different ideas and that, you know, the time goes so quickly. You know, before you know it, you've been talking about it for three months before you've, you know, and then the Swiss have a lot of holidays. Yeah. And that's very frustrating. |
| Jason Heaton | How dare them. Yeah. |
| Malcolm Bliss | No, but. Yeah, it does get in the way of things. So, yeah, it takes time. |
| Jason Heaton | And then there was that bit of a scurry last, well, it was last May when I was getting ready to come over to Wales for the fan dance. And you said, I think we can get a prototype ready in time. And you had it shipped to this little cottage that I was staying in, in Wales. And I remember writing to the guy who owned it, who lived next door, and I said, there's going to be a package arriving. And it was, the timing was, I mean, it arrived like the day before, I strapped it on. You told, you had to glue the, the bezel insert on. And it's still on. It's still, it hasn't fallen off yet. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Oh, I did a good job. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Yeah. And you even sent me a little tube of glue. I remember in case it fell off. Yeah, really, really amazing. So I think people, people have been wondering because a lot of people took interest in this watch after our pre-order expired and the watches are being delivered. And, and some people have said, Oh, I'm sorry. I missed out on this. I hope CWC is going to do their own version with this case. And I mean, it'd be crazy not to. I mean, you wouldn't take all that time to develop a titanium case only to use it for, you know, 350 watches. So what plans do you have if you can divulge for the titanium case? |
| Malcolm Bliss | Well, we do have our own version coming out probably in the next a few months, hopefully within a couple of months, but, you know, it's still, we're still working on it. And then later in the year, there'll be an automatic version, but it'll be basically along the lines of, you know, our normal Royal Navy design, dials, hands, that sort of thing. But yeah, there's a lot of people very excited about the seeing it. |
| Jason Heaton | And then we can't overlook the fact that you, you've created a version of the G10 strap, um, that, you know, the quote unquote NATO strap, we're not allowed to call them that anymore, but the nylon strap, um, with titanium buckles and hardware. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah, we made that primarily for the TGN watch. We thought it'd be a nice, you know, nice finish for the titanium watch. |
| Jason Heaton | It's great. I mean, what a great finishing touch for the watch and really fitting. Yeah, I'm not sure. |
| Malcolm Bliss | I've never seen a titanium buckle military strap before. It did take us a while to make new molds for it. And that took a while to do, but it came out really well as well. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And this can be off the record if you don't want to talk about this, but what's your take on the Phoenix watch strap scenario now? I think there's been some controversy about it. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Ah, we've... got a long history with Phoenix before we, well, even when we bought the company, we were, the only strap we supplied to the military was the Phoenix. You know, it's got a fantastic name. It's got a fantastic following. You know, it was the British military strap for so many years. The guys who, um make it and and the guys who you know run the company they're just really nice people and you know there's there's some nasty things going on and and you know something pops up on instagram it looks just like you know the genuine thing but it's not and um yeah it's not not a very nice thing what's happened to them um well you're the straps you're providing are great i mean they're they're a worthy successor Yeah, I mean, we've been supplying the strap to the military for quite a few years now. People like the Phoenix, it's got the name, it's got the history. They always tended to stretch around the holes, they frayed. And that was, you know, the character of them. an old military watch, you know, and an old Fenix strap. I mean, people are selling the old ones, tatty, filthy, you know, holes stretched and frayed, you know, for, you know, 50, 100 pounds. It's just crazy. And people are paying because you can't get them anymore. |
| James Stacey | Man, Malcolm, I was at the Hodinkee office, but this was back in, I guess, probably early December. And we had someone who was helping us with a story, does not want their name on the record, or even a photo of the watch on the internet. So I'm in the office in December and they've got this mil sub that was loaned to us very briefly. And no pictures were allowed or any of that kind of thing. It was, you know, probably like a mid six figure mil sub. And it was still on the like, quote unquote, the original, or at least if it wasn't the original, it was the second NATO it had ever been put on because it looked like it had been to the moon and back. And I got to tell you, dude, it was perfect. It looks so good. It's like the worn in seats on an old on an old, you know, Spitfire or something like that. It's great. |
| Malcolm Bliss | Yeah, I mean, when we were able to get stock of Phoenix and as we became more popular and Phoenix, you know, we were selling quite a lot of Phoenix straps, people would send them back because there was a little fray on the whole, or, you know, it looked a little, you know, out of, out of alignment or just such silly little things that, you know, and yet, you know, you got, you know, one that's looked like, it looks like it's been to the moon and back on a, on a mil sub and it's just perfect. |
| Jason Heaton | That's great. So, you know, we can wrap up here shortly, but I'm curious, and this question has come up a couple of times, you know, we did our pre-order and you made the watches and delivered to those who ordered and a couple of people have said, well, I'm guessing a few people at CWC have set aside a couple for yourselves. Do you indeed have one of our TGN watches? I hope you kept a few around there. |
| Malcolm Bliss | As it was our first, you know, proper collaboration, we're very happy that, you know, it was the first. We didn't make more than we needed. So we may have, I think, one or two. And that's it. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, okay. Got to have one for the memory books. The eventual museum. |
| Jason Heaton | We can be off in a dusty corner for sure. Yeah, right. Mal, look, I mean, it's been a thrill to have you on. You know, you've been such an important figure kind of in the background for so many years for those of us that love military-issued watches and CWC in particular, and we're just thrilled that you've made yourself available to come on a podcast and our podcast and TGN, as well as collaborating on, on our, our first collaborative watch. Uh, it really has been an honor to work with CWC and with you. And we thank you very much for that. |
| Malcolm Bliss | And likewise, it's been a great experience and the result, you know, we couldn't ask for a better response. You know, the amount of messages and the amount of positivity that we were getting from it. People absolutely love it. So thank you for that. |
| James Stacey | I'm so glad. Yeah, thank you so much for the opportunity to give this a try. We've never sold a watch. We've never asked for this kind of money from the audience. And Jason and I, we're losing sleep over the number. We're losing sleep over the shipping and all this. It's exciting, but it is stressful. I do still love to sleep. Yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure, yeah. And I think, but I think, look, I think that's also the thing that makes the product good in the end, is that you care enough that it affects other parts. Maybe it's not always the healthiest thing, but I'm an overworker. It seems like, Mel, you are as well. So I get it. I got several messages saying, if you guys are communicating or doing a show or something with the folks from CWC, just say thank you. Just so many people from the crew that were just thrilled by the watch. and are really having a good time finding new straps. We've got a very active strap contingent, because the watch works on anything that can fit through the lugs. I'm rambling because I'm just grateful, but thank you so much for putting this together for us, and you guys took on a huge amount of the liability and the financial structure and that kind of thing, because otherwise, TJ and it's just Jason and I uh from from a corporate structure yeah uh so yeah it's uh it's it's fun to work with a team that gets it and you guys certainly get it and you turn out a product we just love and to be able to partner up uh means a lot it you know i've been doing this for a long time and this is a brand new very fun experience brilliant brilliant well i'm glad it worked out yeah for both of us well malcolm bliss thanks so much for coming on the gray nato and we'll let you go on on an evening there in london and um yeah all the best thank you |
| Malcolm Bliss | Okay, thank you. Same to you. See you, Mel. Bye. |
| James Stacey | All right, so as we said on the tape there, a huge thank you to Mal, a huge thank you to CWC. By all means, let's continue this conversation. I would be fine with having Mal back on in a couple months to answer specific questions. So why don't we have a little bit of fun, and if you want to, normally we only do audio questions, but let's do text. If you have specific questions for Mal, maybe we could have him back on closer to the release of their future diver, the future titanium diver. But if you have specific questions with the CWN1 and that sort of thing, feel free to email it to thegreatnadoatgmail.com and we'll try and get it into a future episode. But yeah, just a huge thank you to CWC for helping us out with making this watch, with being open to it, with being the ones that took on most of the financial liabilities and that sort of thing. We're really thrilled that the audience, all of you, came through. And I think, Jason, what was our original hope? I think it was over 180 we were going to be happy. Yeah, I'm 150. I can't quite remember what the number was I could maybe go back and find it but it was something like that and then You know to be able to do I guess probably just shy just barely shy of 350 Feels perfect to me, you know, maybe maybe we'll do another limited-edition watch in the future Maybe be with CWC. None of that's decided or really has even been talked about it's something Jason and I are willing to start considering once all of these have been delivered and everybody's happy and Uh, then we can assess whether or not, you know, what, what the future of that sort of scenario looks like for a CWN2, but it was so nice to have Mal on and, uh, just a huge shout out to CWC and the whole team there for, for helping us out along the way. Yeah, definitely. |
| Jason Heaton | An episode that people wanted and, uh, we, we wanted and, um. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | It was, it was so fun. And I'm just, I'm just happy in the entire collaboration. I'm happy that, that CWC was willing to work with us. And as you said, took on a lot of the risk in several different areas, but then that we were able to give back a little bit by giving them a little bit of exposure on the podcast and get Mal on because I think he and he and the brand deserve more exposure than they get. And any little bit that we can help, uh, I'm thrilled for. So thanks again to Mal and I hope everybody enjoyed that chat. How about moving into some final notes and get this episode wrapped up? Yeah, let's do it. You want to go first? Sure. Yeah. Moving on to kind of, I guess, another micro-brand, if you can consider CWC a micro-brand. We're moving on to a story that appeared, I believe, just yesterday on Watches of Espionage site called, Is a $1,000 watch from an American micro-brand a worthy successor to the legendary Rolex Millsub? This was an article by Benjamin Lowery about some time in the past couple of weeks. I saw them. I saw the guys going on this trip. Some of our TGN listeners and friends went to down to the Florida Keys and did some diving and Ben was wearing a Mark II fulcrum. So a watch that we talked about on a recent episode, another new release, another great release from Bill Yao and his company. that pays homage to a Millsub, but has some important changes. And it seems to be a worthy successor in that line of watches. And there were some great photos here. Many of them from Jeff Gerrits, WatchCowsDive, our good buddy, who was on that trip and took some photos. And it's just a fun story. Who doesn't love a story about diving with watches? So check that out on watchesofespionage.com. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, and actually, it comes out the day after we record this, which is the day it goes live. We had to go a little late for today's recording. But if you really like both Jason and stories about diving with watches, swing by Hodinkee the day that this comes out. There's a very cool story that I'm definitely not going to spoil. uh that runs uh runs tomorrow aka thursday march 6th uh so it'll be on the site certainly uh just actually even hours before this is live so this is perfect that's great awesome great and yeah solid story from uh watch of espionage i think they've really hit a stride i'm just really liking what they're putting out and uh and i think ben's doing an awesome job with this kind of stuff i'm i'm excited to see how that site grows and kind of matures into their into their comfort zone it's been great to uh to see the strides they've made so far All right. Mine this week is a YouTube video that has already been shared several times on the Slack. So I thought I maybe had a, you know, a scoop on this one, but I certainly didn't. And that's because it's from a guy we've shared on the Slack several times, a guy we've talked about on the show in the past and a guy that I'm hoping to get on the show in the near future. And that's Drew Sims. And he has a brand new video, which is a slightly different format. It's called Up Close with Polar Bears, a Sony FX6 short film in Churchill, Manitoba. So Drew, if you missed previous mentions of his name on the show, is a sort of single filmmaker, like a sole operator filmmaker based in a vehicle, wherever it is he drove it. For a while he had a Jeep and then he is, I believe, a Toyota now. And he just does these really incredible kind of cinematic reels. I would liken them to, think about like the coolest version of like a demo film that might be on like a an awesome television at Best Buy. You know, it's just this these incredibly wild clips of, you know, rugged outdoor spaces, mountains, river basins, glaciers, all that kind of stuff. And he does it with a drone typically. And he's doing more and more sort of wildlife coverage as well. He did a video with, you know, brown bears or grizzlies recently. kind of next to a stream. And then this video I found interesting because it's a little bit of a format change, where a lot of his videos are just you know, x number of minutes 1520 minutes of these beautiful shots. And I when I see a new drew sims video, I go down to my basement, I turn on the home theater, I get comfortable, and I watch it on the big screen. And it's just the I love his work so much. And it's super beautiful and really relaxing. And with this one, he starts the video in that format, and then transitions to a little bit more of like a vlog or a blog about his experience in Churchill, Manitoba, photographing and videoing these polar bears. It's really cool. It gives you a little bit of a tech breakdown of the camera he used. Obviously, it's right in the title that he's shooting with a very modern Sony platform called the FX6. And then he's shooting with a 600 millimeter G Master, which is just an awesome 600 millimeter F4. Wow. Wow. Yeah. So cool. As a guy who's got a 400 and loves it. Yeah, I love the idea of a 600 f4. Yeah, yeah, that's amazing. So you get he walks you through the gear. But then the other cool part is he walks you through like the experience of actually going there. So he was there, presumably with some sort of a partnership with I believe, like destination or like the tourism board for Manitoba. And then also this group frontiers north and frontiers north has this. It's essentially like a rolling train. So cool. It's it's it's so hard to describe that this is the and don't get me wrong you need to watch the whole video But this is kind of the coolest part is they've they've made a motorized And it's the the vehicles are a mix of the most modern ones are electric and the older ones in the fleet are diesel But it's this big motorized convoy that drives out onto the tundra. There's no roads or that sort of thing so once you leave Churchill you're in the middle of nowhere quite effectively and and they want to get out onto the tundra and not have to leave. If you go with other tours, you drive out, you get some hours, and then you have to get back to Churchill. This sort of convoy, if you will, it's essentially like a train, but with no tracks. It runs on conventional wheels. Exactly. It kind of has a lunar feel to it. it's all interconnected. So there's like a dining car and a bed car and one with showers and, and the bears walk right up to it. They're all used to it and that sort of thing. And it gives you this level of access. Just watch this video, man. It's awesome. I was immediately like, wait, how much does all this cost? I would love to do this. This looks like a blast. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I've always wanted to get up to Churchill. |
| James Stacey | So cool. Yeah, great, great video. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And man, I mean, the quality of the video, I mean, some of those opening shots are like getting so tight on those polar bears. It's it's it's really remarkable. Yeah, this was well done. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, he's super talented. He has this very low key way of presenting himself that I really like. He just kind of seems like a subtle kind of sweet guy. I really enjoyed, you know, he used to do not vlogs so much, but he used to do kind of trip reports of big outings when he was in sort of his overland prepped Jeep. And that might include a cool hike, running the drone to get a very specific shot, and then cooking that evening and a little bit of talking. And I really like this new format where he's showing you the film or a piece of the film that he shot, and then he's walking you through like the experience a little bit of a bts and it's all in one i don't know it's like 16 or 17 minutes yeah uh it's like it's not a super long uh it's not like a super long video but he gets through a lot sorry it's 10 minutes i just reloaded it it's a 10 minute video and i i swear what he packs in and how well it's kind of the storyline is considered it's just really good So like I said, we have a connect through someone who's almost certainly listening with Drew. And I just got too busy the last time around and we traded an email and never got back to it. But I'm going to reopen that thread and see if Drew might want to come on and chit chat about his work. And, you know, the upgrade going from the Jeep to the Toyota, doing the new build. There's a bunch of stuff that I think applies to the superlatives for TGN that Drew kind of represents. So we'll see if we can get him on. Yeah, that'd be awesome. That's great. Yeah. Good one. Good stuff. What a great episode. Full episode. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, definitely. |
| James Stacey | Oh, one thing to keep in mind, and I forgot to put this at the top of the show. I'm taking next week off. It's March break. It's also my birthday. I'm going to take my girls on a road trip. So we won't have an episode next week. So the episode that would come out on the 13th, 322, will come out on the 20th. So I probably should have remembered to put that at the top of the show, not in the last one minute. But this will be your reward if you're the type that actually listens all the way to the end. of a given episode. There won't be an episode on the 13th. So I appreciate the flexibility. I just, with all the other things going on and with trying to get on the road, I knew it wouldn't work for me to have the edit done in time for Thursday. So we'll push it one more week and then we're in the phase before we get to Watches and Wonders. So there'll be another little break in early April as I'm offline just doing exclusively watches 24 hours a day and sleeping. And then we'll get back and we'll do our usual, you know, favorite watches of Watches and Wonders as we've done in the past. They're big, you know, kind of megasodes. Definitely. Well, well-deserved and enjoy your week off. Oh, absolutely. Yeah, that's a wrap for this week. All right. Well, thanks so much for listening. If you'd like to subscribe to The Show Notes, get into the comments for each episode, or consider supporting the show directly, maybe even grab yourself a new TGN signed NATO, or get into the slack that we keep talking about, please visit TheGreyNATO.com. Music throughout is Siesta by JazzArr via the Free Music Archive. |
| Jason Heaton | And we leave you with this quote from Lydia Bastianich, who said, Today's innovation is tomorrow's tradition. |