The Grey NATO – 299 – Marathon Watch Co. With Mitchell Wein
Published on Thu, 12 Sep 2024 06:00:00 -0400
Synopsis
This episode of the Graynado podcast features an interview with Mitchell Wein, president of Marathon Watch Co. The hosts discuss Marathon's unique position as a Canadian company that manufactures watches in Switzerland, as well as its history supplying watches to military and government agencies. Mitchell provides insights into Marathon's development of tool watches, use of tritium illumination, and recent collaboration with Jeep. The hosts also preview Marathon's upcoming presence at the Toronto Timepiece Show. Additionally, the hosts share some personal notes about watch straps and prescription sports sunglasses.
Links
Transcript
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| Jason Heaton | Hello and welcome to another episode of the Graynado, a loose discussion of travel, adventure, diving, driving gear, and most certainly watches. This is episode 299 and it's proudly brought to you by the always growing TGN supporter crew. We thank you all so much for your continued support and if you'd like to support the show, please visit thegraynado.com for more details. My name is Jason Heaton. I'm joined as ever by my friend and co-host James Stacy, James 299. We've, we're on the cusp. |
| James Stacy | We're pretty close. We made it. We made it 299. Uh, I mean, I, I think I probably said this at 200. I don't think I ever thought we would do this many. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. |
| James Stacy | It's a weird number. It's kind of abstract. Yeah. Yeah. 299. Like, so we're at 299. We probably have, um, what a few years of, um, Q and A's. Yeah, in there. So that's another 25 or so. And then we have some we used to not number episodes that were like chats with people. So we have a handful more in there. Yeah, I don't know. It feels like like 300. When you see that on a podcast, like even now, if I go to check out a podcast, and they've got more than 300 episodes, I just think like these, it's the old guard. Yeah, yeah. I feel like a lot of podcasts probably don't make it past 10 episodes, but I also don't commonly see ones that do hundreds. Like it happens. Yeah. Right. You know, like I think the, my brother, my brother and me is in like the 700s at this point. Wow. Wow. Those guys have been going for 15 years or whatever. |
| Jason Heaton | And I'm not really one to like get too crazy about milestones and anniversaries and stuff. And like you said, we've, we've done more than 300, let's face it with, with all the other stuff you mentioned, but it is, it is a milestone. It's a nice round number. And, um, You know, we're not, we're not planning anything huge for 300, but we've got a couple of ideas. And then of course, I think it's timed well with, uh, with the Toronto timepiece show, which happens to be, you know, the, uh, coming up very soon here and kind of coincides nicely with our 300th episode. |
| James Stacy | Yep. Yeah. It'll come out. The 300th episode will come out just before the show actually kicks off. And then theoretically 301 will be the recording of the episode that we're going to do. I don't actually know what that show is going to be yet. I have to figure out what we're going to actually do at the at the Toronto Timepiece Show for that episode, like a live episode taping. But we'll have a good time. We always do. That's 4.30 to 5.30 p.m. on Saturday, September 28th. If you're going to be at the show, if you got tickets, please come out. I think otherwise tickets have been fully claimed. And then that evening, starting at 6.30, so an hour after the show ends, an hour after we finish the show taping, We're going to have an event with Marathon Watches, about 15 minutes drive from the show at a great space. That's filling up very quickly. So if you're listening to this and you go to the show notes to RSVP and it's full, I am sorry. You can always try dropping me an email just in case we get any changes to that. But we do have some sort of a limit and we're kind of starting to approach it after having, I guess the, it was mentioned on last week's episode, which is now, you know, has maybe been in the wild for about 24 or 36 hours, something like that. And yeah, so that's the Toronto Timepiece Show. We're excited to see everybody there. Shouldn't be too hard to find us. I'm sure we'll be wearing TGN hats, maybe even some of the other merch we'll see. And then the other thing to keep in mind is if you're in the market for a new Citizen ProMaster Dive Watch and you're operating out of the brand's USA site, so Citizen USA, they are still offering a discount for TGN listeners. So it's the code GREYNATO, G-R-E-Y-N-A-T-O, and it gets you 10% off in addition to any other promotions that they're currently running. And that runs through the end of the year. So just a quick heads up on that. |
| Jason Heaton | Nice little housekeeping there. Yeah. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. I tried to buzz right through it. And we're recording on a Friday because you're heading away on yet another adventure with Oceana. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. So yeah, this is a Friday. I'm leaving on Monday. Flight is about midday and I'm flying out to L.A. and then hopping in a car to go up to Ventura, Ventura Harbor, where I'm jumping on the peace boat again. This is the kind of a rinse and repeat of the expedition I did back in late April with Oceana, the conservation group. And I'm excited. It's the nice thing about this time around, we'll be doing largely the same kind of work. It's, um, transects like underwater transects, diving around some of the channel islands off the coast of California. And, um, this time around we're, we're trying to hit some of the further out islands and some new dive sites, and hopefully we'll get some better dive conditions. I think September is supposed to be quite nice out there for, for diving. And when I say nice, I mean, good visibility and a little bit more Marine life. And, uh, yeah. And, and I have the advantage now of, of knowing the entire kind of crew that's, that's going along on this. So I met them all back then and it's, it's exactly the same group. And, um, yeah, so it'll be fun. It's, it's living on, on board for, I think, five nights, uh, in and around the channel islands. And I will be. behind the camera, um, every dive, that's kind of my role on this one. So this, this expedition in the previous were sponsored by a Blancpain and, um, it's by their grace that I'm allowed on the boat and joining this group. And, and there's this desire to gather imagery that kind of suits both Oceana and Blancpain. So obviously there's a science element to it, but then of course there's a sponsorship element to it. And Blancpain would love to see some photos of, of its watches in action doing this work that they're, they're underwriting. And so, My job, along with a couple of other underwater photographers, will be to not only take pictures of marine life and whatever we see, but also divers wearing cool watches, which is always a kind of a fun gig. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, that's tough. That's a tough one for sure. And it looks like we'll get a great Hodinkee story out of it as well, which I'm pumped to see. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, exactly. I'm going to, I'm going to write it up for them. And, you know, last time around when I did this, if you might remember, I, I was also doing Instagram stories, kind of daily dispatches for Oceanographic magazine, but they've got a, uh, ocean photographer of the year campaign running next week. So they opted to kind of, um, bump my stuff out to the following week with more of a recap. So I won't be doing daily dispatches this time around, but you can certainly catch up, catch up on my Instagram. I'll be kind of posting stuff here and there from, from onboard and maybe a few underwater photos if I, if I get some good stuff. But, uh, yeah, I'm, I'm really excited. And I actually just got a new, uh, bit of camera gear for this trip. I've got a, um, you know, I have this, this Nikon Z seven, which is a wonderful high resolution, you know, really nice mirrorless from Nikon that I've had for a few years. And, and I've got this Nauticam housing for it, but you know, when I got this camera, uh, I got this giant dome port with the intention of doing a lot of kind of split shots or over unders. And it just makes the camera very, very heavy, very cumbersome and extremely buoyant. And so it's, it was always a bit problematic to dive with. So, I always opted to go with a smaller rig from, with an older Sony a seven with an underwater housing. Um, but I just thought, you know, I could make this Nikon a little easier to dive with. And so I ordered up a new wide angle wet lens for, for the housing and it's just made all the difference. I took it on a quick little test dive, um, a couple of days ago in this very awful murky Lake nearby. Uh, and it worked really well. The buoyancy was good. Um, very easy to manipulate. Nice. And the beauty of a wet lens is that, you know, the refractive qualities of shooting through water mean that it kind of acts like a crop sensor. It sort of crops your photos and kind of zoom stuff in. And you don't want that if you're trying to shoot wide angle. So a wet lens actually allows water into the lens, like behind the, behind the lens and in front of the camera, um, outside the housing of course. And so it kind of mitigates that. So, um, should be really interesting to try out. And, uh, I'm looking forward to checking that out. And, Kind of just a side note, if anyone's kind of in the market for a nice underwater camera system, I very likely will be selling that Sony a7 setup with an auto cam housing. Um, if, if all goes well on this trip and the Nikon does what I want it to do, um, the Sony might be up for grabs. So any of you divers out there that are interested in getting into some underwater photography, it's a really nice setup that Sony and, uh, most of the underwater photos you've seen of me, or by me in the past five years have been taken with that camera. So it's, it's a good setup. So hit me up if you're, if you think it might be interested, but that's the news I've got. Yeah. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. That's great. I can't wait to see the photos from it. And, uh, and certainly from this whole trip, it sounds like it's going to be a blast and it's, I don't know, there's, there's a, a special bit of fun to be going on a, on a trip and have a piece of gear for it and get to like really investigate what you get from it. You know, I got to do the, the, um, Monterey car week. Yeah. And, you know, it's, it's, I'm only just really starting to learn and find a comfort zone with the SL two and the 24 to 70. And it's just kind of fun to, to get a chance to go and use it and experience like what the actual kind of UI and, and handling experiences, and then actually get to dig into the photos and see how they are, uh, you know, compared to maybe what I would have used to shoot with a year ago or something like that. I've been enjoying it. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. It's a little nerve wracking to kind of, you know, be essentially kind of you know, not building the parachute on the way down, so to speak, but like, you know, learning the characteristics of a new piece of equipment, you know, while you're supposed to be actually performing with it. So it's a little, for sure, a little nerve wracking, but I think, you know, my experience with underwater photography in the past and even having used this camera a couple of times, I think, uh, I think it would go just fine. So yeah, I can't wait looking forward to it. It'd be fun to be out on a boat in the fresh air and diving a bit for, for four or five days next week. So anyway, that's, that's the long answer why we're recording on a Friday. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, absolutely. Uh, I don't have a ton going on, uh, since we recorded the last episode just a few days ago. Um, I thought that episode turned out really well. It was such a treat to have been on the show as well. Um, and then to have, uh, Mitchell from marathon on the show today is going to be a lot of fun. It was, uh, a very sort of eccentric and wide ranging conversation that I had with Mitchell in his home, but, uh, we'll get to that in just a few minutes. I don't have a ton else like to, to report on simply because it's, um, You know, it's it's the back to school week. So we're busy with that kind of stuff. You know, eyeballing whether or not the weather is going to be good enough at the cottage to go do something like that. But it's already Friday. The week went by, you know, pretty quickly with with Monday being a holiday for those of us in Canada and the US. But yeah, I don't I don't have a ton else. So we can jump into risk check if you like. |
| Jason Heaton | I mean, predictably, I'm wearing my Blancpain 50 fathoms, the titanium automatic, and it'll be accompanying me on the trip. I just, uh, you know, last time around, um, I was, uh, uh, I was kind of the, the watch guy on board, um, on this, on this boat. Cause you know, these scientists are, you know, they're not watch nerds. Like, you know, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not, they're not like us, I mean, heaven forbid. But, um, you know, so they, they were a little unfamiliar with, with the watches. And so I did a lot of explanations and I was kind of the guy strapping them on over people's dive suits and Blancpain sent a couple of sample pieces. And then I was letting people wear mine kind of to get some photos of as many people as possible wearing these watches. And I just thought this time around, if I can bring two that, that, that adds another one that, that somebody else can wear and, you know, certainly raises the risk factor of losing a watch, but it hasn't happened yet. So, We'll do our best and, yeah, hopefully get some cool underwater shots of both of these Blancpains. But for today, it's the 50 Fathoms. Yeah. How about you? |
| James Stacy | Yeah, good choice for sure. What do you have on? I figured given our guest, I would wear my Marathon. So I have the Steel Navigator, the SS Nav-D. You know, pretty resolutely, one of my favorite watches under $1,000. Yeah. I just think it's a huge amount of value, especially if what you want is a just a really nice cross between something that wears and kind of feels diver and field watch at the same time, you know, with the bezel, but it's a 12 hour bezel. So it makes a fantastic travel watch. Of course you have, you get no attention when you wear this watch. It's about as subtle as anything could be again to the travel benefit or like the adventure benefit, you get tritium tubes. So constant illumination, this one has a date. They now make one without a date as they expand the line. I just think that this is, like maybe one of the best tool watches you can buy at this price. Yeah. 800 bucks, high accuracy quartz, well made, cool company. And yeah, I just really, really enjoy wearing this watch. It wears really well. It captures a little bit of that, you know, like the Benris, the 70s Benris type one, type two vibe with the asymmetrical case and the similar bezel design and that sort of thing. And it's comfortable and easy and everything you would want from a quartz watch. I think this one nails it. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And kind of the neat thing about, about marathon is that, um, you know, for, for people like us that came, came about in our watch enthusiasm at that era, you know, the, the mid two thousands, um, marathon was one of those brands that was both under the radar, but also kind of a, if you know, you know, kind of brand, especially on like the military watch resource forum. I was pretty heavy into that, um, in my early days, as well as of course, watch you seek. And it was always the, the SAR, the TSAR and, um, And the Navigator wasn't really on people's radar back then. I'm not sure if they weren't making it then or if it was just kind of a lesser, lesser known piece. Obviously they were making them for, for military issue back, you know, even before that. But, um, yeah, it's just always kind of been one of those brands that's just been there and, and, and people have almost nothing but, but good things to say about it all the time. And it's, it's really cool. So I'm looking forward to hearing this interview with Mitchell as well. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. That's about as good a bridge as any, uh, let's get into the chat with Mitchell Wein. He is the president of Marathon Watch Co. And as we're just a couple of weeks out of the Toronto Timepiece Show, where Marathon will be exhibiting watches and we're doing Hangout with the folks from the brand on Saturday night, I thought it'd be great to finally have Mitchell on the show because he has a fairly unique perspective on the watch industry as Marathon is a legitimate Canadian-founded, Canadian-run company that does all of their manufacturing in Switzerland. It's not necessarily the easiest way to do something, but that's how Marathon does what they do. And then on top of that element that this sort of unique factor of how the company is aligned between Canada and Switzerland, you also have a company that largely interfaces with government bodies via contracts for watches. Jason was talking about back in the day on Watch You Seek, if you were buying or selling a TSAR, you would say what year the contract was. Oh, this is a 2006. Oh, this is a 2010 Maple or that sort of thing. It's all part of the coding of these watches because they are First and foremost, a company that makes watches and clocks and stopwatches and compasses and other stuff like that for government contract, military and otherwise. And I think that gives you a perspective that most brands don't have. A lot of brands look back at a military past or having been used in a war, whereas Marathon in many scenarios kind of lives that in their everyday life. So I met up with Mitchell at his home in Toronto, so apologies for some dodgy audio quality, but I really hope you enjoy the chat. Also, for those attending the show on Saturday, Mitch will be taking part in a live chat with Eric, the man behind Rico's Watches podcast, all about Marathon's role in Canadian history. It's at 1230 on Saturday, and I'm definitely going to be in the audience, as I think it'll be a pretty entertaining conversation. I think that's enough preamble, so let's get to the tape with Mitchell. Okay, Mitchell, an absolute treat to have you on the Graynado. You know, I've kind of reconnected with Marathon in the last little while. We're not that far apart in Toronto. And you guys had me out to the, to the kind of main headquarters to check out the operations there. And then certainly that was around the time that you guys launched the SS NavD, the Steel, the Steel Navigator. And, and that was an absolute breeze. I think for you guys, the watch seems to have gone quite successfully. How have things been in the last year or so for Marathon? |
| Mitchell Wein | You know what? Things have been great in Marathon. As a team, we've become much closer, especially with the Swiss factory and our headquarters here in Toronto. We're working very well together. And we're developing some new items, but what we're doing is we're making our existing items better and better. We're actually getting a hold of increased production with increased quality and investing in testing facilities and testing equipment and manufacturing equipment. So we're building a great future right now. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. It always seems like you guys are always kind of trying to innovate, trying to fix the supply chain issues, trying to find a better way to kind of link Canada in Toronto with Switzerland, which is kind of what Marathon's been doing for, I mean, as long as it's been around. |
| Mitchell Wein | Well, we are the same company, but sometimes you have to use the expertise that are the best for the region. As a Canadian company, we recognize the fact that the best place in the world to manufacture watches is right in Switzerland and in our region in the Chaux-de-Fonds. There's a plethora of manufacturers and suppliers of various products, such as dials and hands and cases and movements. And we've kept everything regional, but the biggest asset of a company is actually its people. And that wouldn't happen if we didn't have the education system in Switzerland for watchmaking and the historical secretness of it. I mean, there are things that are done in the watch industry, how you use the oils and how the oils are even made to make a watch that are known only to the Swiss. And in the olden days, my grandfather used to assemble watches in Montreal in our plant and we would get finished parts, not like, you know, movements and cases and hands. And my grandfather used to buy from Liberty watch case. And there was an industry in North America, but We're very fortunate to have one of the best watchmakers, I think, in North America here in our head office, but we also have it in Switzerland and everybody works together, but it's very hard to get good quality manufacturing base. And let's face it, if you get dials and the feet are off, or if you get a crown and it's not, not the exact right tolerances and you have to send it down the street to have the tubes replaced or something. You just can't do that unless it's all regional around you. And Switzerland is really the only place to do it. And it's not all of Switzerland. It's in the Chaux-de-Fonds, in the Jura region. It's like different regions, but we're in the Chaux-de-Fonds. We speak English and French, mostly French. And here our chief watchmaker speaks French as his mother tongue, but he's perfectly bilingual. And we, I speak French. So that's how we get along. Canadian bilingual company. Nice. |
| James Stacy | Well, there's so much I'd like to dig into. Obviously, I want to talk about the history of the brand and also some of the more recent activations you've had, like the collaboration with Jeep and Stellantis. And then, of course, we've got the Toronto Timepiece Show. By the time this episode comes out, maybe even only days away, which will be very exciting for, I think, for a lot of watch fans. |
| Mitchell Wein | Let me tell you, we got to talk about the Jeep watch because everybody's got to come to see our Jeep collection. For sure. It was a long process to get the official license. And I feel that was one of the best collaborations two companies could do because we are so similar in our history and values. Stellantis owns the Jeep brand. And I know we make tool watches. they made tool vehicles for the government, for the US government. And they came to really be in existence starting with war production in 1941. And so did we. I mean, they actually have a history that goes further back than 1941, of course, but it was on, I don't know the name of the company, but you know, it, it, it was a merger, composition of other manufacturers of vehicles. And my grandfather in 1939 developed the Marathon brand, but it came from my great grandfather and my grandfather's older brother from the 1900s. |
| James Stacy | I think that's an interesting point because I would love to establish the history of Marathon. I think it's a fascinating company. It's a true family company. Like I said, it's a true kind of Canadian company with very strong roots and connections in Switzerland, all the, you know, the manufacturing prowess that you spoke to already. Why don't you give folks like the sort of five minute history. You told it to me some time ago when we hung out in your offices and there was stuff I learned, even though I felt like I knew the brand. |
| Mitchell Wein | Well, the history is that it was really Weinstrom Watch. One of the trademarks they used was Abra. That was started by my grandfather's older brother, Alex. He moved to New York. It was at the turn of the century and that's when wristwatches were being able to really be made at a reasonable, affordable, not really affordable, but affordable price that at least people can buy it with a two month's worth of salary in those days. And he employed his brothers and my grandfather ended up in Montreal and One of the brothers named Monia ended up, you know, he was in Geneva and what he did was he organized all the parts and movements to be shipped to New York for distribution of Weinstrom Watch. And my great-grandfather had the idea that it would be a brilliant idea to have a son in major cities. And one brother, Hyman, went to Chicago He became quite great. He bought over the Hampton trademark. I guess you're wondering why we have all these other companies. In the 1930s and 20s, there was a lot of infighting with the brothers in the business. And one brother left after another. That's what happens sometimes when wives get involved in the business or spouses. The uncle that lived in Chicago had a great business. They sold to this year's robot catalog and he owned Hampton watch. They also owned the trademark Clinton watch. They also owned the trademark Ben Ross watch of which my cousin sold, I don't know how many years ago to another company. It's funny though, uh, Ben Ross watch has gone from many different families from originally Ben Lazarus to my cousin's father, my uncle, my father's cousin, Sonny, but we've been in the same family. Marathon has been actually in the same direct family. We didn't buy the trademark. We registered it in 41 and that was it. So it was my grandfather, my father, and I. Right. |
| James Stacy | And then, so since 41, how's the business model sort of developed and kind of linked up with what we're seeing today from the brand? |
| Mitchell Wein | The thing is you can't dance at two weddings at the same time. Um, when you do something, you have to focus and you have to delegate and work together as a team. And sometimes working as a team, you don't always agree, but you, you, you have to learn how to come to a common, uh, agreement. And I think that I've seen all my life with my father and my grandfather. I saw a lot of shouting. There was a lot of shouting and a lot of fighting between my father and I, but it's because we both cared so much about the business that we actually argued with each other. Sometimes that's how business gets done. That's how business gets done. But how we focused was sometimes people plan and God laughs, but you're, you're there at certain opportunities and things aren't really by coincidence, you know, coincidental things do happen and happen to be that, uh, My grandfather was doing marathon watches and he also represented other brands in Canada from Doxa to, he also distributed Breitling at a point. And you know, one of the brands he did, which was his own, was Marathon. And it's a good brand name and it has a good ethos. My grandfather just happened to be manufacturing watches. The war broke out. What my grandfather had were watches that were good, but not jewelry grade watches. They were functional watches because people needed a watch. Not everybody could afford a watch made of gold or diamonds or 26 jewels. In those days, watchmaking was more complicated. It took a lot longer to make a watch than it does these days. the war started and, uh, he, he knew people in the government in those days, Canada only probably had a population of less than 15 million. Right. And, uh, we, in the Commonwealth, Montreal was really the base city, the biggest city in Canada and, uh, the recruiting department and war department were actually in, in the same building. And they knew each other, like, you know, it was a neighborhood, downtown was a neighborhood, McGill Street, St. Paul Street, you know, all the old Montreal where my grandfather was. And he started canning watches for the war effort and the Canadian government bought them and sent them over to Italy for our soldiers that were being based in Italy, Canadian soldiers. He did well. And I know that I've been taught from my father and he I'm sure learned from my grandfather, when times are good, put away the money because times could change and you're going to have to change over the company. And we, we had to, you know, look at other venues other than just military. And our foretray was really into timing, making stopwatches, supplying stopwatches, mechanical stopwatches. And we were very big in the stopwatch and timer fields. clocks for businesses. We supplied many clocks, probably tens of thousands of clocks to the government of Canada for all the offices in Place de Portage. |
| James Stacy | I mean, that's still part of the business today. |
| Mitchell Wein | If you go to the Diefenbunker, want to know a historical fact? If you go to the Diefenbunker, I'll give you some pictures because I visit myself. So the Diefenbunker, I don't know if you know, was made, you don't know anything about the Diefenbunker? I do not. You born in Canada? I'm just kidding. I know you are. So no, no, the Dieffenbunker is in the 1950s, they were expecting perhaps a nuclear war. And they started the project of building an underground city for parliament, just in case there was a nuclear war, a nuclear war hit Canada. So they could still operate emergency stuff and still survive after a nuclear war. And they, they built it, I think it was towards Pembroke, but it was a secret operation. And they had a parliament in there that disinfecting booze. I think there was enough room for a few hundred people living in that shelter. And if a nuclear war was to happen, all the ministers were to be moved to this shelter. And it was a big secret. The secret, though, did get let out because people saw the construction happening in a field. in the middle of nowhere. An interesting thing is, so in the tour, they explained, you should go on the tour, that ministers couldn't come with their wives or their family because there was only enough room for the ministers and support staff and military. And Diefenbaker said, I wouldn't go in there without his wife. So he didn't put his nation first. Sometimes you have to put your nation first. So anyways, in the parliament, in the, in the hospital was all marathon clocks. So in parliament, they had the, you know, Eastern standard time, that Newfoundland time. Oh, sure. And it was all marathon clocks. And the ones in the operating room are ones I never even saw. They were ones with brass cases. It must have been because we did a lot of peculiar things. My grandfather and father did a lot of peculiar things that didn't have big numbers. Sometimes we only made like 50 clocks for a certain purpose or, you know, 10 stopwatches, one second stopwatches. The Canadian government really didn't buy a lot of wristwatches in the 1960s. In the 70s, they really stepped it up and we had many great contracts from then on. Most of them were general purpose watches. The Canadian government used a different NSN, but it was the same as the general purpose watch for the US government. They used a very similar specification. So we just marked them different for the Canadian government. The Canadian government was slow on the take on tritium tubes. I think they needed some testing done. It took a while to get that decision made. After the U.S. government took on tubes in the revision spec F, the Canadian government also did that. |
| James Stacy | And what year would that have been, roughly? Early 80s? Late 80s? I think it was late 80s. Yeah. |
| Mitchell Wein | I can't, for whatever reason, I'm blanking on how long tritium's been around, but... The tritium that is in our watches now most likely comes from Ontario. |
| James Stacy | Oh, no way. |
| Mitchell Wein | Yeah. So there's great value. There's great Canadian value in our watches besides design and control and distribution and strapping and, and final assembly and inspections. The Tritium Ontario Hydro is a large producer of Tritium and they're a safe producer of Tritium and the Swiss corporation, which is MB Microtech, which makes our tubes for us. uh, uses Canadian tritium from Ontario hydro. That's very cool. Yeah. So when one of the seniors, I can't remember his name, but he, nice, nice people. But, uh, he came to Toronto because he also had to visit Ontario hydro and visit and he visited us, you know, at the same time. Sure. Tritium tubes were invented basically, uh, by a company called Saunders and Rowe, which is a British company, but they made a, special, uh, tritium tubes to light, uh, helicopter fields and landing fields in the Canadian North, because you couldn't get electricity up there. It's not like we, you know, today you have led lighting in a remote area and as you have solar generation. Yeah. Yeah. This predates everything. So, uh, there's a lot of Canadian-ness in a tritium tube that people don't realize. |
| James Stacy | I had no idea. So that's a, that's a really cool anecdote, something to learn, but it's also become something of like a hallmark for a lot of your watches, the use of the tritium tubes. There's, you know, there's, you're not the only brand to use it, but I think it is a brand like, I think Marathon uses them quite well in the watches. |
| Mitchell Wein | So history is very important and you have to know where things originate from. You know, there are certain rules that in, in society that originate from the Bible and the rules for how you make or design a product for a government comes from a military specification. And it could, what happens is as military specifications get revised and improve. So we worked with specifications four, six, three, seven, four C and it changed to D and E and F when tubes came in. But so it could be a type one watch or a type two watch. |
| James Stacy | Okay. |
| Mitchell Wein | That's for instance. |
| James Stacy | Like a barris or that sort of thing? They use those terms. That's why I'm just pointing out. |
| Mitchell Wein | I know they use those terms. And you know what? They're correct in using those terms because that is exactly how you describe the dial. It's not the watch you're really describing. It's the type of dial. So we have a navigator here and the navigator could have a geometric design dial, which is actually geometric dial. It's called a type one dial. Okay. And that comes from, I think it's MilSpec 50717. And that dates to the 1960s or in fifties. That's the type one dial. And what we've always used as a type two dial with the exception of the original search and rescue watch that I did for the Canadian government. That was the accepted dial by the government of Canada, DND, Department of National Defense at the time who we supplied. Right. Um, uh, what we were doing for the general purpose watches, which is the general infantry watch, which they bought really in the Persian Gulf war over 120,000 pieces from us, from the U S government and 20,000 from the Canadian government was they needed a type two dial. Okay. A type two dial has the Arabic numbers and 24 hour time zone. They have pluses and minuses and it depends who's using it. So, uh, the reason why government buys a type one over a type two or a type two over a type one is who's going to be using and what they're going to be using it for. And that's the same thing with what we do with a type two with a date. The reason why we were asked to do a GPQ with date and navigator with date came along in the night after the year 2000. Okay. Because law enforcement as well as other departments like the Department of Agriculture or Department of Forestry, when they're doing reports they need to know the date to write on the report. Right. And that was a reason why we developed that. |
| James Stacy | But yeah. And then I'm curious, you know, in, in expanding beyond just something like tritium, like one element of a watch design, speaking in a more modern context, or maybe in the nineties to two thousands, like to develop into the line that Marathon has now, what are the other sort of pillars of... What's interesting is the reason why we only use tritium on the type two dial is |
| Mitchell Wein | Because on the type two dials, mostly used by a war, a soldier, and, uh, they could be in shelter, uh, for a very long period of time. And they could be in somewhere where it's extremely dark and your eyes adjust to the tritium and it's 24 hours, seven, 24 hour luminosity, not very bright. But if you're using, uh, but just for search and rescue, In the old days, we used to put radium and tritium replaced radium. But when you paint tritium, there's a lot of DPMs. It's very safe when we use tritium tubes because it's gaseous and the molecules are very low and it's under 26 millicuries. But if you have to paint a type one diol, that ends up being a lot of, could be a lot of disintegration. It's hard to control it. So we use Mariglo when we do. that type one type of dial or any dial with needing luminosity, but instant, such as just going out for a dive for one hour. If you're going out for a dive for one hour and you wear a watch with just our Maraglow, such as our JSAR, you'll see it. It's really bright for at least an hour or two or four hours. |
| James Stacy | Plus you might have a flashlight. So worst case, you just quickly shine it and just like charge it up and take a peek at it. They charge immediately. That's true. That's true. And apart from the Tritium stuff, what else do you see as being kind of the pillars that create Marathon in terms of maybe the watch's identity or who like, obviously a huge portion of the business is based on government work. |
| Mitchell Wein | And the reason why is I think we've worked well with the government. I listened to what they needed. That's why the SAR watch was developed because the SAR watch was developed because it a case, you know, our tooling broke and the manufacturer wanted us to invest in new casing. And I thought to myself, why would I want to participate in making the same casing that everybody else does? And I went out east to visit my friend, uh, who was in the military and, you know, over a couple of beers and we went bowling and did different things. We talk, I said, I have to make a new case on this watch. We only sell it to the military. What don't you like about the watch? And everybody said like, you know, well, it's hard to turn the bezel, you know, when you're wearing gloves or it's really cold. In Canada, it really does get cold. Oh yeah, for sure. You know, but as well in the United States, you have to satisfy the customer that you're selling to. |
| James Stacy | No doubt. Yeah. Yeah. I agree entirely. Was there a moment when. Marathon decided to specifically start selling to the public. |
| Mitchell Wein | OK, so this is what happened in the 1960s and 70s. My father did supply a lot of jewelry stores with lineups of watches. My father had very good friends in Switzerland that supplied from their factories OEM to us, such as the Basis watch factory, which is for medium grade jewelers. And my father decided that the most honorable way of guaranteeing that when we sell something, it's going to get paid and people will appreciate it. It is because we didn't have fancy boxes or anything is if we supply to people who use the product. Right. So a big business, a big part of our business was actually doing nurses watches and really interested. Yeah. I saw our old catalogs. I was surprised in the sixties and seventies. nun's watches, all different types of stopwatches, clocks for ships, clocks for offices, clocks for government. And he made little margin, but he made a living and we grew and grew and we worked really hard. My father worked very hard and I think he saved the government so much money. I mean, there's a price to it. Like I'd rather make $5 and help my countrymen than make $20 and not help anybody. |
| James Stacy | Sure. Yeah, no, I can appreciate that, of course. And then I have to assume that there's a difference in philosophy in making or maybe more marketing or talking about a product to a government entity versus to somebody like myself who's sitting at home and goes on your website and likes the look of an FD. |
| Mitchell Wein | What happened was after the Persian Gulf War, Uh, so many people were issued our watches and a lot of watches. We didn't even put the name on it because it's important for in a contract sometimes to put no trademark on. So you just see the time and people wanted to buy from us and we didn't cause we only sold to government. We had no way of saying, okay, we're going to sell you a watch. We're going to send it by mail and you're going to send us a check and hopefully it won't bounce. And it was, it was so much and we were, so used to just doing large volume with large discounts. And you see, in the olden days, it was very hard to transfer information, drawings and everything. We had to do it by mail and then by fax. And the fax wasn't so exact. I remember my dad always had the Telex machine before there was even a fax. And if we had to send messages to a factory, we used to type it on a Telex machine and then on the tape and with punch holes and Then we push it through. And my father had a stopwatch and hopefully that only took 15 seconds because CNCP communications was going to give you a bill for, you know, $10, which is a lot of money in those days. What happened was the worldwide web came in and I have a friend, Mark, who told me about Amazon. He says he buys all this, these books on Amazon and it's, it's really easy. And, and I thought we could really build the business by changing our part numbers and categorizing everything. And there's a lot of people who are issued these watches. Why can't we sell them online ourselves? And we, we, we started and it wasn't big, but what the intention I think was, was not to sell, not so much to sell online, but to inform people as to what marathon was about and put pictures up of what a marathon watch looks like to make sure that if you are going to buy a marathon watch, through a retailer that you'd be able to. So there wasn't many people who retailed our watches. We had a few, but I realized we could do the best job ourselves. And, uh, interesting enough, we, we use our tooling to, uh, sell on special projects such as, uh, J crew. And, uh, we did, uh, some stuff with, uh, Todd's many years ago. It's been a good learning lesson of what works, what doesn't. I think in business, you're always, uh, learning what you need to do to change. And I think the best way to learn about that is by communication and sitting in a room, not, not on a computer or on a phone, but sitting in a room and looking at each other and discussing what do you think about it? And it doesn't have to be someone from the right field. |
| James Stacy | Okay. |
| Mitchell Wein | And I think that's important to bring everybody into discussions to build a business and to listen. |
| James Stacy | Absolutely. And you know, I'm curious, third generation running a watch company involved in the watch industry. Is there anything that you think kind of characterizes Canadian watch tastes versus any other place? I'm not sure that there is. It's not a leading question. I'm just curious what your perspective on it would be. Obviously we like tool watches. We're practical people. |
| Mitchell Wein | You know what? It's true. We do like tool watches. We are practical people. Canadians are very pragmatic and humble. They like the Arctic maple. That's for sure. We do some special editions for Canadians as being a Canadian company. We have a Canadian heritage. |
| James Stacy | Canadians also love Canadian themed apparel. Hats. They do. Sweatshirts. |
| Mitchell Wein | I know, I know, I know. |
| James Stacy | It doesn't have to be the first of July. |
| Mitchell Wein | Well, there's Canada Goose and there's also Roots and, you know, there's Marathon as well. |
| James Stacy | And then I'm curious, the other side of the sort of multiple disciplines that Marathon deals with is like, you guys are involved in a lot of sort of overlapping events. Like the Toronto Timepiece Show will be very much an enthusiast event. But you guys have gone now to shows that are kind of more about jeeps or about firearms and that sort of thing. How do you find all of those events align with the brand? |
| Mitchell Wein | Do you know what? I love going to those events and I wish I could go to more when we participate. I can't go to all of them because I can't travel everywhere because I really have to do other work. I have to do other work or else I have a, you know, a desk load. |
| James Stacy | Oh, for sure. Yeah. So I'm curious, we've got the Toronto Timepiece Show coming up and you've obviously got a very recent and seemingly quite successful partnership with Jeep as far as some new watches. That's what we saw at Time to Watches in Geneva not too long ago. But I'm interested for the Toronto show, what are you excited about in terms of what Marathon's working on? And if somebody comes to the show, if somebody listening is able to come to the show, what should they be excited to see at the Marathon booth? |
| Mitchell Wein | That's a great question. Because it's on home territory, it's going to be very different for us. We're going to be able to display some vintage pieces that were never seen before. And a lot of people will be able to touch these pieces. Some of the stuff I saw in the office six, seven months ago, some of the stuff you've never seen because we had some vintage stuff from the 60s and 50s and 40s in our safes. you know, retention samples, but we would never bring that to Geneva or the United States because you have to fill out special forms to bring it back into the country. It is just a red tape nightmare. So come to the Toronto Timepiece Show and come see us because you're going to see a lot of nice, interesting old pieces. You're also going to be able to try on and really see the new Jeep collection of which I believe is such a good marriage, but the dials are beautiful. The Willie is a throwback to 1941 to our original officers watch or a general purpose infantry watch and a throwback also to the feel of Jeep. We thought of everything, not only just the dials, but we are using an 18 joule hand wound movement, which nobody does. Most people use automatics, but in those days it was just hand wound and that's what the military specs always called for, including present day spec. What else are you going to see? Well, you're going to see what we've supplied the Canadian US governments and other governments over the years. And at the end of it, what I really have to tell you is we're making a launch of something very special. That's going to be extraordinary. And I know there's going to be a lot of talk about it once we release it on September 26. And we'll be releasing that at the show. |
| James Stacy | Okay. We'll keep that a secret because this episode will come up before then, but I'm excited to hear what it is. |
| Mitchell Wein | I'm just telling you. you're going to see something special and it'll be in the news because we listen to our customers and they've been asking for this for a while. And, you know, it's going to be, uh, something very special to a lot of people. |
| James Stacy | Nice. And as far as these shows go, is this, will this be one of the only chances that, uh, for public folks to see Marathon in Canada? It's not commonly that you guys are doing shows. I mean, there aren't that many shows to do. |
| Mitchell Wein | In Canada, we don't, actually have big shows as in other big countries. I mean, we only have 40 million people living here in the United States, close to 400 million. So of course they have economies of scale and they could do big shows. Of course, in Switzerland, many watch shows exist because the watch industry is very important to the Swiss economy. It's one of the main things besides cheese and chocolate. Cheese, chocolate watches, And banking. Banking is big in Switzerland. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, raclette. |
| Mitchell Wein | Melted cheese of all kinds. Yeah, bring your lactate pills, guys. |
| James Stacy | Oh, yeah, for sure. Well, look, I think it's going to be an amazing show. I'm very excited to have a home soil show, to have Brands Like Marathon showing up. We're going to do a special hangout Saturday evening. If you're listening to the show and hearing this, the details will probably be in the show notes or at the top and bottom of the show. So you We can fill in those details, but Mitchell, thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you for talking marathon. I'd love to have you on again sometime in the future. |
| Mitchell Wein | Well, thanks for coming over. Do you want a drink? Uh, sure. Yeah, let's do it. Okay, great. |
| Jason Heaton | Okay. A big thanks to Mitchell for chatting with James on this episode. Um, obviously if you want to learn more about marathon, you can visit marathon watch.com and if you're at the Toronto timepiece show on Saturday, As James mentioned earlier, don't miss Mitchell's chat at 1230 with Eric from Rico's Watches, and be sure to swing by their booth to see their lineup. That was really cool. I mean, I think, you know, it's pretty rare that you get a watch company CEO in your hometown. So that was a rare treat for you to be able to kind of just drive across town to meet with him. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, and it's a little bit unnerving isn't the word. It's disarming. He's so casual. It's very Canadian, right? Yeah. That you expect a CEO sort of response to stuff. And it's almost like he would just rather have a normal conversation. He's just a very friendly guy, easy to get along with. It was a fun conversation. I hope people really, really enjoyed it. And a special thank you to Mitchell for having me to his home and obviously for being on the show. We like having guests, especially when they have something kind of interesting to say as far as a perspective. And I think Marathon, like the reasons I outlined earlier, offers kind of a unique perspective from one corner of the watch world. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, definitely. All right, well, should we jump into some final notes? Yeah, let's do it. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, why don't you take it first here? Absolutely. So, you know, recently I picked up my Sub-200T from the folks at Rohldorf and I've been wearing it on the bracelet, which I've come to like quite a bit. But, you know, over the course of the last two weeks, I did just kind of keep thinking about putting it on something else. And I went through my watch box and it's quite surprising to me, but I don't have a lot in the way of 18 millimeter straps. especially ones like I have a lot that would be more like dressy. Yeah, which don't suit a yellow dial doxa. So I dug around for a while, couldn't really find anything. I'm still hunting for a really nice sort of shark mesh, which I think would be perfect for it. But in instead, for the moment, I found yet another good deal on an unexpectedly nice and almost ludicrously cheap strap on Amazon. So this is the Anyfit, A-N-N-E-F-I-T, two-piece nylon strap. This is an 18 millimeters, but they make them in several. It's $9, and it's essentially not too shiny, not too stiff, and surprisingly, not all that plastic-y feeling nylon strap with a quick-release spring bars and a nice, simple steel tang buckle, two floating... Two keepers, one floating, one sewn in. the strap is quite nicely made for $9, which I mean, that's a low bar, obviously. And I think if you want a really great two piece nylon strap, there's other options out there. But if you want to try out a different color, or in this case, I'm always just kind of curious, you know, do you have to spend $70 to get a great, you know, sort of nylon or sailcloth style strap? Or could you could you kind of go down several levels to something that costs about as much as a sandwich these days. And to be honest, I don't think this feels premium, but it definitely feels as good as what comes with a watch these days. Sure. Yeah. If you buy a Blancpain, you would expect a better strap than this, but if you bought a Marathon and this strap was on the Marathon, I wouldn't feel like I would let down, for example, or even if this is something that came with the Doxa. So obviously, the Diving Stars has this warm yellow dial, so I went with a sandy not quite green, beige color. And I'm actually, I'm quite happy with it. I'll probably put a photo up on Instagram in the next little while, the next time I'm out and want to get a wrist shot. But the watch takes a strap quite nicely. The 18 millimeters is so narrow that it actually makes the watch look even smaller on the strap. Like there's no, none of the bulk from the bracelet and its end links. Oh yeah. So it makes the watch wear even smaller, but it wears nice and flat. And like I said, I look Is it a perfect strap? No, probably not. How long will it last? Not as long as one made out of a better material, I'm sure, but it is $9. |
| Jason Heaton | How are the, um, the quick release spring bars? I think last time you had an expensive strap, you quickly replaced the spring bars. Are these? |
| James Stacy | Yeah, I always kind of, um, I play with the flange for a while or the little tab, like the push tab. And if it starts to feel like gritty, I'll usually, um, just grab it with a pair of really fine needle nose pliers and cut it and pull them out. Yeah. I just don't really like to trust these ones. It's one thing to trust a $9 strap to be a strap, but I've got another two bucks for good spring bars when needed. These ones feel pretty good. They feel pretty solid. They are shoulder-less, so it's not... Sometimes you get these weird ones where they have shoulders, so you could use a tool, but also they have the tab for quick release. and that always feels kind of weird, but they feel pretty robust as far as quick release goes. I'm not a huge fan of quick release, to be clear, especially on inexpensive watches and expensive straps, but this one feels okay. Good enough that I didn't immediately want to pull it out. I think the two-piece kind of canvas-y style strap that I had on the Aqualand for a while, I gave one of those to you as well, very similar in quality to this. But that one had really kind of flimsy looking and feeling bars. And I cut those out immediately. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Especially compared to the beefy citizen ones that you get with. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. They're so nice. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, for sure. Yeah. These are great. I mean, always good to find new, inexpensive straps. I mean, that's something we watch nerds never have enough of. And especially 18 millimeters is kind of tricky to find like different varieties. And I think kind of a nice sort of canvas looking nylon is a nice option. Very cool. |
| James Stacy | Love it. Yeah, I mean, you know, the docks just kind of have that military perspective or that military sort of feel in some settings, kind of like Eterna dive watches and that sort of thing. And I think that sort of like a tan strap kind of gives it that vibe a little bit. And I was just finding the bracelet very shiny. Yeah, yeah, right. So that's mine. The AnyFit two piece nylon strap for nine bucks on Amazon comes in 12 different colors or something. So you can check that out if you're in the market for a strap. But What have you got? Because yours is kind of cool. You seemed excited about this on Instagram. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. So, you know, I've had the same eyeglass prescription since I first started wearing glasses, amazingly enough. People are always surprised to hear that given how old I am, I guess. But, you know, I think I got my first glasses when I was 20 and my prescriptions never changed. So I'm also someone who doesn't like to wear contacts. I've tried it, didn't work for me. So I've always worn glasses, but that presents a problem. And that is, um, sunglasses. So if I'm swapping back and forth, I've got to have prescription sunglasses if I'm doing anything that requires, um, sort of distant viewing. And when it comes to kind of sports sunglasses also, like if you get like a heavy curved lens or polarized or, you know, some of these things like not all companies will make prescription lenses in all kinds of lenses. And years ago when I climbed Mount Rainier, I was looking for a pair of good glacier glasses that I could use and SportRX is this company out of California that specializes in making prescription sports sunglasses. And they had made up a pair of, uh, Jilbo Explorer glacier glasses that I wore on that trip. And I still wear them a lot. They're just awesome glasses, but I was looking for something, you know, I've been talking a lot about my re-found interest in mountain biking and you know, when you're mountain biking, you're in and out of the woods. It's not like out on the road, you know, it's in and out of shadow and dappled sunlight, sometimes dark. So I wanted something with like a lighter kind of orangey lens that would work in those conditions. And then a clear lens pair, um, for, for riding in the dark, you know, days are getting shorter now. And so I went back to sport RX and chatted with them about what they could do. And since my first experience with them years ago, they've actually started, they've actually introduced their own line of glasses. They still do stuff from Smith and Jill Bow and all these other big brands, but. Um, they kind of took that experience and started making their own frames and then putting the prescription lenses in those as well. So I ordered up, um, two pairs of sports glasses, you know, lightweight, um, nice and tacky. They don't slide around down your nose when you're sweat. Um, work really well with a bike helmet, et cetera. And, uh, yeah, just got them yesterday or the day before. And I, I was out mountain biking this morning actually, and I got to try out one of the pairs and I'm really happy with them. I ordered the Olsons and the Huxons if you're interested in the style specific styles, but they've got a lot of different styles. Um, but you know, this isn't really a specific note about a specific, um, frame style, but just to let people know out there that if you're needing prescription lenses in any kind of a sports glasses, whether it's glacier glasses or for skiing or, you know, they do ski goggles, they do cycling glasses, et cetera. Um, I can't say enough good things about sport RX. I believe one, at least one of their, um, staff members is a avid TGN listener. So, you know, shout out to, Oh, cool. Shout out to rusty, um, and to TJ for, for, you know, listening to TGN. Um, hope you, uh, hope you're enjoying the show. Um, but yeah, definitely, I would say they're kind of a kindred spirit in, in, in a good business. And so, uh, yeah, check them out if, if you need glasses and, um, just full disclosure, they did offer me a nice discount on the glasses I ordered given my my past work with them, with those Gilbos years ago. So check it out, sportrx.com. |
| James Stacy | Well, hey, that's an episode and I'm very much looking forward to 300 and a big thank you to everybody who's held us down for the previous 298. I hope you enjoyed this one. And as always, thank you so much for listening. If you want to subscribe to the show notes, get into the comments for each episode or consider supporting the show directly, and maybe even grab yourself a new TGN signed NATO, please visit thegreatnado.com. Music Throughout is Siesta by JazzArr via the Free Music Archive. |
| Jason Heaton | And we leave you with this quote from Marcus Aurelius who said, Time is a river, a violent current of events, glimpsed once and already carried past us, and another follows and is gone. |