The Grey NATO - 247 - WindUp Chicago 2023 With The Worn & Wound Podcast

Published on Thu, 20 Jul 2023 06:00:00 -0400

Synopsis

The podcast episode features a discussion between the hosts Jason Heaton and James Stacey, along with guests Cat and Blake from Worn and Wound, recorded live at the Wind Up Chicago watch fair. The conversation covers a range of topics related to watches, including vintage design reissues, materials like ceramic and carbon fiber, watch sizing and ergonomics, specific watch models like the new Pelagos 39 and Laurier Hydra Series 3, as well as taking audience questions. The hosts also share some personal updates, book recommendations, and tease an upcoming informal meetup in St. Paul.

Transcript

Speaker
James Stacey Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Graynado. It's a loose discussion of travel, adventure, diving, driving gear, and most certainly watches this episode 247. And it's proudly brought to you by the ever growing TGN supporter crew. We thank you all so much for your continued support. And if you're listening and interested in supporting the show yourself, please visit thegraynado.com for more details. Hey, Jason, how we doing? Still out there on the road?
Jason Heaton No, I got into I got into my buddy's house last night here in Milwaukee, you know, drove straight from venue West straight from wind up and just drove about an hour and a half north up to Milwaukee and I'm spending a couple days here kind of decompressing a bit from from a busy very social weekend. But man, I'm still glowing from from what a great show it was.
James Stacey Yeah, we had an absolute blast. Your audio sounds a little bit different. We had some technical problems. So we're recording it through Zoom, I think it should be fine. But the show was an absolute blast, just like a very busy 48 hours, right? Yeah. And then, of course, you drove in, did so with no AC, which I still find terrifying and, I guess, funny in some ways. Pretty much no problems. Everything just kind of worked out. We had a really good time. We did office hours on Saturday with Citizen. They were kind enough in helping us both get to the show and also throw a little event that evening at Great Central Brewery. So a huge thank you to Citizen and of course to The Brewery. We did a really fun recording the next afternoon with Worn and Wound, of which you'll hear half of it in this episode. I'll explain that as we get to it. And yeah, we just saw a bunch of old friends and made a bunch of new friends and saw some great watches. It's hard to beat for 48 hours, right?
Jason Heaton Yeah. It was a real pleasure to not only see everybody, but just to, well, for one thing, to reconnect with you. I mean, it had been a year, right? So long.
Audience Member 3 Yeah.
Jason Heaton Last time we met was at, um, wind up 2022. And, uh, yeah. And then, and then, you know, the, the, the first day of the show, well, sorry, the first day we were at the show, you know, I got up early and I went and participated in this wind up in a lake, uh, event that was sponsored by Ben ruse, um, and organized by our chums, uh, Chris soul, Kyle snar from worn and wound and, uh, another friend, Chris Scott, who's a dive instructor based out of Chicago and, and did a dive on Saturday morning. Saturday was a long day for me, but it was, uh, It was just a really fantastic time. Finished off with that amazing event at Great Central. I mean, I could not believe the turnout for that.
James Stacey No, no. We aren't really sure. We didn't count that carefully, but y'all didn't drink all the beer, so we knew we had some leftover beer tickets at the end of the night. So we think probably like 115, maybe 120 people showed up. At that point, because it was so much more than I kind of expected, there were so many people we didn't even get a chance to say hi to.
Jason Heaton I know. I know. Really disappointing.
James Stacey Which is kind of the only thing that I feel a little bit disappointed because it was great. The pizza was great. The beer was incredible. It's a perfect spot. Next year, I think we take the whole thing.
Audience Member 3 Yeah.
James Stacey And we asked them if they wouldn't mind serving the pizza so we could have just walked around. Yeah. But yeah, it was really nice to see a lot of you. I know a lot of you just said really quickly a hi when we handed out some tickets for the raffle, gave a watch away, gave a hat away, cantonment stuff. It was... Man, I had a great time. Talk about something I'd love to do way more. Yeah, then once a year.
Jason Heaton Yeah. Yeah, no kidding. And we had, you know, we had some folks that that flew in, uh, a lot of people that drove from a fairly wide radius. Yeah. You know, coming from, from a number of different states and yeah, I mean, I, you know, I, I'm always struck. I remember kind of this, uh, sort of after glow after, uh, last year's wind up just, just the, you know, the outpouring of loyalty and friendship and everything from, from everybody that showed up and I'm feeling it again. I think it's, it's one of these things that, sustains us both and pushes us forward to kind of keep making the show and hopefully doing more of those live events.
James Stacey It was a little bit of a case study for us with like, could we partner with a brand and do something that was really chill? Yeah. And thankfully Citizen, about as chill as they get, we got a chance to play with the watches and chit chat with Citizen, you know, at the office hours. And then we had this event and it was perfect. Everybody was happy. Everybody had a good time. I think everybody who wanted a beer got a beer. Everybody wanted pizza, got a pizza. we'd glow in the dark logo stickers, which I just love. So look forward to those in a future little, you know, kind of merch drop that we should have planned. But yeah, it was just a fantastic event. And I guess the fun thing is, is for those of you listening, who are in sort of the St. Paul area, there's kind of another little hangout happening, right?
Jason Heaton Yeah, I mean, you know, hot on the heels of windup. Blake Bettner from Warren and Weiland is passing through the Twin Cities this week for, I guess, a wedding. And he had written me, gosh, way back in man it was february strangely enough and he said i'm coming to town should we do a bit of a get together and i said well it's the week of wind up so you know i'm not sure double dipping like in the same week is going to be appealing but you know there were a number of people i mean we're far enough away that uh probably a number of people from the twin cities couldn't make the trip and blake kindly offered to to buy you know a round of beers for anybody that wants to show up so i've started you know putting the word out on the slack and um you know kind of my local network here and and we've got a little turnout already uh kind of cranked up and I just thought I'd mention it I mean this is it's tonight so when this episode goes goes up uh on the 20th um you know make your way if you can over to Lake Monster Brewing in St. Paul that's just off of uh Creighton Avenue just north of uh Interstate 94 um it's a great spot I did my book launch there a couple of years ago and it's at six o'clock and I you know I called the brewery and they're like yeah you know bring Bring folks over. We've got plenty of room and I'm really excited. So it'll be, it'll be fun. I'm sure some of the same folks that were at windup, I know Matt Ludvigson is going to be there. Um, he said he would come. Um, but then a number of people that couldn't make it. So yeah, please do come if you can. Very informal. Not, you know, we're not, not doing big giveaways or, you know, any talks or anything like that. It's just hang out, have a beer, meet Blake. So yeah, please come.
James Stacey And yeah, if you're listening, you've got today to figure out your plans. If you're listening in the morning. If you downloaded it this morning, you've got eight hours.
Jason Heaton Yeah, or if it's on your evening commute, just turn the car around and head over to Lake Monster.
James Stacey Yeah, change the GPS. Yeah, right. Get over to Lake Monster. I like it. Yeah. And that's cool that you get to do that with Blake. Obviously, he's a huge part of what's kind of the main part of today's episode, which is a chat with he and Kat from Worn and Wound. I want to get to that because it's a nice long chat. We get the second half of it to play on the show. they get the first half. So you have to go to their feed, the Warner Brown podcast feed for the first half of that chat with the four of us. And we get the second, we did this last year. It was fun to kind of do a feed share and we're doing it again. But before we dig in a little bit more into that, how about a quick wrist check?
Jason Heaton Yeah, we both got some, some cool watches from the show on our wrists today. I'm wearing, I'm still wearing the Benrus that I took diving on Saturday morning. Uh, I had, you know, there was a David Lane design or kind of friend in the strap business. He was, he had a booth at wind up and And he had a watchmaker at his booth that was doing free like bracelet adjustments and, um, you know, strap changes and things like that. And, uh, so I brought over this Jubilee bracelet that, that comes on the, on the Benrus. We had worn, uh, we all weren't wornados for the diving. So it would fit over our sleeves. And so I had this Jubilee bracelet that, that fits the watch and I had him put that on and, um, yeah, that's how I'm wearing it. I mean, this is a sweet little thing. I, you know, I talked about it a bit in the, yeah. And that's the ultra deep, right? It's the Ultra Deep. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, it's the Benris Ultra Deep. It's a 36.5 millimeter reissue of a watch they made back in the 60s. Twin crown super compressor style case. I think they just crushed it. It's got this domed acrylic crystal with an internal magnifier over the date. Nice. Yeah, it's a great piece. They didn't go heavy handed on any sort of Fotina or, you know, uh, tinted bloom or anything like that. It's just a, it's a, it's a nice little watch. And when I wear it and take it off and kind of hold it, it feels like a vintage piece, but you know, I dove with it Saturday. I'm going to take it out again. Uh, I'm headed out for a dive tomorrow morning with my buddy Chris here in Milwaukee and, and I'm going to try to get it wet again. So, um, yeah, it's passing the test and, and it's just been a fun piece to wear. I think it was kind of a big hit. I think people at the show were, were pretty jazzed about it. It's beautiful.
James Stacey Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I got a shot of it in the photo report, which will run on Hodinkee. It'll come out on Tuesday, so by the time you're listening to this, if you missed it, swing by Hodinkee. We did a little photo report from Windup, just because we saw so many fun watches. Nice. And certainly that Ultra Deep was one of them. Really pretty, really nicely sized, like a small watch that kind of wears a little bit bigger or with more presence because of the dial and the internal bezel.
Jason Heaton Really slick. Yeah, I think it's a really promising piece that a lot of people are gonna love. And then you've got a watch that we both really liked from folks that we really like as well. It's a very exciting one. Tell us about it.
James Stacey Yeah, talk about a watch that we like that checks a lot of boxes, and I do know the price, and it does release this week. So I think it's technically tomorrow, if you're listening to this day one, I think. I don't know for certain, you'd have to check their website, but it's the new Laurier Hydra Series 3. I've been waiting to see this and to comment on it until I saw it in person at Windup, and they let me take it home. So I've got it for about a week, and then I'm gonna ship it back to them. This is a 41 millimeter steel diver with a Miyota 9075 GMT. That makes it a flyer GMT, and they're selling it for $600. Amazing. Just... I mean... Like, really? Yeah. That's kind of all you need to know? Yeah. I think it's quite handsome. It has a Hesalite crystal and a Hesalite bezel insert, 200 meters of water resistance, a fully steel case, comes with a steel bracelet, which is quite nice, single sided screws. I sized it in 10 seconds this morning. It's got a few little points of micro adjust that you'll need a little tool for, but otherwise it's this nice felt sort of flat link bracelet. The case is lovely. It's 12.2 millimeters thick, and I think it wears kind of that way. Plus they say it's another 2.4 millimeters for the dome of the crystal. The crystal adds an incredible amount of personality to the watch. It distorts the dial. It really gives it quite a bit of presence. but it does wear something like twelve, twelve and a half ish sort of on the wrist, and then it's only 46 millimeters lug to lug, 20 millimeter lug width, and you have drilled lugs, a protected crown due to kind of the case shape, and then it's just this really pretty dial design that I would say is like in the same sort of head space, mid century head space is like a serica. Oh yeah. But then it's iterated with a white 24 hour reut, which is luminous, and then sort of an internal dive style dial in like a slate sort of flat blue that matches the dive bezel, which is 120 click, really nice, like as nice as 120 click bezel needs to be just accurate and smooth and light, but super clicky. It's all loomed, the bezel, the hands, the markers, the 24 hour scale, and then you have a red GMT hand or second time zone hand and a date at six. And then with the 9075, you're doing local jumping with date correction in both directions. And again, it's $600.
Jason Heaton Yeah, kind of a dream watch, right?
James Stacey Yeah, I'm wearing it. I really like it. I'll definitely attempt to buy one, like I assume many of you will. Yeah, I think these will be exceedingly hard to get for some time. I don't think you can blame a brand as small as Laurier, they're going to make as many as they can sell. right? But I think they've kind of cracked a pretty wearable, good-looking code at a price point that not many people are touching with the 9075. VEAR is pretty close with the G5.
Jason Heaton Yeah. Yeah. And one thing that I've always been impressed by with Laurier, I was chatting with them at the booth yesterday, and Lorenzo, it's a husband and wife team, and Lorenzo does most of the watch design. And he hits the mark every time. The watches are just beautifully styled. And then they even, they do this kind of clever mid-century looking advertising, you know, these kind of faux magazine ads that they had on the table. I mean, everything just feels really sort of cohesive in terms of the whole brand. And, you know, that's, that's a hard target to hit when you're, you know, a really small company with, you know, presuming a limited time and budget and that sort of thing, but they just, they've nailed it. And, and you could tell by the presence at their table, It was a hard time to even, you know, get FaceTime with them because it was always like three or four people deep every time I walked over there.
James Stacey Totally. Yeah, if you like the idea of getting into a micro brand, maybe you didn't, you haven't been down the road with a Hallios or an Aster and Banks or even like an Oak and Oscar, like some of the higher end stuff before, I think this is a great entry point. And it's a watch I'm going to be talking about for a long time because of the price point being at $600. Yes, again, I'll say it again because it'll be a major part of the commentary around this watch for the next while. Yeah, it's going to be hard to guess. Yeah. They'll figure out a way to take your name, take your number, buy it, sell it, however it works, and they'll be popular on the secondary market. But with a little tiny brand, I can't really blame their production on them. There's market factors beyond that. Yeah. It all feels really nice. It's not a watch that I picked up and kind of believed was gonna be $600. Yeah. I think even in the recording, I'm not sure which half it ended up on, but in the recording, I was talking about GMTs and I brought this watch up as a watch I enjoyed seeing and I couldn't when I asked for a price check, somebody, I think Chris in the front row said 600 bucks. I was like, really? All right, well, let's give him the benefit of a doubt if it's a little bit more. It's a nice thing. I'm pretty impressed by it. I think it's... You're kind of getting a lot of what people like. I think it's a watch that will really suit a lot of our audience. Yeah. I'll have a lot more on this. We'll do a hands on for Hodinkee with photos and the rest of it. It might actually even come out roughly around the same time as this podcast. We're still working on that element. Kudos to Laurier, always nice to see both of them at the show. One of my favorite brands to kind of check out, especially when they hit something that kind of works just like the new Hydra Series 3. So I'll have that in the show notes if you haven't seen it and otherwise if you have and you just want more, stay tuned for a story pretty soon.
Jason Heaton Yeah, two appropriate watches and watches that were really exciting to see just a couple days ago.
James Stacey So yeah, just the sort of stuff you want from Windup.
Jason Heaton Right. All right, we should probably jump into our main topic. There's a lot to cover. It's going to be a long one, and it was a good one.
James Stacey Yeah, it is going to be a long episode. We recorded for, I want to say, the better part of an hour and 45 minutes. Yeah. So just like we did with episode 201 last year, Worn and Wound gets the first half of the episode because their podcast comes out a day before ours. It comes out on Wednesday. So I will link that in the show notes. If you don't already follow them, you should. You should have them in your feed, but in the event that you don't, you'll be able to click in the show notes. and jump to that episode. We would definitely recommend you listen to that episode first. It was a pretty flowing conversation. You'd still have a good time, but it's going to make way more sense if you start at the start and then come back to our half of the episode. We had a really nice time with Cat and Blake and chatted a bunch and then had a ton of time for audience Q&A. And then we wrapped up the show and I jumped in a car to get to the airport pretty shortly after that.
Audience Member 3 Yeah.
James Stacey Pretty straightforward format. If you have any feedback, obviously let us know in the comments, hit us up on the Slack, the rest of it. I'd love to be able to do more episodes with the folks from Warner One. It's just so easy. And Blake and Kat, a huge thank you, not only for kind of having us at the show, but also for making us part of the podcast plan. So a huge thank you to everybody who came and watched the recording live and asked questions. And for the rest of you, maybe we'll see you next year or at a future event. Let's get to the tape.
Blake Buettner And maybe this is a good opportunity to kind of get a gauge on, like, the sentiment around, like, just kind of... So, like, the watch you're wearing recreates an old watch almost to a T. Of course, this has been a trend, I should say, since, you know, the Black Bay kind of kicked it off.
James Stacey Maybe even the Longines Skin Diver.
Blake Buettner Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. But now it's kind of like one of those things where, you know, brands... Is there an expectation on brands to kind of bring back old designs? I think so. Is that kind of like run its course a little bit? Do we want to see the, the micro girders pushing things? Like, do we want to see brands like, okay, well we know you've done great things in the past, but when I look back in 30 years at this era, what will it be defined by? Will it be defined by watches that look like watches from another era? Or should we have an expectation of brands that they're kind of pushing ahead at the same time?
James Stacey I think it depends on the brand. We now have a bunch that are literally just vintage reissue brands. Aquastar, I don't actually know how to pronounce this. So Nevada Grenchen, Nevada Grenchen. I've heard it two different ways. Like, I mean, I think there's, I think there's a lot of brands that like, that's going to, Volkane is back with like all throwback pieces. Right. And there's some great ones to be, I don't know. There's nothing wrong with the watches. It's just, it's a philosophy.
Affirmative responses from the audience Yeah.
James Stacey And I don't know if it is the philosophy that will mark the next decade, but definitely has marked the last one.
Kat I think there's going to be, always an audience for both. Right. And I think there's a lot of brands here that are leaning towards the vintage. And there's a lot of brands like, uh, you know, Christopher Ward is one of them that I think are kind of a mix, you know, I I've seen them sort of lean towards the more homage territory, but then they're also pushing the boundaries of things like the Belcanto. And I like to see both and, and if it's done right, then, you know, it's done right. So absolutely.
Jason Heaton I'm a sucker for vintage design. And I think, um, I don't mind at all that there are brands that solely focus on that. I was just at the Benruth booth talking to the guys there and I was like, where do you go from here? You know, you have a kind of a small collection right now of watches that are clearly inspired by and basically reissues of old watches. And I'm like, do you do a different material? Do you do a different dial colors? Do you do what? And they're like, we're kind of, we're kind of weighing those options as well. But I think, you know, you can have brands that do focus on that because that was their core. And then you can have a brand like, um, IWC that can, kind of look back, uh, at their past and, and kind of call to mind a certain watch that they used to make, but then they can do something with an interesting ceramic case or, you know, make an Aqua timer that's a perpetual calendar or something like that. It looks nothing like, uh, an old Aqua timer. And I think it's a nice blend, but I, my personal taste runs towards kind of the reissue style, if not full reissue, but sort of the vintage style, because I think that's the, that was the golden era of watches kind of 50s, 60s, 70s, kind of inspire me the most.
James Stacey Omega does a good job as well of having doing the modern and the considered and then the stuff that's like almost like one to one like a mirror.
Jason Heaton Yeah. And you look at like the Seamaster collection, which I keep looking at your plow prof. Sorry. Um, and you know, they just, uh, they just came out with their 75th anniversary collection of Seamasters and I'd love to get all your takes on kind of what you think of those specifically the plow prof, which was my favorite of the bunch. But you know, you talk about vintage design or throwback design, What they've done with the Seamaster Diver 300 is, I mean, that is a design that came out of the 90s. That was a very original design out of the 90s that now has become, I don't know if you'd even call it a modern classic anymore, but, you know, they, in my mind, I always wished they would kind of reissue or bring back the 165.024, you know, Seamaster 300 from the mid 60s, in my opinion, possibly the most beautiful dive watch ever made. You know, but hats off to them for not, you know, I mean, they're, they're just going to kind of stay the course and do their thing.
Blake Buettner Yeah. I think certain brands kind of walk a line doing this. Zenith is another one comes to mind that kind of has a whole collection of kind of heritage watches. And then also another side of the collection that's just kind of like pushing ahead with crazy type of stuff. Yeah. That's, it's interesting to hear your, your, your take on it. And it's almost kind of a preservation of, of these designs that deserve to be preserved. Which is fair, you know, and there's a lot of beautiful designs. So, personally, I like the new Plo Proff as well. I like the kind of throwback-ish shape that the case has gone back to. I just wish it was titanium.
Jason Heaton Yeah, right, right. It's a chunk, yeah. And it's only in blue now, right? So, I mean... Surely others are coming. Surely, right? We have to say it's Omega. It's Omega. And can I just... My one pet peeve about that watch is that, you know, when it was originally developed back in the late 60s, early 70s, it was designed to be a helium tight watch that did not need a helium release valve because helium could not penetrate the watch in a saturated environment. And all the modern ones have a helium release valve on them. I mean, it's, I just wish they would delete that. It was their calling card, you know?
Blake Buettner Yeah. And if you hear it, it's like kind of tucked in. Yeah. Yeah.
Jason Heaton It's definitely unobtrusive, but I just feel like they could have, they could have made that part of the story.
Blake Buettner Yeah. And it's, it's, it's still plenty capable from my perspective. As a person who swims more closer to the surface, this is a 1,200 meter, 4,000 feet. Is this like, you know, I'm assuming the wreck wasn't anywhere near that. It was close.
Jason Heaton It was about half the margin of error.
James Stacey Yeah. The, when you, when you get a watch with a big, a big water resistance number, like 1200 meters, it always makes me think of the first time I would I went to, or the only time I went to a Concorso Della Ganza in Italy. It's in Lake Como. It's crazy fancy. And you're staying at this hotel that like inspired Grand Budapest Hotel, the Tremezzo. And all I like, I grew up Canadian. Like if I see a lake, I want to jump in it. Right? Like that's all I want.
Blake Buettner Tell me you did this.
James Stacey That's all I want to do. So they have two pools, like one that's in the lake. What, what is that? And then one that's in the backyard, which is really nice.
Blake Buettner And I was going to put your pool. Where else are you going to put your pool?
James Stacey Yeah, I don't know. So I, and they're like, you know, there's, you know, half a million dollar Rivas, like dropping fancy people off in black tie. And I go out there like in a pair of Patagonia shorties and a towel that I took from my room. Right. And I walk out to the end of the dock and this guy comes out of nowhere and he goes, sir, what, uh, do you need a towel for the pool? I'm like, nah, I'm going to go for a swim in the Lake. And he's like, nobody swims in the Lake. And I go, Is it cold? He goes, yes. I go, that's probably all right. And he's, it's very deep though. I got like, yeah, I only need the top like six feet. We're all right.
Blake Buettner That's hilarious.
Jason Heaton I love thinking of, yeah, they were, they were very astonished, but I thought you were just going to drop like a stone to the bottom.
James Stacey I don't know. It's just like, like, why wouldn't you use the pool? It's beautiful. I'm like, your pool's great. This is a lake.
Jason Heaton We're never going to see you again. God's pool. Please leave your long on the dock.
James Stacey Yeah. Oh yeah. I left my, uh, what did I have? I had a datagraph perpetual. That definitely I left in the room. That must have been his concern.
Blake Buettner Yeah. Okay. Jason's gone running in a datagraph. I did.
Jason Heaton Yeah. Yeah. And Lange never lent me a watch after that.
Affirmative responses from the audience They never lent him a watch.
Jason Heaton I visited Glashütte years ago and I was staying in a hotel in Dresden and I had a datagraph and they loaned me for the trip. And I remember I had jet lag and I got up at like four in the morning and it was dark and kind of icy and cold outside. And I thought, I'm going to go for a run. And I wore my datagraph, you know, for a run. I thought it's a chronograph, you know, what else are you going to time with it?
Blake Buettner I'm a firm believer that watches are what you make of them. Absolutely. In that moment, the Datagraph was a tool watch.
James Stacey Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. I think they would have been upset if I got it wet. I think so. Granted, I sweat right through that watch in the sun at Concorso.
Blake Buettner When you showed up, they weren't like, wait, you don't know this Jason Heaton guy, do you?
Jason Heaton These Grenado guys.
Blake Buettner Never heard of them. It just dawned on me though, having a serious depth rating like this, Uh, well, I think we have a gentleman in the audience who lost a watch at the bottom of the sea, so it would survive. So if you dropped it, the watch in, uh, whatever fancy like you were at Como, then it can at least survive at the bottom of it. It'd be fine.
James Stacey You know, so I actually don't know how deep Como is, but it is very deep.
Blake Buettner It's very deep. Okay. Okay. Well then, then you would be out diving at every weekend, uh, looking, looking the next wind up in the lake will be at Lake Como. All right. Blake, take note. Approved?
Audience Member 3 Fantastic. Fantastic.
James Stacey We'll rent the spot where Bond did his convalescent after the scene with the whip.
Jason Heaton The budget is just quadrupled here. Yes.
Blake Buettner Wow. It's in lira. It's okay. I like the direction that this is just gone. Do you care about decorating on your watches, Kat? Not really.
Kat Yeah.
Blake Buettner That's smart. And quickly, circling back, of course, because we can close out on a watch that we love, that I think both of us added to our collections this year, the Pelagos 39. That was, I think, within a year release. This was a watch that, I think we've all seen this watch here. When it first came out, and this is kind of like the recent releases from them, It's kind of a, okay, that's, that's nice. There wasn't anything really all that kind of weird or anything that stood out to me as like having a particularly great character. And then, you know, I spent a few weeks with it in reviewing it. And it was one of those watches that kind of, it's like the opposite of this. It's like a watch that I want to wear every day. And then like I sent it back and like weeks later was still in the back of my, in the back of my head where I had to pick one up. This is still a watch that I wear quite often. I had it on the dive and, I went swimming with it. No big deal. It survived. I don't know what it is about this watch that has just kind of gotten under my skin a little bit, but I absolutely adore wearing it. I don't know if you guys have any feelings on the Pelagos 39.
Jason Heaton I should probably reserve my comments. I'm probably in the minority. I just wasn't a fan. I really always loved the original Pelagos, and I felt like I... This one just felt watered down, pardon the pun. It felt like the Pelagos was this very technical, Um, you know, it's kind of tutors tour de force technical watch. And, and the black Bay was kind of the, uh, kind of civilian version, if you want to say that. Um, and then the FXD has a very technical feel to it too. So the 39 felt a bit, it feels a bit like a, uh, it's a, it's a nice watch. I'm certainly it's, it's well-made and, and, and for people that are size conscious, I think it's, uh, you know, it makes sense. But for me personally, and watches are mostly about personal taste. I I'll, I'll, I'll stick with the original.
Blake Buettner people that are size conscious. I like that. Uh, so Jason, the whole like first half of my review is like that is me saying, you know, Oh, this is like the, the tutor losing the plot with the Plagos because it's very clearly this thing. And then I come around like, ah, you know, it's got these positives and then I sent it back. And then it was like weeks later that I was like, it was still on my mind.
Jason Heaton I mean, 39 is an ideal size for a watch, but, um, I still feel like if they wanted to make a smaller version, they could have kept a lot of the same specs that that were with the original.
Blake Buettner Fair enough. Kat, what about you?
Kat What did you think of this watch when you first saw it? I have a love-hate relationship with that watch. Like you, Jason, I thought that it was sort of watered down and it lost some of the specialness of the watch. I really like the OG a lot, but when I was in the office and I tried yours on, it kind of won me over. So it's a watch I'm back and forth on. Jason, you seem to spend more time
Blake Buettner with it. And then it'll kind of fine. Okay. Sure. Yeah.
Jason Heaton Yeah. Why don't you lend me yours or James can, I mean, you guys were bookended by guys that have them.
Blake Buettner So I'm also a proponent of the original, uh, we're, we're adjusting over here. Cause the gentleman has a beautiful LHD.
Jason Heaton That's the way to go. I love that one.
Blake Buettner Which is very cool with the, with a beautifully discreet helium release, uh, along the three o'clock side of the James, what was your experience with this?
James Stacey Yeah. I mean, I saw it the day it came out, you know, Rolex in Canada offered, uh, you know, photo shoot, that sort of thing. And so went and checked it out. And like, I kind of knew then that I was in a bit of trouble.
Affirmative responses from the audience Right off the bat.
James Stacey Yeah. Like from the photos. Um, I wanted to make sure that the bezel wasn't like shiny. It's bright. It's kind of iridescent, but I wouldn't call it shiny. And, and the truth is like, it, it's absolutely everything that you guys said that it is, which makes it the exact watch I wanted. It is an ergonomic champion. It disappears on your wrist. The bracelet's great. I love the tee fit. Yeah. I mean, I think like at this point I've written way too many stories about it. So to summarize, like it's essentially a perfect modern dive watch, except that the loom on the hands isn't good enough.
Blake Buettner Yeah. It's, it's a little bit weaker in comparison to the hour markers for sure. I've found that the bezel and a lot of lights outdoors, it looks like gray. It looks like light gray. So it kind of like looks like a ghost bezel.
James Stacey And the action's perfect. Loom's great. It's a fully graduated bezel. They're like all stuff I'm a sucker for. Yeah. Um, I didn't like the rubber when I reviewed it originally, and now I've worn it on the rubber for like two months. Oh, really? I love it. It's great. I just had to back it off one. So it's a little on the loose side, uh, from where I would normally wear it.
Blake Buettner And then I've now I'm, I'm just, I keep going another two, $300 into straps for 21 mil because it's just, yeah, the 21 millimeter lug span obviously throws a little bit of a wrench into like your NATO's in your drawer. Right. I've got mine squeezed into a 22 millimeter. Great NATO. And it works. It works wonderfully. Yeah.
James Stacey Yeah. I did. I didn't Erica's in 21, which I like a lot of flat gray Erica's. That's maybe like that's sweatpants for a watch. It's just so comfortable. And then I ordered up, I ordered up a canvas, a green canvas from a guy on Instagram, his post style watch straps. And it's they're like handmade and he tapered it. It's like crazy good. I don't want to destroy it by sweating in it all summer, but like it's one of those things are like, You look down the road and you're like, Oh, fall's coming. I'll have little fireplaces and I'll wear my canvas. And naturally, yeah.
Blake Buettner Be one of those guys. Yeah. Yeah. We're all like this. Uh, Kat, did you see any watches this year that you were kind of like, that's okay. But then later you're like, I'm going to need that.
Kat Yeah. The engineer, the IWC engineer, that one, it was a slow burn for me. Um, not good.
James Stacey Impressed photos. Price feels like too much. And then you have it in your face and it's good.
Kat It's amazing. Yeah.
James Stacey Which one do you like?
Kat I like the titanium. Yeah. Believe it or not. Yeah. These guys have won me over with titanium lately. And yeah, that's that's the one for me. Yeah.
Blake Buettner What do you guys think? Jason, what was your reaction to the Ingenieur?
Jason Heaton Loved it. Yeah. I think price wise, probably a little little high. But, you know, look, price is set by these companies and they they feel like they know what can sell. And if it does, then the price is right. So it's not my thing, but it's out of my range as a watch that I would consider for for what it is. In the end, you know, I've mentioned this several times, I'm someone that needs a bit of a widget. I need a bezel or a chronograph or something so that watch might not last with me. But aesthetically, I think it's a lovely piece.
Blake Buettner There's not even a button on the side of it. James, what about you?
James Stacey Yeah, no, I like it a lot. The titanium is beautiful, like really, really nice in person. Kind of reminded me of the, and it's not the same level of finishing because it's a little bit more industrial, it's a little more machined. When I went from the steel to the titanium, it reminded me of the Odysseus, where I was just like, like, you're like, Oh, this is luxury titanium. You know, I've got a Pelagos on my wrist or, or I've got, I've got a Scurfo that I adore. That's, you know, an amazing dive watch for, you know, not a ton of money. And then certain brands can hit titanium really hard. Day Baton, Lange, you know, I think IWC is doing a really nice job with that. And the, the tropical light, Colored dial was really fun as well. I could see that being popular.
Blake Buettner Yeah. The Aqua is the only one that has a polished center link. And I'm not really generally a PCL guy, uh, but I like the PCL. Yeah. But, uh, new for me.
James Stacey I love it.
Blake Buettner I'm using that. It's, but the titanium has a, a polish shamper. That's why it reminds you of the, cause the Odysseus, like every corner of every link has like an interesting facet along it that is polished.
James Stacey I've never seen a titanium watch like the Odysseus. It's stunning. It's five next levels.
Blake Buettner Yeah. And a nice side effect makes the Ingenieur seem quite reasonably priced. Right?
James Stacey Watch pricing's wild right now. It's like, it's so hard to tell somebody like, if you love it and you can afford it, then it's the right price. Otherwise find something else. Cause the options are amazing right now, but it is really hard to say like, is a new white gold Daytona worth $52,700? I mean, almost certainly to the people who can buy it, it is. I know. And it's kind of the same.
Blake Buettner That's a slippery slope to start going down, James.
James Stacey Yeah. No, absolutely. I mean, like I said, we all end up with Casio F91s. Yeah.
Blake Buettner I guess there's nothing wrong with that.
James Stacey We're $12 in. Let's go get, let's go get ourselves a cold beer.
Blake Buettner It's reasonable. So I think we can, we are, we are about at the stage where we can start opening it up to some audience questions. If you guys have anything that you want to say to us or, or ask us.
Audience Member 4 So we've talked a lot today about watch sizing in ergonomics by the numbers. And I think that's something that we as enthusiasts and journalists are definitely keyed into, perhaps to a fault. You mentioned, I think justifiably so, watch brands sort of bristling at focusing on especially just case diameter. But I have a theory that watch designers are one step ahead of everyone else in that they probably have a way to very specifically quantify how a watch wears, like a mathematical formula for what a watch is like on a wrist. And I have long thought that the first like journalistic outlet that sort of cracks that code and comes up with their own watch size factor is really going to be ahead of the game.
Blake Buettner Okay. Okay. Can I, can I, can I explain something that, thank you, uh, by the way, uh, Chris, uh, so I'll tell you the moment that I realized maybe we take these numbers too serious. is I was reviewing the 124270. This is the new 36 millimeter Explorer from, I don't know, a couple of years ago, a few years ago, three years ago, I think. So this was the Explorer returning to its 36 millimeter roots. And of course the Explorer was for its entire life, a 36 millimeter watch until the 39 millimeter, I guess, short jaunt that it had. But the 36 millimeter, the new one shifted the lug size down to 19, the lug span, I should say, down to 19, millimeters. And there's always something about early Explorers that, like, didn't quite jive with me from a proportional perspective. And I couldn't quite put my finger on it. So when I was reviewing the new Explorer 1, I looked up the golden ratio, and then I averaged the diameter to the lug span to the taper of the bracelet. And that ratio came out very close to the mass ratio. In the original one, the same ratio was, like, much So in your, in your, in your thought of like, you know, maybe the designers know something that we're doing, or they're thinking about this on a level that like, that's the kind of thing that I can picture them. Okay. How do we tighten up this watch as a whole on the wrist where the proportionality of everything kind of sings better together that probably nobody would do except there unless they were like reviewing a watch to do something like ridiculous like that. Uh, but that's when I, I also, as soon as I finished like calculating that, I was like, I was, Should I put this in here? Is this too much? Is this too... Are we too far gone?
Affirmative responses from the audience And that was my other thought. Should we start doing this to every watch and we can get that golden ratio? Yes.
Jason Heaton Yes. How about your plow prof? Have you calculated that?
Blake Buettner That's why I was like, I got to walk with... This is too dangerous. It's too dangerous.
James Stacey So I've got a spreadsheet I can share with you because I've been working on the idea of there being a standardized relationship between case width thickness, lug to lug dial size to case size ratio. And so like I go with watches that I like for me are perfect on my own wrist. So I would start with like the Explorer two, the 16, five 70. And that one comes out like a, it's like a 0.84 on the math. The, I would love it if you could put a number, some sort of a number and somebody could go like, Oh, my wrist doesn't suit a 0.84. Right. And then if it was like a 0.84 H it's heavy 24 L it's light, like, Just make it a little bit easier for you to have some confidence when you buy something on a website, right? But I'll share that in the Slack, the quote unquote, yeah, golden ratio or whatever sort of spreadsheet I've been working on. I put some time into it about a couple of years ago.
Blake Buettner You could dial it into your own ratio. So it's like the James Stacy wearability index.
James Stacey I think like ideally you would know like the size of your wrist and also like the shape of your wrist. Yeah. And then it would give you a range that would work theoretically. And then there'd be watches like the Ploprof, the Aqualine that would just like numbers make no sense. Outliers. Complete outliers.
Blake Buettner Jason's about to walk out of this room right now.
James Stacey I don't think I ever shared that spreadsheet with you.
Jason Heaton This is disturbing. I think the trouble with this is the wearability is entirely, I mean, it's so individual, like every single person in this room, I look out here, I see so many wrist shapes and sizes. You know, I have watches that, um, you know, occasionally I lend a watch to my dad or something and he's a, he's a big guy and like he'll put it on. It's just, it doesn't work. And it's like, uh, you know, cat's wrist is different. James's wrist is different. And some people have flat wrists. I have a pretty flat bony wrist. Some people have very round wrists. And so, um, it even comes down to the strap that's on the watch.
James Stacey The strap makes a huge difference.
Jason Heaton That's such an intangible. It's so difficult to, to determine that. I think there must be another column to your spreadsheet that relates to... I can add you as a collaborator.
Blake Buettner Yes, this has to happen.
James Stacey I need more data. But I think the strap is the other... That's like a really good point. Like, you can change a watch with a strap. There's watches I adore on one mount and don't like on another, like wouldn't wear.
Blake Buettner That's why I included the taper of the bracelet in my measurement, because to me, that's all a part of... But you think the taper changes the way it wears, the way it looks?
James Stacey Both.
Blake Buettner Visually on that watch. It did. It was, it was both for me because that was the thing that I couldn't quite put my finger on with the originals. So cool.
James Stacey Work in progress. Yeah. Thank you for your question. I'm looking, I'm seeking educational grants. If you open that up to the public for everybody to contribute to, to start filling stuff in crowdsourcing, I should just make a little tool where you just, when a new watch comes out, you enter in the three values and it populates it onto the spreadsheet.
Blake Buettner Uh, is there, is there any other questions? Anybody?
Audience Member 1 All right. So you guys talked a little bit about watch materials, titanium on the new Pelagos and some other things like that. One that I'm always curious about is I love the idea of a ceramic watch. I think they're super cool. And getting to see a few here in the new ones from Zodiac, every time I actually get to hold one, I don't like it. I don't know why I'll go home, look at it online and love it again. But ceramic is just not a material that's jive with me in the metal, or I guess not in the metal, but you know, in person. I just want to know what your guys' thoughts on ceramic and other materials like forged carbon were.
Kat Yeah, that's a material that I go back and forth on too. It's a tactile thing that you feel when you pick up the watch and for a long time I was that way with titanium. I did not like titanium, I hated it. And it's just one of those materials that's grown over time. There's been watches that I've just loved and ended up buying. over time, get used to. I don't have a ceramic watch. I don't know that I'll ever pick one up again. Cause I'm, I have this great fear that I'm just going to bang it up against the wall or brick or something and bust the watch. But, um, that's just because I'm clumsy. It's a, it's a material that I like the look of though, too, when I, when I see it. And then again, it's just that it's the weight of it. It's feel, it's just, it's, there's something there that's, uh, that's off putting to me a little bit.
Jason Heaton When it comes to materials. I mean, I think ceramic has never quite, uh, gelled with me. I love titanium. I think it's such a great material, the way it feels on the wrist, the lightness, corrosion resistance, etc. I like the look of carbon fiber. I'm not sure, not carbon fiber, but forged carbon. I think the carbon docks are really cool. Some of the APs that they've done. The watch I was going to bring up was that the Tissot Cedar Rail? The Cedar Rail. What does that mean? That's carbon as well?
Blake Buettner That's a composite as well.
Jason Heaton Like cool watch. Like I think they're light and they're kind of interesting to feel like they don't feel like anything else.
Blake Buettner Also has a sailboat timing mechanism on it.
Jason Heaton There you go. Yeah. We're racing. Full circle. Cool watch for sure.
Audience Member 4 Yeah.
Jason Heaton Yeah, I don't, I don't so much have the fears of breaking a ceramic watch, but I just, I haven't warmed up to the look of them yet on any specific one, but I think carbon's cool and I love titanium, but most of the stuff I have is steel.
James Stacey I think for me, the reason ceramic doesn't work is I don't like how perfect it is aesthetically. I like that steel can have multiple finishes. I like the way that it moves in like brush steel in sunlight is awesome. titanium that's well finished in sunlight. It's like it's however the watch looks on your wrist and you're walking down the street when you check the time and don't even remember what time it is because you're just looking at the watch. And yeah, the ceramic has never done that for me. There's there's exceptions. There are brands that are brushing ceramic. I've seen stuff from Bulgari that I can't afford. That's like gorgeous. And it makes a lot of sense. And it works. And then when it comes to carbon fiber, I'm just a complete fan. But the thing I always worry about is saying carbon fiber or carbon composite or forged carbon. These all suggest that there's like 30, 40, 50 different ways to make this sort of case. And I don't know actually which ones are the best ways or the not best ways, right? It's my understanding, at least, you know, some years ago, if you were doing layup carbon, essentially forming a block and then milling the watch out of that block, that's pretty good. But there's other options that are maybe more inexpensive, less helpful when it comes to some of the stresses you put a watch through. Right now it's a little bit of like a term that's meaningless. It's carbon. That could mean that it's mostly plastic or resin to my understanding where exactly. And then there's that, then you get the bio ceramic stuff with the moon swatch, which is like largely plastic. And I don't think that watch should be embarrassed of being plastic. It is what it is. It's clearly not hurting its sales, but yeah, I would love to see more carbon, but I would also love to see more like, like when even with Tudor who I adore, like it, When they launched the two new FXDs and Carbon Composite, I had to like write them and ask like, is this a carbon case or is the movement in a metal case, an inner case that has an outer shroud? And that's typically how it's done. I think that's probably very wise from a servicing standpoint or longevity standpoint. With something like carbon, like let's say the Doxa or the Tiso, The thing that I still don't know, and I'm probably at the point where I just have to like be the Guinea pig is I don't know how well they actually like live up to daily wear and tear. You know, if you hit an edge of a carbon 300 on that really strong case line, does it chip? That'd probably be okay. Does it like warp? Probably less good. Does it kind of stress fracture towards the lugs? Even less good? I don't know.
Blake Buettner Yeah, it's interesting because this is obviously something that is coming down into more approachable and price points, which is great, I think. And I like seeing brands get creative in this way. You know, the Saritanium from IWC comes to mind, which is kind of like an interesting mix. If I'm not mistaken, we've got a gentleman in the back, Zach Kazan, wearing an IWC watch made of Saritanium. So go check that out if you want to see it afterwards. Sorry, Zach. If you want to, if you want to check that out, I like how that one works. Totally. I have one ceramic watch and I haven't really like put it through its paces on anything, but I would. And it's, you know, I'm almost embarrassed to say, I didn't really realize that when I bought it. Like I just like, and I will say my take on this is more kind of like, I, it's interesting to me, but it's not going to be the thing that pushes me over the edge to buy a watch or, or to like, like, Oh, well, I don't really like that watch, but Oh, it has a ceramic case. Oh, now I really like it. It's, the whole thing has to work together for me. And I just happen to really like the design of this watch. It's a Bell and Ross multimeter with all those colorful, it's barely a watch. It's more of a glorified tachymeter, but it has a black ceramic case that feels like bead blasted, which I, which I quite like. And I know Rado has full ceramic cases that are kind of a mix of finishes and they're all kind of over the place. But to me, like really has to work as a whole together. And that's not going to be the one element that pushes me over into like Oh, now I like it. You know, like, I have to like the way the watch looks and the story and a bunch of other things. And, oh, if it's serotonin or ceramic or titanium or whatever. Oh, cool. And, you know, I guess there's certain materials that I might be a little concerned, more concerned about than others. But in generally, that's not like pushing me one way or the other. I just like seeing it be more prevalent within watches that have much broader range of prices today, and plenty of which are out that door right there. Thank you. Thank you for your question. A solid question.
Audience Member 2 The gentleman with the black lung on. So earlier this year, I was looking at a CWC 1983 reissue and asking a group of people what they thought about it. Jason, you replied and said, hey, that's one of the best bezels out there. I bought it. And, you know, that's the first thing that I where my mind went to like, all right, let's see what this is. So it's a 60 click and that bezel is just amazing. Since then, to me, the bezel on a watch is what I've been paying attention to every single watch that I put on nine out of 10 of them have a bezel because that's that's where I you know that's where I lean towards but a watch could fit great it could look great but if the bezel wasn't right I probably would not buy it so I'm just curious for you guys if it's you know what is it that matters most to you and it doesn't have to be long term like for me that this could be a little niche for a year who knows but is it you know, is it loom? Is it, uh, you know, is it the strap? Is it, what is it about a watch that really matters to you guys?
Blake Buettner The bezel, obviously. No, I, I, I think it's probably different things on different watches and like the bed, the knurling on the edge of that bezel is to die for. And, and, and there's certain like little details, especially when you handle a lot of watches, you start, you, you, you fixate on some of the smaller things. It might be easier to kind of pass over. Um, And like small details, like a finishing on the edge, the knurling of the bezel on that watch is just stunning. But I think you become attuned to what works and what doesn't when you handle a bunch of these things. And it's tricky territory when you're reviewing these things. And I've maybe talked about this before, but, you know, it's like our job, we're charged with kind of being able to say, this is good for this price range because we've handled a hundred other watches kind of in this price range and experienced a lot of little details like a bezel on a thousand other watches in our lifetime. So we'll be able to kind of articulate, well, it's good because X, Y, Z. And, um, uh, whereas a lot of the people that are going into a store to buy it have not experienced a lot of different watches and they might like it for other reasons, but if they hear us say, well, this is no good, but they may not have ever noticed something like, like the bezel where you, you know, you're, it's, it's fortunate that you can, try out a lot of different bezels and kind of come to a, Oh, this is a good one or this is a bad one. Um, and you gotta be able to grip it. Yeah. Yeah. Then that's, that's like a practical, um, consideration. So it's a, it's a little tricky for me to kind of like quantify those things in terms of like, well, if you like a watch, but the bezel kind of like sucks, then that's, that's like a personal thing. Right. And it becomes, and it becomes that. So I don't know if it's like a make or break type thing for me, but, but I've become attuned to certain details. like how some things are finished or how certain things like fit together or how a bezel turns. Um, it's, it's a hundred different things. And sometimes it's hard to put your finger on it, but you know it when you, when you feel that the Seiko GMT that we were talking about earlier, the prospects, uh, one like that, that's one that you, you put it in your hand and immediately you can tell that something is elevated about it. But then it takes maybe a little more digging to figure out exactly the little few details that fit together that elevate it.
James Stacey Yeah. And I would say also on the alternative, like the bezel on the SSK double Oh three, Seiko 5 GMT because it doesn't click. I like kind of very, very quickly cooled on the watch, a great watch, but I actively recommend to people because it's a fantastic price point. And it allows you to start if you're getting into watches, like to have a footnote for certain size, like an SKX is a nice middle zone. It's not thin, but it's not really that thick. It's not big, but it's definitely not small. Um, and, and you're also never really that cornered in when you buy an SKX or an SSK, like you can change You can do anything you want to that watch. You got a lot of options, but yeah, the bezel for me is super important. The CWC is ridiculous. They've no, no right to be that good. Kind of the same with the Aqualand, like a good 60 click bezel is something really special and not that common because I think they're a little bit harder to execute upon. I would say I've given watches passes on stuff like crowns because you just, if it's an automatic, if I wear it enough, I don't have to use the crown. But the bezel is definitely important. I think legibility really gets under my skin long-term. It's why, like, I've never really connected that well with a Daytona. I just don't find them that easy to read quickly. Like, they're beautiful. They're cool. Like, you're wearing a Daytona. It's a Daytona. Like, it's good. But it's also like a car you can't see out of. Right? Like, I'm not saying I don't want to drive it. I'm just saying I maybe don't want to drive it every day.
Blake Buettner Is that a Berthier, by the way? 83? Yeah. Okay. It's a fellow 83. Yeah. Wisconsin. Yeah. Happy 40th or almost 40th. So, Kat and Jason.
Kat Yeah, I think for me, something that's really surprised me in the last year that I've been paying attention to, and maybe it's because I photograph watches so much, is the side profile of the watch. And it's something that I almost can't tell on my own wrist. I like, I have to see it on someone else. but there's something about it. And I'm just like, that is the watch, you know, and, and a lot of it is with dive watches and their bezel and how they look on the side. And it's just something that I've become enamored with. And I've gotten rid of watches that I just don't really like the way it looks on the side of the case, which is a really weird and peculiar thing, but that's what we do. So, you know, um, and, and legibility is a, is a great point too. I've, I've sold watches that are just hard to read and they just don't last in my collection and sort of picky about that too. If you're going to spend that much on a watch, you got to be able to read it.
James Stacey Yeah. I think that's a big point too. Like seeing a watch on someone else is really how you should see it. Uh, that's why I think like wrist shots are pretty important in, in stories because, uh, like even now I look around and I'm looking at watching like pretty much all of these, uh, lusting after like a lot of watches that I see on other people's wrists.
Jason Heaton It's super fun. I, I'm, I guess it's a sign of the times that none of us said precision or accuracy, you know? Um, But I think it's easier to answer the question, what isn't important to a person with a watch? And I think for me, I really don't give a hoot about in-house movements. I also don't really care much about, to a certain degree, about finishing. I think it probably goes to the types of watches that I like and buy and I own. I think the way something, a movement specifically is finished is just not important to me. And just speaking from my own kind of preferences and the ways I use watches. I think for a dive watch, you know, really a lot of it comes down to, and I know you can change straps, but the strap a watch comes on or the way the strap fits on a watch or the ease with which you can switch a strap or a watch will take a strap is important. Um, bezel grip is huge. Um, and kind of the feel of a bezel. I think, you know, citizen did that, uh, the challenge diver. And I think my one quibble with that was the bezel felt a little bit light Um, you know, it's one of these intangibles where you feel it and it's just like, yeah, it's just not quite there. Whereas like this Aqualand or that if you go out and try that thousand meter crazy eco drive that they have at their booth, like with the locking mechanism, it feels so precision. It's just, it's such a fun piece to play with. I think loom is important, but I always chuckle when I think about, uh, accuracy because you can really tell that we're kind of the people we are kind of watch enthusiasts that we, we, we aren't, I mean, it's kind of strange that we aren't concerned with that, right?
Blake Buettner Yeah, a little bit. And we probably should be too.
Jason Heaton That's why I mentioned that about the Seiko, you know, like, well, and especially given the emphasis that so many brands put on, like Metas certification costs and whatever, they're really playing this up. And very few of us, I know you just bought a, James just bought a timing machine not long ago and he's been using it and he's been using it in reviews and things. And I think that's, that's interesting. And I almost would like to see that present in more reviews than, than even just the dimensions of a watch because I think, you know, yes, I think watches are 90% aesthetic. I think we, we look at them. It's a, it's a looks thing. It's a, it's a, the way they look on your wrist and how much, you know, how much you smile when you see it on your wrist. But I think, I mean, accuracy, I mean, come on, we've got to hold it to that basic, you know, kind of the basic requirement of a watch, right?
Blake Buettner All right. Well, what, I mean, to bring it back to like the material question, and I'll say this, like I'm, I'm impressed by what, like the medicine with all the stuff that I see people doing, I'm very impressed by it. And it's the same with like in-house movements. If they're doing something interesting, that's cool. But it's not the thing that usually is like pushing me one way or the other on it. It's not going to stop me from buying a watch I like, but it's also probably not going to like get me to buy a watch that I'm like, kind of, kind of cold on.
Jason Heaton I remember when Omega, um, you know, in the mid early two thousands, they were starting to really play up the coaxial movements. And I thought, What a weird thing to, to use in their advertising. It's really tout. Cause I'm like, does the average person who walks in and buys an Omega, can they relate to what that means? I mean, it's, it's, it's such a level deeper than most people. You can talk about accuracy, but then like to talk about, you know, the escapement. I mean, it's, it's just such a, uh, sort of ethereal concept to the average watch buyer, but it sounds cool. It certainly does. Yeah.
Blake Buettner Right. And so does serotoninium sort of superlative, right?
Affirmative responses from the audience Yeah.
Blake Buettner Yeah. Relative. Yeah. We might as well put it on the dial. We see what they're doing. They're obviously like they ran, you know, the average Joe walks into a marketing deal. That one doesn't have that. It sounds good. Like, let's go. But it's, but being able to say this will keep accurate time to within a second a day that I think is more tangible. Like, Oh, I understand that, you know? Yeah.
Jason Heaton And I think like with a brand that has stood out for me for that more than even Omega or Rolex or some of the bigger Swiss brands is Grand Seiko. You know, like you talk about like a 9F Grand Seiko quartz movement or, or the spring drives. And it's like when they're talking accuracy within seconds a year, I mean, that's, that's impressive to me that that stands out or the anti-magnetic qualities of some of these watches. I think that's also an important thing too.
Blake Buettner Definitely. I have a question just real quick. Do you all open up time.gov to set your watches every day when you put them on?
James Stacey I use the clock and the Houdinki app. which references the same.
Blake Buettner All right. Mr. Hodinke clock. Then I get in there.
James Stacey I learned a little bit about the leap year. Okay. I'm in there. Yeah.
Blake Buettner Okay. All right. What about you guys? Do you, do you use the time that I go? Do you know what I'm talking about?
Kat You, you hack the seconds hand right at 16 and you wait for the, I just use the clock on my Apple iPhone and match to that. Oh, okay.
Jason Heaton That's what I do too. Just use my phone. Okay.
Blake Buettner I mean, otherwise, if we're hearing about like the second a day, like it's got to be to something, right? Set to somebody. Does anybody else use time.gov? Yeah. A few of us. Okay. Okay. Even this guy. Okay. Awesome. Yeah. It's something that I have to, if the movement hacks, I cannot help myself.
James Stacey I'd rather stop it at zero. And even if I don't get the reference to the time perfectly, I want to, I want it at zero and I want to start the minute hand at the marker.
Blake Buettner Yeah. All right. Do we have time for one final, one final question?
Audience Member 3 Same question as last year. There's a lot of people that aren't here, and this doesn't feel like a GrayNado podcast without a weather update and a moving update.
James Stacey The second one was? Moving update. Oh, I'm fully moved. I can give you that one. I'm fully moved in. The boxes are gone. Today in Toronto, it's a high 20s, 27, 28. Pretty muggy, I think, according to my wife. She's currently on a fairly sizable bike ride to a thrift store. I think that that's probably the update. It's it's definitely summer. It's very similar weather to here.
Jason Heaton Yeah. And on my side, I haven't moved in 20 years. And yeah, I mean, the weather outside here is I mean, you've all experienced it. It's it was kind of a sweaty day yesterday. You know, I drove down from Minneapolis on Friday and in an air conditioned vehicle. And it was it was it was a bit of a masochistic exercise. No cruise control, no AC. And then I hit the Chicago traffic and it was I was second guessing the whole decision.
Blake Buettner The 90s got a lane closed coming from the West into Chicago. Horrible. Jason, the state of Wisconsin will welcome you back anytime. You're ready. I will be headed there as soon as we're done. And I speak on behalf of all Wisconsinites in this room, I'm pretty sure. You know, anytime you need to make that move, we're here for you. What about you?
Kat Nashville? It's probably hot as hell right now. Probably hot as hell.
James Stacey That's what they say right on the screen.
Blake Buettner Hot as hell. Don't worry about it. It's hot. All right, well, this has been a huge treat. I can't thank James and Jason you enough for coming on. It really means a lot. And to be here in Chicago to do this with us, it's just a huge treat. So thank you. It's a tradition. It's a tradition. Thanks for having us. As is diving in the lake. Lake what? 2023, 2024 and beyond. We'll see where this goes. And maybe Lake Como coming soon. It was approved. You all right? Yes, we're all witness. Clooney will put us up in his backyard. Maybe we can bring a bunch of tents or something like that. Well, thank you all for being here. It really means a lot. And thank you all for your presence here in Chicago at the Wind Up Fair. Diving, super incredible and humbling to meet each and every one of you. It was just awesome. We'll have more on the Benris Thank you.
Jason Heaton All right. Well, there we go. That was our half of the Wind Up Chicago, Born and Wound shared podcast. I hope everybody enjoyed it. I thought it was a blast. There's something very different about doing live podcasts. I think there's a certain energy in the room that we don't get when we're just doing it over Zoom like we normally do. And I really enjoyed that. It was great.
James Stacey Yeah, totally. I had a blast. Again, a big thank you to everyone who came out. We were well represented, especially in the front row. We had some tough customers up front. there to support us. So I appreciate it. It's always a highlight. Last year, we did a lot of episodes from the show. We talked with a bunch of kind of brand leaders and that sort of thing. And I kind of missed that this year, if I'm honest. But the show was kind of formatted a little bit differently. They were doing a little bit less of that sort of space. And I'm hoping that we can maybe replicate something like that in New York in the next few months. We'll just have to see if we can make that work for the schedule. Yeah. Beyond that, Jason, you want to hit up some final notes and put a bow on it?
Jason Heaton Yeah, good idea. You know, I spent a lot of time driving this past weekend in the, uh, put the defender down from, from Minneapolis straight through to Chicago. It was nine hours door to door with a lot of traffic and it was pretty hot, whatever. So my kind of way of doing that sort of trip, which I did, uh, done before it's a loud vehicle. So I use my AirPods with a noise canceling on, and I know, you know, probably get some feedback from people saying that's not safe, but, uh, uh, we can, we can cross that bridge when we get to it. The noise cancelling does help with the road noise, obviously, but I also listen to audiobooks and it passes the time really nicely. The book that I'm just about done with now is called Aquanaut by Rick Stanton. It's not necessarily a new book, it's been out for a little over a year, maybe a year and a half. Rick Stanton, if you're not familiar, is one of the British cave divers who participated in the rescue of the 13 Thai soccer team players that were trapped in that cave, the very famous rescue story. A few years ago, they made a couple of movies about it. His character was played by Vigo Mortensen, who did a great job. But Rick wrote this book, uh, with a coauthor called Aquanaut. And the audio book's tremendous. I mean, it's great. It's great. It's a great story, not just about the. The rescue, which he goes into a lot of detail about, but the book is formatted such that each chapter or sort of split back and forth between going back in time to his early years, getting into cave diving and his kind of full career back to the eighties, um, all up through the present and all the places he's dived and some of the rescues he's done, he's done, and you know, his attitudes about equipment and, and, and his life and things like that. And then it cuts back to, to the, the, the Thailand situation. Um, And that whole rescue just still boggles my mind how they carried that out and what heroes those guys were and everybody that took part in that. So, um, check it out. I mean, it's, you know, great diving books are always fun to come across cause there just aren't a ton of them. And I would put this up there. I put it off for a while reading, but it was, it was a great one to listen to on the way to wind up. And I'm about three hours from the end and I'm a little sad that I won't have it to listen to on the drive home from Milwaukee. I'll have to find something else for that. Uh, remaining five or six hours I've got on Wednesday. So... Heat too. Yeah, check it out. Yeah, exactly.
James Stacey That's great. That sounds like an amazing recommendation. I love the idea of doing it as an audiobook as well.
Jason Heaton Yeah. So check it out. I'll put a link in the show notes. We can link to the audiobook that I'm listening to from Apple Books or just Amazon or wherever, however you'd like to read your books. So check it out. How about you? What do you got?
James Stacey Yeah, mine this week is actually a topic I had with a couple fun conversations about in Chicago based on this article, which I originally thought was written by somebody at the intercooler. But it turns out it was there's another reason why I enjoyed it from Jalopnik. It was written by Elizabeth Blackstock is incredible. And it's a whole thing about this will be for the F1 fans in the audience. But I think there's a fair number of you. It's a whole thing comparing Red Bull racing, the current era of Red Bull racing, to the sort of golden era of Ferrari's F1 program under the guidance of Enzo Ferrari. So recently, for those who care but don't know, Red Bull Racing has two teams, Red Bull Racing and AlphaTauri. And one of the drivers for AlphaTauri is a brand new driver, a rookie named Nick DeVries, and he's been cut. He lost his seat already, which is fairly uncommon to not let somebody have a whole season. Yeah. But it's not uncommon for the folks that run Red Bull. They are. This is how they operate. So Daniel Ricardo is going to take his seat. He's been sitting as the reserve driver for Red Bull, which puts him in contention or as an option for some seat time for AlphaTauri. So it's a big kind of shakeup. It's one of the big news items from F1 this year. They're playing a different sort of game at Red Bull than everybody else is with their drivers. And there's no option to not be performing. So DeVries, sadly, I don't think he had placed higher than 12 in any race, so no points. So Elizabeth Blackstock is one of the co-authors, along with Alanis King, for Racing with Rich Energy, How a Rogue Sponsor Took Formula One for a Ride. Also an incredible story, a book I haven't quite finished, but I've enjoyed every page of it so far. I do really enjoy her writing, and I think this is an interesting perspective comparing like kind of suggesting that there's like a methodology to some of these things that that are very different from one team to another. So if you're into Formula One, or you like kind of the politics of it, it's a it's a pretty fun story. And Elizabeth does a beautiful job putting it all together. Nice. Very cool.
Jason Heaton Yeah. Well, that was a It's a good long episode, I think, you know, kind of a fitting way to kind of close out what was an amazing weekend. And I'm glad people, even if you couldn't make it to the show, you can kind of get a little vicarious glimpse into it through this episode, this shared episode with Warren and Wound.
James Stacey And yeah, as always, thank you so much for listening. If you want to subscribe to the show notes, get into the comments for each episode or consider supporting the show directly, and maybe even grab yourself a new TGN signed NATO, please visit TheGreyNATO.com. Music throughout a siesta by Jazzar via the free music archive.
Jason Heaton And we leave you with this quote from Yogi Berra who said, the future ain't what it used to be.