The Grey NATO - 137 - If We Were Watch Brand CEOs
Published on Thu, 11 Feb 2021 06:00:22 -0500
Synopsis
This podcast episode covers a wide-ranging discussion between two hosts, Jason and James, on various topics related to watches, travel, and gear. They discuss their current wristwatches, the challenges of winter weather, James' upcoming novel, and their picks for the week. The main topic revolves around a hypothetical scenario where they act as co-CEOs of different watch brands and discuss potential changes or improvements they would implement for each brand.
Links
Transcript
| Speaker | |
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| Jason Heaton | Hello and welcome to another episode of The Gray Nato. It's a loose discussion of travel, diving, driving, gear, and most certainly watches. This is episode 137. We thank you for listening. Jason, how are you doing? Oh, it's cold here. |
| James Stacey | It's cold. I mean, we haven't had a proper winter in a few years and we're feeling it. It hasn't been above minus, I guess it would be about minus 20 or so centigrade for most of the week now. So. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, that's certainly cooler, cooler than here. So that you're, uh, you're getting extra winter, but it's snowing cold here and I'm not really going outside very much. |
| James Stacey | Oh yeah. You guys got dumped on, didn't you? Snow. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Other than that, it's, uh, it's funny when the weather's, uh, nice. So when we get good winter weather, Deshani and I do a lot more hiking and, and go to the, the downhill ski area and do some skiing. But, but when it gets this cold, despite her, fancy suit. She, uh, opts to stay in like a smart person. And so that, that leaves time for me to go cross country skiing. So I've been really bundling up and going to some of the local trails and getting back on my cross country skis, which I'm encountering such an annoying problem because when it's this cold, I want to cover my face, but then my glasses fog up. I mean, it's, there's no, there's no good solution to it. I can't, you know, using products like cat crap or, you know, whatever to anti fog stuff. Um, just doesn't, doesn't do the trick. So I'm either going without glasses and a balaclava to cover my nose or I'm going with glasses and keeping my face bare. |
| Jason Heaton | I mean, would it work to use like a, like downhill ski goggles? |
| James Stacey | That might be my next, uh, my next thing, if it stays this cold, because that would isolate my eyes from my breath. |
| Jason Heaton | So yeah, we'll see. And, and I'm just, you know, as if, if it's one of those like nice sunny days, it's just blinding. Yeah, yeah, exactly. You definitely want something on there. Otherwise you get home and all you, all you see is kind of like pink stars for |
| James Stacey | Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that's, uh, that's kind of, kind of what's going on here. I've, I've been working hard on the novel. I'm, I'm aiming for an April release for, for depth charge. And, uh, so I, you know, writing the book was, was difficult enough, but this end game of, of figuring out, you know, marketing, shipping, printing options has become, um, it's not unpleasant. It's just a lot of work. And so I've been working with a local printer to get quotes and ideas and choose paper and then trying to figure out the whole shipping side of things. I've been frustrated with, with us postal. So I'm exploring some other options and then I'm working with a really fun designer over in, in London who's been helping me out with the book cover and also some cool animations and some, some stickers and some fun freebie stuff that I'm going to put together here. Um, so keep, keep an eye on the depth charge novel Instagram feed for, uh, for more, more info about that. But, uh, yeah, fingers crossed, uh, late April release for, for the book. And, um, I, I've promised my, my paying subscribers on my sub stack, uh, newsletter that there'll be getting an excerpt of the book in a few weeks and then, uh, early order access to it. So, um, yeah, so it's, it's pretty exciting. It's coming down to it by, By this time in, you know, two months or so, I should have a physical book on my desk, which I'm pretty excited about. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh boy. That's super exciting. Yeah. I can't, I can't wait to read it and to see, you know, what you've got planned for the rollout. You've, you've, you know, shared some of the little details with me. It sounds like a lot of fun. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, it, yeah, that's going to be, that's going to be a nice way to kick off a spring summer. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Good timing. |
| Jason Heaton | Read a few pages, jump off the dock. |
| James Stacey | Exactly. That should make a waterproof version. Have it come in its own little dive bag. |
| Unknown | Oh yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Okay. Don't, don't tempt me. With the, with the, with the hard zipper or the, or the little roll top that they clip over. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. Yeah. Totally. |
| Jason Heaton | Would be really cool. Just, just sized for the work. Yeah. Yeah. Which I guess then would work for your phone and other stuff. |
| Unknown | Yeah. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Right. Maybe not a bad, a bad idea for some swag. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I, yeah, I, I have like, uh, I was on borderline depressed filling out, filling out the show, the show notes today. Uh, cause I just, I have like nothing to report. I I've been working a lot and, um, let's see, I got our new router. It's pretty exciting. |
| James Stacey | Okay. Was this to mitigate the, uh, the strange buzzing sound in the house or just better speed or what? |
| Jason Heaton | Uh, just having some connectivity issues. Oh, um, with, uh, with, uh, having maybe too many clients on at once. |
| James Stacey | And then, well, it's funny you, you mentioned that, that that's not exciting, but I would just say that I wouldn't mind on a future show doing some discussion about, um, tech or gadgets or something at some point, because I have a feeling. And in fact, I know you're savvier than me. And I think we have probably a lot of listeners that would be keen on talking about, you know, uh, home-based tech, whether it's, you know, cameras or, um, you know, security systems or, or music or that sort of thing. So let's, let's file that away for a future topic. I think that'd be pretty good actually. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, can do. I definitely don't think we need to talk too much about routers. Just, just go on, just go on wire cutter and buy the one that they recommend. That's, that's the easiest thing to do for something like a router. Yeah. Has always worked for me and it worked just fine this week. So that was a, that was good, but hopefully that means I stay online during this recording, which would be a plus. But no, the buzzing I've not solved. So I can see my desk from where I'm sitting right now, but I can't put a microphone there to record. I think this might just be the way things are until I maybe don't live here anymore. But yeah, so that's fine. I have to, when we do these recordings, I have to sit somewhere else that doesn't have a really annoying buzzing sound. |
| James Stacey | Have you swept for listening devices? |
| Jason Heaton | No, I haven't swept for it. They can listen. I mean, I'm recording. I have a lot of listening devices on my phone, microphones and the rest, but yeah, I haven't done a ton lately. Certainly since we recorded last, just working, working a ton on, on some bigger stories with Hodinkee and, and a few other, you know, projects in the go, but nothing, nothing really just, you know, like, like I think I've said in previous episodes, just kind of pining, pining for the warmer weather. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. I'm feeling it too. |
| Jason Heaton | for sure. Uh, yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm done with winter. I think, I think that's where I'm at. I probably started done with winter, but I'm definitely done with it at this point. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. The days are getting longer and that makes it more tolerable. But this, this cold snap is, uh, starting to make me pull my hair out, which, uh, you know, makes me think of, uh, in just a couple of months we'll be, we'll be out, uh, gardening and on our bikes and whatever. So that gives, that gives me hope. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, for sure. Yeah. And, and you know, now's that time where you can, uh learn a new skill or or plan your garden yeah more extensively or or or whatnot and and we're certainly doing some of that with uh with plans for the cottage property and and that kind of thing so it should be uh should be a good season and certainly one that i'm looking forward to but uh what do you say we uh maybe move towards a watch-based topic of some sort what if uh let's do the uh the wrist check what have you got on this week |
| James Stacey | Yeah. I've got one that I haven't talked about on the, on the show before. Uh, I recently would say what's in the, within the past three months picked up, uh, an Aquastar benthos 500. So this is a vintage piece. Uh, I would say I haven't been able to figure out the date from a serial number, but I'm guessing it's either 1970 or early seventies. Um, big professional grade dive watch from, from Aquastar. This was kind of their flagship diver. um, for, for a number of years. And, and I, I'm just so excited to have gotten an old one because I've looked at them for, for many years. And, um, it arrived a little bit rough. The, the dial and movement were a little bit loose in the case. And then the hour and minute hand were missing loom. So there were pretty much skeleton hands, which made them very difficult to see. And I know some hardcore collectors are going to scream at me through the, through their phones or their, listening devices here. But I went and I had a watchmaker add a little bit of tinted lume to the hands because I want to be able to see them and thus wear the watch more, which has made a huge difference. He did a great job that the lume matches. This was at Wicks and Jewelers, if they're listening. Thanks a lot, Lenny. He's a great watchmaker down there. I highly recommend any sort of vintage restoration work. Take it to Lenny. But yeah, it's a cool piece. So this has It was apparently the first dive watch to be rated for 500 meter water resistance. And it's, what's really cool about it is it has a center minute chronograph. So 60 minute chronograph. So you hit the button and it, even though it's already set to zero, it starts the count up. And once it reaches 60 minutes, it just stops. So it doesn't keep running. It just, it counts up to 60 minutes, which is great for a dive watch, which you can use to kind of time your, hole dive and then use the bezel for timing other stuff if you want. And it's just a big chunky kind of cushion shaped case. And I don't know. I love it. I've been wearing it a lot lately. I put it on a bone strap and it just kind of sits sort of chunky on my wrist, which, which I love. |
| Jason Heaton | I saw it on your Instagram and yeah, it looks great. Yeah. Really cool piece. Yeah. And, uh, and yeah, well, I'm glad you're getting some wear out of it. Um, you know, those are, those watches from that time are really fun, right? The seventies were a weird, pretty weird time for watches in general. Yeah. And certainly the watch that I'm wearing was born in 1971, but not mine. I've got the Explorer II, which I don't really know why. I haven't really been wearing a watch a ton since the new year here or there, but I wanted to make an effort to have something that kind of makes me smile. And so this is back on the bracelet and it's great. I've been wearing it most days the last little while. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, it's a great piece. I mean, very wintry, I guess, with the polar dial configuration. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | And it kind of goes with everything and it's not really a watch that looks wrong if I stay in my pajamas all day. That sort of thing. So it's, it's good. And I've been, I've been working on a story that looks back at the, uh, the Explorer two, uh, and kind of puts it in that seventies context. So I had been wearing this just to kind of keep my mind, uh, you know, kind of churning on that story. Yeah. Nice. All right. So what do you say you want to dip right into the main topic? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, we've got a good one today. You, you came up with this last week and I thought, I think it's just a fantastic idea. Why don't you tell everyone what we're going to talk about here? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, so we've got a big list of brands. This first episode, first version of this show is probably going to be all brands that we're all super aware of. But the idea is, you know, these kind of quick chats as to what Jason and I would do if we were the watch brand CEO for a day or a year or whatever, however long it would take to enact some change. Uh, so yeah, we're going to go through brands, kind of chat about what we think they do really well, maybe where they've, they've encountered some, some struggles and then make a suggestion. Maybe it's a product, maybe it's a way of marketing or something else. But the idea is, uh, is, is what would Jason and I do if we were co-CEOs of, of a given watch brand for a given amount of time? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I think that, I think that covers what we're going to do. I mean, it's, uh, it's a neat concept. I think we'll be able to kind of tick off the list here. Some will go quicker than others, but, uh, What did we start with? I think we've got, we've got a dozen maybe. I don't know. |
| Jason Heaton | 10 or something. Right. Right. We'll see. But let's start with a, let's start with this. Let's start with a, with a fun one. Let's start with Citizen. Okay, cool. So we're made, you and I are made co-CEOs. We can do anything we want to, to the brand. We can enact any change. We could cancel models. We could make new ones. What, what, what do you think? What do you think Citizen does really well? That's, I think if you're the CEO, you have to kind of like know the strength of the brand. Yeah. Right. And then, and then kind of move in, in that space. Where do you think they kind of shine? |
| James Stacey | I mean, Citizen's so vast. What I think I heard one time, it's the largest watch company in the world when it comes to me and combine their movement manufacturing through Miyota and then of course Citizen. And they make just everything from, you know, ladies quartz dress watches to the big chunky dive watches we love. And, uh, you know, in terms of, of TGN centric, uh, focus on this one, I would say their, their tool watch history. I mean, they've got everything from the, you know, the tough series and all the pro master stuff. And, um, I guess what I've lamented about citizen for a long time is as much as I like their Aqua land or their, their pro master dive series, I wish they had not gone away from, uh, the more function forward, legible ones that they used to make. I mean, I, I'm a huge fan. And I've been on record as, as being as such and of the original Aqua land from the eighties. And I think what made that watch so great is it's incredibly legible. And then through the small digital window, you get all these extra features, including the depth sensor. And I think when they migrated to more of a analog display, ironically, all of that kind of went away and they started using small hands to, to track depth and that sort of thing. So I, I noticed recently that, and I, don't know if Hodinke covered it or, you know, I haven't really read a lot of in-depth coverage of it, but I know Citizen recently released kind of a smartwatch connected watch. And I just had this idea that you could kind of reissue that original Aqualand with some sort of a look back or an homage to the original eighties Aqualand and some sort of a smartwatch dive computer formula, you know, something along the lines of what Garmin has done with the Descent, where you make a watch that will do various things, including know, tell your depth and track your dive time. I think that would be a really cool, big leap forward for the brand. I think it would make those Aqualand watches not just sort of fun, collectible, analog, chunky pieces. They would actually really be able to do a lot more. So that would be kind of one area that I would look at. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I think that's smart. I think that makes sense, certainly. And to take the Aqualand and In my mind, I do kind of wonder, is it a screen that's kind of behind the hands that when you need more data, it comes on, but otherwise it's kind of like an eco drive thing where it's using as little power as possible, maybe just a couple of hands over a screen that's off, or is it sort of a modern iteration of an analog digital, maybe with a couple of little OLED panels, something that's still high res and could show you a message, but I like the idea that you would take a watch like this that ostensibly looks largely like an Aqualand, but it's packing some features. Maybe it does all of the dive tracking, puts it all on your phone, so you get the auto logs and the rest of it. There you go. Maybe you could change the time from your phone. Some of that middle ground, level two, level one smartwatch sort of stuff. You know, like the kind of stuff that we had with the G-Shocks that we, you know, did that ad campaign for. Previously, the app is sort of a companion thing that unlocks a few more features. Yeah. But the watch is still kind of a standalone option. Or I do want, you know, you could see them essentially going directly after Garmin in making a multi-sport watch that could also do, you know, depth tracking and the rest of it in a more conventional smartwatch package. Yeah. Um, my, my guess is that a lot of what they create is limited by the fact that they, they are really tied to eco drive. So if the watch can't be powered by solar and maybe not all smartwatches can, um, but certainly, you know, looking, looking at that, I do wonder if some of their smartwatch goals are held back by wanting to remain, you know, as eco drive as possible. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. An EcoDrive solar-charged Aqualand that's a smartwatch and dive computer mashup would just be a killer watch. I mean, it would be the ultimate sort of modern Aqualand. It would be a great way to almost relaunch that family in my mind. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I mean, it would just, I guess it would depend on, you know, cause like what you have to think about what we already know about solar, right? Like we've, there's, there's a lot of different solar stuff, but probably the solar with a screen Garmin does that for a few different watches. So it'll be interesting to see if there's enough power there for that. Outside of the Aqualand, I think that the brand in many ways needs their SKX007. I think people listening are saying, oh, but James, they have that. It's the NY0040 dive watch. And I would say that some of the fit and finish and quality control and movement specs of the SKX007 aren't great. And largely, I've owned, I think, three of those NY40s, a black and two lume dials. They're really cool watches, but they aren't really nicely made, or they weren't really nicely made. I don't think that's a modern model. I don't think I've ever had a watch that had such a vague connection between the crown and the hands when it was unscrewed. A bezel's not great. These were, I believe, 8215 based watches, a Miyota. you know, a simple Miota, but they were, they didn't keep time that well. They could be fine. You could get a really good example. I had kind of varying examples across the three that I owned. Um, I would like the aesthetic quite a bit, but in many ways, I think that they need a, uh, they need to take the, the things that we really like about citizen, which is like, you know, really good case materials. And they use some different versions of hardening on their cases and they use titanium and in great ways. And they have of course, eco drive. And I think take all of that and then package it in a very kind of everyday ready, high value, not too expensive, uh, dive watch that looks great on a strap. And I think, I think start speaking to people who are looking for an alternative to a Seiko five or an SKX. Um, and they have $250 and what they want is a, is a stylish, uh, dive watch, um, that, that maybe they can easily pop it from a bracelet to a rubber strap when they're going to go swimming for the weekend or whatever. And I think in many ways, they're like citizens thinking about dive watches has been too modern. When people first come to watches, especially if they come to watches via the internet, they get to Seiko and Citizen. And I think a lot of people immediately go to Seiko because the SKX is there. And I think you need another, they're just, we need a little bit more competition in the, call it $150 to $300 dive watch. And I think Citizen could make something that looked really good, um, that, that had the right mix of tech. Typically with a classic dive watch, you don't want almost any tech, the more simple, the better. But I think that there is something to eco drive that, you know, especially for people who don't want their everyday watch to be a mechanical or don't want their weekend watch to be a mechanical or don't want the watch that they might take hiking, cut the grass, go skiing, uh, go for a swim, you know, just they're, they're like they're rugged watch. Um, I think in many ways we've, we've spoken about, you know, enjoying having a quartz backup watch when we travel. I think that could be this as well. Uh, it would always have power, you know, maybe put it in front of a light, it wakes up and you keep going. And, and I think, you know, they could iterate upon that with versions that have more water resistance and are a little bit tougher or versions that have GMTs or alarms or other features. |
| James Stacey | When I came to, to watches back, you know, 10, 12 years ago and the, the big forum darlings were the, AutoZilla and the EcoZilla. And I never latched onto that aesthetic. They're just so over the top with the styling, those crazy sort of ashtray bezels and multi-level dials and funky hands and just oversized pieces. And I think you're right. I think, you know, a good counterpart to this smartwatch Aqualand that I'm talking about, that would be their full function, you know, tool dive piece would be a great classically styled, well-made, you know, Dura, whatever they call it, Dura tech, titanium eco drive dive watch. Yeah. That'd be really, that's a good, good plan. It's a good one, two punch. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Make it really thin. Cause you can, cause it's quartz, make it really thin, give it drilled lugs, give it a really great bezel, you know, like, like spend the money on the things like the bezel and maybe the bracelet and make something that when people put it on, they go like, wow, I can't believe I got this for $250. Yeah. and it doesn't weigh anything, and it looks fine when they go to the office, it looks fine when they go to the beach, it looks fine, whatever. Just make that de facto high-value option. Every brand needs its Mazda Miata, if you will. If that's the idea of a dive watch is kind of as a recreational object that is also somewhat practical, I think that we just need more. I would love more brands to be operating this space, and it seems crazy that Citizen can make so many great watches, but they don't have this sort of entry point to a daily sports watch covered as well as Seiko does. Yeah. Good job done. So that's Citizen. That's what we would do. Something like a new Aqualand and something like a direct competitor, a Citizen-y direct competitor to the 007. Next up, let's go in a different direction. How about Omega? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, definitely. Um, I've just got one. I mean, Omega is doing a lot of things, right? Um, I think, uh, one, you know, arguably they're most famous and, and you know, best, I don't know if it's best selling, but the watch that they hang their hat on is the Speedmaster. And I think the one thing about the Speedmaster that's Achilles heel and the one that people tend to complain about, if you can even say that is it's water resistance. People are like, Oh, I love the Speedmaster, but, um, and I'm like, why? if I, if I were CEO, if I were, if I took over for Reynolds, uh, you know, for, for even a month, I'd be like, the first thing I'd do is I'd be like, Hey engineers, you know, can we, can we make the Speedmaster pro a hundred meter water resistant? Like you guys can make watches anti-magnetic and go to space here. Can we, can we just add some, some beefier, uh, seals to the case and pushers to, I don't know. I mean, I don't know what it takes, but, um, I don't know what it's rated for now. I think it might be at 50 meters. It used to be 30 meters. Um, I don't know, like, like make a speedy pro that, People can wear for everything, including jumping off the dock. That would be such a simple thing that I'm not sure if it would increase the sales of it, but it would certainly win the hearts of watch nerds everywhere who are always afraid of getting their Speedmasters wet. |
| Jason Heaton | It is a strange omission when you mention it in a vacuum. Like we talked a lot about the Speedy on the previous episode. Yeah. But it is such a weird thing that that watch isn't a hundred meters with a screw down crown. Like I understand, I understand that it's hand wound. So maybe you wouldn't do the screw down crown. You do like a double or triple gasket. Sure. And people, you'd still get the a hundred really easily, but it is just wild because it's such a de facto choice in the sports watch world. Yeah. And in the entry luxury entry level luxury or entry to luxury watches. Like it's a, it's a lot of people's like, I see it on Reddit almost every week, like this, my first speedy, my first good watch, et cetera. And yeah, I agree that it should be a hundred for sure. It would just make it a little bit more well-rounded, right? |
| James Stacey | I think they've made hundred meter water resistant Speedmasters, not the pro. I think they've done the, what was it? The Solar Impulse or some of those kind of oddballs. |
| Jason Heaton | There's a lot of Speedmasters. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, but I mean, I know they can do it. So, you know, let's do it. Let's make it happen. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And, and for me, I mean, they would literally, like, I would get into the building, they would hand me my card with my little picture on it. And it says like co-CEO. And I would just immediately pick up the phone, dial any extension in Omega and just start shouting about sword hands. Cause this is all I want. I want, I want the new, the new, um, three, 300 meter, uh, Seamaster professional, but with sword hands, like a two, two, five, four. Yeah. So I understand that it's like a divide. And my guess is that Omega has a lot of data as to why that would suggest that the skeleton hand is going to be more popular and sell more watches. Otherwise, why would they do that? But for me, the sword hands of the 2254 that stretch all the way back to the MOD stuff, they're so beautiful. They hold so much loom. And, and like, if like there's no, I would, I would happily get back into, um, an Omega dive watch if I could get that format. I like that you can get the, the great bezel, the great dial, the zirconium, this, the liquid metal, that all of that's amazing. I like the case. I think the case size is really good for a modern Seamaster. Um, I do wish that they made that techie one that's in black titanium. Yeah. I wish that one was 41 and not 43, five or whatever it is. I think that one a bit smaller would be sick on a rubber strap. |
| James Stacey | All right. And we have to get rid of the helium release valve that, Oh yeah, no, there's a gas that has, that'd be my first call. You, you go for the sword hands. I'm going to go for that helium valve. |
| Jason Heaton | I'm sure they'll give each of us a phone. |
| James Stacey | It is the, it is the most annoying thing about to me. Look, it's not even an aesthetic thing for me. It, looks fine. It's okay to have an extra crown on the case, but the fact that you, if you were in a, in a saturated environment, a pressurized environment that you would actually have to remember to unscrew that, to, to, you know, decompress your watch. It's just absurd. It's just utterly absurd. So it's gotta go. I don't, you know, I don't know. It's fine that they had it, but no, it's time. I mean, can you imagine, can you imagine the modern Seamaster 300 with sword hands and no helium valve in that case with that kind of cool dial? It'd be awesome. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And then they could, and they could start iterating with that. Cause you know, they had the electric blues, they had the non AC dials, which were, you know, that they had applied markers. The two, two, five, four as standard was painted markers. Um, obviously another, a great another, like it just works that whole format. And then the other thing that would be my short term, I would say like immediately put sword hands, get three skews out. Let's go. No HEVs. Um, and then the, the longterm, I think that they, they need to work on, on, making their movements thinner. So as they, as I'm not saying that you just like snap your fingers and start making new movements, this is a hugely expensive, time-consuming thing to do. But I think that they make some of the finest movements in the world, but their movements are kind of thick. They're very tech forward, you know, anti-magnetic and the rest of it, the meta certification, the master chronometer, the coaxialness of it, all of that is fantastic. But a 40 or 42 millimeter Seamaster, Yeah. Uh, the planet ocean needs to be two or three millimeters thinner. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and, and I think you could get there by, you know, does it really need 600 meters of water resistance? Yeah. I don't think it does. Right. 200, 300 is probably more than enough. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | And, and I think in general, they just need to thin them down. You know, the, the, the two to five, four 50 that I would like them to make a new version of is I think four millimeters thinner. It's about 11 millimeters thick with that watch. And I admit that I wouldn't mind it being a bit thicker than that if you got like a good bezel. If you've ever owned a 2254, they had that scalloped bezel edge, which is very difficult to turn when your hands are perfectly dry, let alone if you're in the water. So give me... I prefer a Planet Ocean bezel, but I want the sword hands and I like that wave dial. So I would kind of pick and choose and make sort of like a new core James spec. Yeah. Uh, Seamaster. Yep. They do so many, they do so many great things. I like that it is one of these brands where they already have all the pieces. I think you just got to do them together. Yeah. Um, but, uh, great stuff. And yeah, a hundred meter speedy. I think people definitely like speedy nerds would love it, which is like, it feels like that's who they're, they're preaching to these days with the, that new 31, uh, 38 61, uh, speedy is very much for people who know what the speedy is. Yeah. Yeah. No, I agree on that. Uh, what brand do you want up next? |
| James Stacey | Let's, let's, let's take an easy one. That's kind of a good move from Omega. I would say IWC. |
| Jason Heaton | IWC. Sure. |
| James Stacey | You know, I think we're both in agreement. It's time to revamp, bring back a proper Aqua timer. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I think that they've done such a nice job in the last three or four years to relaunch the pilot lines. Um, and to, to, to bring some, some size, 39 millimeters, 40 millimeters into the fold, you know, new mark series. These are all really good moves, but it does feel like they've almost in time. And this is how things go with, with big watch brands is they have to focus on a line for a season or two seasons or whatever. And I think that, that as a brand that they've really focused on the perpetual calendars, they've really focused on, on the Portofino and the Portugieser. But The AquaTimer is not getting that same amount of love. I mean, the last time I think, and Jason, you could, you could correct me. I think you're on this trip, but the last time that they really did a big AquaLand push was the Galapagos. So AquaTimer. Yeah. Say that again. Oh, Aqua. How many times did I say AquaLand? No, just, just that time. All right. Uh, for the AquaTimer, uh, I think was around the time they did the Galapagos, uh, edition. Yeah, I think so. |
| James Stacey | It kind of had that rubberized internal, external bezel. |
| Jason Heaton | Feels like years ago, right? Yeah. Right. Right. Cause it is, it was years ago. |
| James Stacey | And I think, um, you know, IWC used to have this formula that was, was during the George Kern years where they, every year we'd go to SIHH and it would be our focus this year is on a different family and we will do minor updates to some others, but this is the pilot year. This is the Portofino year. This is the Portuguese year. They've kind of stopped doing that a little bit. Um, I think the era that, that I love, and I think you're in the same boat as that GST, uh, era from, uh, I guess it would be the early nineties where they had the integrated bracelet in the case. A lot of it was titanium, although they had steel versions, the dive watches had internal bezels with two crowns, not my favorite functionally, but boy, those watches looked good. And I think they shared some architecture across the family. So, you know, you, I could see, you know, if I stepped in there, um, I I'd largely leave Portuguese and pilot alone. I think they're doing a great job with those. I think to do sort of a shared architecture or case style between Ingenieur and Aquatimer and then make the Aquatimer the dive version, uh, would just be a smart move. I think going back to that integrated bracelet and some smaller sizes, slimmer, keeping the angular cases, um, And then just doing some interesting complications. They used to have an alarm version of the GST. I think they had a compass version. You know, they've done such cool stuff with those lines, with Ingenieur and with Aquatimer. And I just, I feel like it's missing now. It was such a great family. I miss it so much. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I mean, even the current Aquatimer Automatic is a watch that even they don't talk about. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. I can't even think of it anymore. I mean, I've forgotten what they even looked like. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And I actually, I actually think it's a great looking watch. I haven't used the sort of two ground system where they put the nine o'clock crown is the one that controls the Ria. Oh yeah. Um, but I think it's a great looking watch. It's already 42 millimeters. So I don't have to, I don't have to come in on my first day and say like, why don't you guys make a dive watch for someone who wants to wear it all the time and doesn't want a hockey puck on their wrist. But at 42 millimeters, I think that they could literally take the watch they have right now and just give me some more colors. Like, um, I think that like the Aquatimer could use a little bit of what AP did with the Offshore, where like they just kind of made it their fun one. Yeah. Right. Like the Portuguese is pretty serious. The Ingenieur is also a fairly serious watch. The Pilot's watches are great and they're iterating with bronze and green dials and the rest of it. But imagine if this, even if you just took the current Aquatimer Auto in 42 millimeters and just gave it a bright yellow dial or a bright orange dial or like a Robin's egg blue dial, like just make it something that feels like fun dive watch and then iterate from there. I mean, there's no reason that they couldn't take this exact watch, which is really an amalgam of the, of some elements from the GST watches. And then some from the later Aqua timers, like the Cousteau. Sure. And then there was that, that kind of final generation before they got quite a bit bigger, where I think it was the 3586 or the 3865, something like that. But that was the one that had the partial, um, the sapphire bezel with the partial yellow accent in it. Oh yeah. I had one of those. Yeah. Which is a gorgeous watch. Um, really, really nicely made. And I think that there's still a lot of that design language in the current Aqua timer. I just wish they did, did more, do more Aqua timers, do some that are a bit smaller, do some that are, are, are do one in a carbon case, like really kind of make it your offshore, I think. Right. Right. Or, or at least go, go in that direction where it feels like something kind of exciting and fun that just flatly is like, like make a really cool product that just ignores the fact that a, that a Submariner exists. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, true. I mean, IWC has always been, or they were kind of the anti Submariner. I mean, I'm in the nineties. I mean, they looked like nothing else. They looked very okay. They looked a bit sober and Germanic, but I think that that was what people knew them for. They were kind of this, they had that tie with Porsche design for a number of years and they were kind of known for this function first. And like, But I think they could go in a more playful direction like you're talking about. And I'm, I'm just surprised that, you know, big brand, big savvy brand like IWC isn't playing up its dive watch line more given how popular dive watches are with every single brand out there. I mean, everybody's doing splashy dive watches and IWC, I just feel like they're kind of missing the boat a little bit. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. And I think, I think that we wouldn't, we wouldn't even have to look that far back. They had, they had some, just like, like we said, some really cool stuff from the last 20 years. Yeah. you know, take the current Aquatimer, do the blue-orange thing on it, and do another Cousteau series. Like, support Proteus. I'm sure that Fabian would be entirely on board with that. Make it on a great rubber strap. Make it, you know, with a quick-chains bracelet. Yeah. So, you could go between one and the other really easily. Those watches that, you know, especially the ones that we're talking about, this IWC one, the Cousteau Aquatimer, the Cousteau Diver's Watch, you know, that's a proprietary lug. So, It has a sort of similar to like what, how an Aquus is, uh, where the, you know, it's a, it's a much thinner interlug channel for, for the bracelet or the, or the rubber. So make sure that you've got the, the really nice straps all kind of on lock. Maybe do a fabric, a rubber and a steel include all of them kind of like Vacheron does, uh, with the overseas. And then, yeah, I think, I think the sky's the limit, make a cool alarm one, make a GMT dive wad and, you know, do, do the, the chronograph. Uh, there, I think there's a lot here. They make an amazing movement. They really make a lovely watch. Um, and, and, and I think that they, they already have most of what they need when it comes to the Aqua timer. Just do more and make it maybe a little bit more fun. I like the bright colors. I like these, these sort of watches that feel like they, they would only exist on the crew of some amazing dive vessel or yeah. You didn't like that. They, they have that mix of seriousness and, and, and sort of tropical fun to them. |
| Unknown | Right. |
| Jason Heaton | Uh, when, when they have that color and, and in my mind, just so much more endearing than a Submariner. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Good. Where are we going now? So much personality. Uh, all right, let's see, let's do another one. So that was IWC. Let's jump to Bremont. |
| James Stacey | Okay. I mean, mine's mine's a simple one and I've, I've, I've expressed my desire, uh, to, to Nick and Giles for, for a few years now. I'm not sure if they're listening to me, but, um, I want a supermarine chronograph. I'm a big dive chronograph guy. I mean, I've got this benthos. I've got some T graphs, um, the Aqua star deep star. I just, I love that ultra functional, tough watch that can do anything. And I think the supermarine is my favorite family from, from Bremont. And I think a chronograph, maybe, maybe you do a couple of different versions. Maybe you do a two register kind of picture their alt one C formula, but in the, S 300, the supermarine 300. So the smaller kind of more classic looking one, but then do like locked pushers, you know, go big with like the S 500. I think the S 2000 might be a bit, a bit much, a bit too big, but like an S 500 with, with locking push pieces. Um, and then kind of a more classic version, you know, with, with two registers on the, on the S 300, I think would, would be just killer. I think I'd love to see that. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I don't disagree. I think that makes a lot of sense. I think for me, I would go in a few different directions. For a long time, I felt like I personally would really like a sort of blending of the MB2 and the solo, which I think they kind of have done with elements of the Airco. But I like the format of the MB2. but I would rather it, again, with the sword hands from the Solo. You have my Solo currently, my Solo 43. Yeah, yeah. And it has these nice, super legible, big, loomy sword hands, right? Right. On a nice white dial. And I think I'd do the same thing. I would make like a small... We'll go with a smaller case size, 39, 40 millimeters with an internal adjustable kind of like two crown with the rotoclick. So really just a smaller MB2, but then instead of it being a 60-minute re-ut, I would do a 12-hour bezel so you could track another time zone. |
| James Stacey | Oh, sure. |
| Jason Heaton | So you could call it a solo twin time. You could call it an MB solo. But I think the goal here would be to make... I think you could do it in one of the HMAF cases to keep the cost down. And I think you could make a really, really nice accessible... It could represent the starting point for their, their pricing for a sports watch and just offer it on a simple strap with like, you know, a really simple case, like do everything to kind of keep the, the, the, the overall cost down. Yeah. And, uh, and get it to get it to people who want like a, a really kind of like, I guess what I'm saying is that, uh, you know, as I'm wearing my Explorer to make like a, an Explorer to kind of sure. I don't think it necessarily needs the GMT. Maybe you make a GMT version down the road. It would depend on movements, right? Like if it's going to be a collar GMT, then kind of who cares the 12 hour, the 12 hour bezel is kind of just as handy. Yeah. Um, but I, you know, I think just a, a really kind of nice looking, easy to wear on different straps, uh, kind of blending of a, of a white MB and a, and a solo would be pretty fun. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I think that'd be great. Just a smaller MB. I think it'd be really cool. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, basically. And I know that some of the idea of miniaturizing an MB is probably difficult because there's so much structure inside protecting the movement, like that core feature of the MB. But yeah, it's something that would be fun to see. And then the other thing for me is actually also for the S500, I would like a version of the S300 that looks identical to the 500. Okay. I like the size of the 300, the 40 millimeter sizing, but the current S500 is a seriously beautiful dive watch. |
| James Stacey | It is, yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | And I would love to see that just down at 40. Yeah, yeah. Make it a bit thinner, make it a bit smaller. Sure. But otherwise, I mean, the dial treatment's incredible, the bezel on an S500's great. A lot of water resistance, really nice crown. All of that's a plus. I just think it would be super fun to see at a slightly smaller size. |
| James Stacey | All right. Well, I, I've got an easy one for us. Um, okay. What about we move on to, uh, to Zen? What do you think they should do? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Uh, I wouldn't, uh, I wrote down, not sure I would change a thing. I mean, I think since I think since God, I'd like an incredible lineup, they've got to watch for just about anyone. Um, and anything like if, if you wanted to say, Oh, I wish they had more really interesting high end stuff. Well, they're doing more of that. They do it some every year. And if you say like, oh, I really wish they were still focusing on the entry point, they definitely aren't. They've got the new U50 Diver is a perfect size, an incredible watch. And I think that the brand is actively working to kind of make sure that their lineup is nice and holistic in terms of if you want a big Zen dive watch, they make that. If you want the same thing but a bit smaller, they make that. If you want a chronograph, they've got that. Yeah, I don't think that they're there's no, I don't see any big holes in their lineup. They do what they do and they do it really well. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I agree. I mean, I, I think, uh, uh, you know, with almost any kind of company, there's always this desire, this sort of forward momentum that pushes companies to get bigger and expand and et cetera. And I just think what's in is done is they've, they've maintained that kind of, I don't wanna say cult following, but, but they have their base of, fans that include us, uh, wholeheartedly, but I think they, they've managed to maintain their, I don't want to call them underdogs, but you know, small brand attraction while still turning out, you know, big brand quality and some great watches. I think the only change I would make, um, is make them more accessible, get, get, go beyond watch buys for North America. I mean, I think everybody wants that. Everybody wants either a dealer network or, you know, you can just, you can buy online direct from Zen or something where you can, you can see these watches instead of having to sign up for one retailer, one distributors roadshow. I think, you know, that's what I would do. I would just blow them up bigger. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. The watch buys guys have done a great job with it for what, like within their business model. Um, but I think, yeah, it would be great if there was a way where when we talk about as in, and then somebody writes us and says like, Hey, I can't see this watch anywhere. Yeah. Um, that there was even just like a storefront or, uh, some sort of a loaner program or, you know, like other brands have found ways around this, but it would, it would be great. Yeah. It'd be great if there, if it was like, uh, even if watch buys made the deal, like whoever, however it came out is not really our concern, but they, you know, just that maybe, maybe in five big cities, three big cities, you could see them, uh, in, in person, you could try a U 50 on or, or whatever, even if you had to make an appointment or whatever. Right. Uh, to figure that out. I do agree that, yeah, the, the, the method in which they're sold is, is not bad in any way, just isn't as modern as what some other brands have done. And for the U S context, it is just one, there's one way to buy them. Yeah. Yeah. All right. So after Zen, let's do, we do Seiko. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, we can do Seiko, you know, for me, I'm getting a little bit of limited edition fatigue. I think it feels like, Feels like every month there's a new limited edition of some sort. Um, and I've lost track and, and I, I like citizen as just a, a core brand that just makes great watches for anybody and everybody at the high end and at the low end. And I just think, I don't know if that strategy is working for them. Maybe it is. Maybe that's why they continue doing it, but I'm just, I'm just so over the, the limited editions that they're doing. So I'd, I'd put a halt to that. Do one a year or something. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. It does feel like a lot. And I think it's one of those things where if you, if you really focus on, on Seiko in general, like you see all of their releases, it can feel like a, like a, a river that moves very quickly. And I think it's just how many markets that they exist in. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | So they're constantly turning out new watches and not all of it. It's going to apply to every level of enthusiast or, or even just to like our little corner with TGN or even Hodinkee. Yeah. you know, they, they sell to a world that's so much bigger than the enthusiast base of the, of the watch space. Yeah. Uh, it, it, they do, they, they make so many things, but I, I agree that the, the Ellie's almost seem like there's so many that it's not appealing. Right. Yeah. And, and half the time, not even half the time, almost all the time, the, the one that doesn't have the, the special dial or the additional branding or whatever is more interesting to me. |
| Unknown | Mm. |
| Jason Heaton | I mean, I love scuba diving, but if I was buying a turtle, I wouldn't, I definitely wouldn't go for the Patty one. |
| James Stacey | Right. Same here. |
| Jason Heaton | I just don't, I don't really want to watch this as Patty on the dial. I want the one that just says Seiko, just the Seiko one. Yeah. Yeah. Right. And, and, you know, just maybe some of that's the, the vintage scuba pro 6309s and stuff. Those are cool. But again, I think they're kind of cooler without scuba pro on the dial. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I, I think I would, I would agree with that. And you, you have another note here, which is, you know, to do a, And this is, this is the, what I would have written down if you hadn't written it, uh, you know, as to make a modern version of the 6139. Yeah. |
| James Stacey | And I, I actually wonder if they're, they're ripe for that. I mean, given the recent sort of vintage reissues that they've done, uh, it almost feels like we're, we're primed for that. You know, we, we, we got the turtles, we've got the, you know, the, um, the 6105, the Willard reissues, we've got the 62 Moss reissues. Um, it's, it's time. I mean, come on, Seiko's, they were there at the beginning with automatic chronographs. They should. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Yeah, for sure. We're due. I would agree that, that if, if you could, if you could snap your fingers as a CEO, it would be incredible to have a modern Pogue. Um, what comes to my mind immediately is what movement goes in there. Hmm. I mean, cause I think Seiko's chronograph movements are courts until you get into GS movements. |
| James Stacey | I feel like I've seen an automatic chronograph from them. recently. And if not, it needs, they need to dust off the 6-1-3-9 movement. I mean, look at, look at the, the things that Zenith and Omega have done, you know, touting and resurrecting and polishing up their, their old chronograph movements. I think Seiko could, I bet it wouldn't take much for them to, if they, if they don't make one already, you know, pull out some 6-1-3-9 drawings and get those. |
| Jason Heaton | I'm almost positive that I'm just blanking really hard on, on, uh, on a modern chronograph movement that they make. Maybe something in some of the presage stuff. But even then, maybe that stuff is quartz or kinetic. I'm not sure. But it wouldn't surprise me. Also, at Seiko, they would have the ability to make a chronograph if that's what they wanted. And I think it'd be super fun to see them iterate on the... There's so many versions. People know the Pogue. But there's so many other classics, say UFOs and the rest classic kind of Seiko chronographs that they could pull from. My guess is it's just a question of getting the movement together. But I don't disagree that I think, and especially, I would say that their watch lineup is sorted. It's really good. I would actually probably say it could be smaller, just make fewer watches. But that's going to be a disconnect between what I know of the watch industry as a guy who doesn't actually work in the watch industry proper, like I've never had a corporate job in this industry. So I'm sure there's a reason for every one of the SKUs that they make, a business case. But I would say, yeah, the DiveWatch lineup is solid. I don't think it needs a lot of focus or time and energy right now, but the Chronograph could be a huge move for sure. Even just looking back at their history, there's like an endless, endless supply of great designs. Oh yeah. Yeah. All right. So let's, uh, we'll do, well, let's do at least one more and we've got kind of a pair here. So let's close out with a Tudor and Rolex. |
| Unknown | Okay. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. Why don't, uh, I mean, you're the one that brought this up years ago and we still haven't seen it with Tudor. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I mean, I, again, as the moment, the moment they told me my, my desk phone was online, I just started just dialing. any extension that would land and just show Pelagos GMT. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Just again, just yell it, hang up, dial another one. Yeah. Pelagos GMT. Just let's get it done. You know, I, I think, I think that the stars are aligned here. Um, the, I believe in my heart that there's a way to take the movement from the BB GMT, which is a 41 millimeter case and drop it in the 41 millimeter case of the Pelagos. I would absolutely love that. Uh, I would buy one for sure. Uh, I, you know, I'm, I'm still tempted just by a normal Pelagos. And if I, if I've ever found myself in the need for a dive watch, which could happen, I'd have to liquidate, uh, uh, uh, you know, a quiver, uh, here, but, uh, I could definitely see owning one, especially like every now and then you catch a photo of a Rishad with a two liner, uh, the early ones. And those, those are pretty sweet as well. But then, then I couldn't have the blue. And then I still think a lot of times if I ever came close to buying one, I'd be like, but they might make the GMT. |
| James Stacey | Can you imagine a blue GMT with like a yellow tip? Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Like imagine a blue, orange sort of motif. I think a little while ago back, um, monochrome watches the, another great, uh, watch website. They, uh, they used to do these things before Basel and I'm sure they'll continue when Basel continues, but before Basel, they used to do these sort of, um, like Photoshop renderings of what they think might come out from Tudor and Rolex. And they've done, they've done a really fantastic, uh, uh, Pelagos GMT with the 24 hour, uh, marking on the bezel and, and an additional, uh, hand that's very much in line with the GMT master style hand, but in full white, uh, some color tweaks on that. I mean, a blue one would be wild, a blue one with a bit of color, like some orange would be even more wild. I think that be good if they maybe limited some of the texts on the dial. Uh, but otherwise that would just be, yeah, get, get, get me, get me into that CEO seat and let's get a GMT in the Pelagos for sure. |
| James Stacey | you know, the black Bay gets so much attention and we talk about the Pelagos a lot, but it, it, it truly is. If you step back and look at the last five, 10 years of watches, I mean, it's possibly, okay, this is, I don't throw out big statements here, but the Pelagos is probably, you know, one of the most significant new dive watches to be introduced in the past decade, maybe 20 years. Um, you know, just in terms of its capability, its design, it's, it's very original looking and yet retains the, the tutor sort of, uh, I hate to use the word DNA, but DNA, um, you know, with the markers in this and the hands, you know, I mean, it appeals across the board. I mean, you get guys like, you know, I remember seeing Conrad anchor speaking here in town about, you know, his mountaineering escapades and he had his old beat up Pelagos on his wrist, um, you know, and, and then, you know, divers are wearing them and adventurers. I mean, it's just, it's the ultimate sort of adventure watch. And I could totally see a GMT version, skip the helium release valve on the side and, and, and do the, you know, make, maybe make it 300 meter water resistant instead of 500 or something like that. |
| Jason Heaton | Could you imagine, uh, an L uh, the LHD in, in a GMT with that, the, that whole aesthetic take a little bit because they've got that red marker, maybe put that red on the GMT hand. |
| Unknown | Yeah. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. They're great. They're great watches. I definitely, definitely want to own one one day and I definitely hope it's a GMT. Yeah. Uh, so I, we've definitely put this wish out into the world many times. Uh, let's move on to a Rolex. What, uh, what, what would you like to see from Rolex? |
| James Stacey | I mean, how many times can you perfect further perfect these, uh, these sports watches of theirs? I mean, the Submariner, the Sea-Dweller, they're just, you know, you know, however you feel about the design, bigger, smaller, et cetera. They're, they're just superior watches. What I would love to see, and this may come as a bit of a surprise is, you know, Rolex back in my history with vintage Rolex, especially non sports watches is miserable. So I'll get this horribly wrong, but you know, they used to make this triple calendar chronograph. I think it was the reference six, two, three, six. This was back in the forties, fifties, maybe, um, you know, bring something like that back, make it steel. make it, you know, reasonably sized and give it a moon phase and a triple calendar, uh, and kind of an elegant, but wearable, very Rolexy, uh, sporty, but elegant triple calendar chronograph. I don't, I don't think this is the direction they go at all with any of their watches. So this is definitely a long shot. I know that they make a Cellini dress watch that has a moon phase. That's a beautiful dress watch. Yeah, those are pretty. But I'd love to see a triple calendar chronograph. I'd love to see Rolex come out with something like that. I think it would catch everyone off guard and I think it'd be pretty popular. Um, I would love to see that. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I don't, I don't disagree. I think, I think a lot of those, there's a lot of stuff from before the era of the Explorer, um, that, that they could, they could work with and make and steal and maybe bring people in from a different vector than just wanting a sub or a Daytona and not being able to get it. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | In my mind, the obvious thing is it's 2021, so the Explorer 2 is 50 years old this year. Yeah. The last time they updated it was 2011 for the 40th anniversary. Oh, sure. So I think we'll probably see another Explorer 2 this year. My hope, being a huge fan of the 16570, is that they abandon the 42 millimeter sizing. Oh, yeah. And just move it back into the 40. again, if I was the CEO, it wouldn't be a maxi case. It would, I would basically say, could you guys just make the 16, five 70 again? Yeah. Um, you know, I like, I like a five digit Rolex. I prefer them with the thinner case and the thinner lugs. Uh, I like, I also like that the, the explore to everybody says is 40 millimeters. It's 39. Yeah. Uh, like strongly 39 measure it from almost any, any vector may, you know, not including the crown of course, or the crown guards. Um, I think that Rolex probably includes the crown guards or just calls it 40 to maintain 40 being their size across most of their stuff. Um, but I, you know, I think that the Explorer two has always been this sort of oddball weird, you know, Rolex, you know, the, the one in the group that doesn't quite fit in, but, but still manages to do all the same stuff. Uh, and, and that's part of what I really love about the watch and, and, and I love its history and, and I love, the ambassadors that have, you know, kind of carried it. So it's my favorite Rolex, but I don't really care for the 216570, which is the current, you know, I thought the, the move to 42 millimeters was unnecessary in my mind. And to go both to the, the sort of super case size, and then also the maxi dial with the really big loom plots and the really big hands, the proportions are all off and there's something In my mind, and again, I couldn't have a bigger bias towards a 16570. I literally have one on my wrist. It's my favorite modern Rolex. But in my mind, the proportions of the 39 or 40 millimeter 16570 were perfect. I mean, this watch was in production for more than 20 years. It really is a nicely refined, beautifully wearing... And I just love a Rolex with a white dial and they're rare now. They kind of always are. Um, so that's what I would do. I would say, you know, get, get us a new Explorer to, uh, something that takes a little bit closer to, to where we were previously with it. Um, I, I like the, yeah, I hope they continue with the white. I like the orange Jackson. I love the steel bezel, all of that stuff I hope remains. I just don't think that it needs to be as big as it is now. |
| Unknown | Yeah. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, I'd love to say you could make it right in a, a standard Explorer case, the current, uh, two one four two seven zero. |
| James Stacey | Right. Right. I wonder if they would be super fun. I wonder if they would keep a, a steel bezel. As much as I'd love to see it, they seem to be going ceramic with everything. And I wonder if they would try to figure out a way to, I mean, a black 24 hour fixed ceramic bezel would look okay, but it definitely doesn't carry the same. |
| Jason Heaton | It looks really weird on the white one. Yeah. It would definitely look very strange. If they continue to, if they, if they decide to continue offering it. Yeah. For me, that, that, that bezel is, is like in many ways, what makes the watch the watch. |
| James Stacey | Especially when it gets beat up. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh yeah, it's so much better with some scratches and when some of the paint's been knocked out of it. Yeah. Yeah. Um, but it's that super distinctive way that the light hits that radial finish. Yeah. It's the fact that you really can't refinish them. Like people try and people do, but you, it's pretty obvious. Like it's a, it's a complicated finish that's on them. Yeah. Um, I think they're super legible. There's also like, it's just, it's a watch that looks great on its bracelet, which isn't something that I typically care at all about. And I think that's because there's just so much steel. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | within view. Yeah, I just love this watch, but my guess is we'll see another one from them this year, and I hope that they massage it in a direction that's closer to the Explorer than it is to being the Explorer's deep CC dweller. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. Well, good. Good way to finish, I think, with... Yeah, we got a stack of brands. |
| Jason Heaton | There's a few more, and I think this is something that we'll come back to in a few months. If there's a brand that you would really love to hear us fake CEOs weigh in on. If you want to get a question into the upcoming Q&A, which we'll be recording for next week, drop us a line, thegreatnadoatgmail.com, record it in your voice memo app on your phone and just send us that file. We're going to get to as many of them as possible. Jason, what do you say, like always, final notes, bow on the show, et cetera? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, good idea. So I came across a video, I think it's a recent one from a guy who's pretty well known on YouTube. He's an extreme downhill mountain biker named Danny McCaskill. Um, he's Scottish and he just does some insane, uh, videos and the, the, the work he does, the control he has on a, on a mountain bike is just incredible. And, uh, this latest one is, isn't quite as, um, acrobatic as the ones I've seen from him before, but in terms of scenery, uh, and, and what he's doing, the boldness of it, it's just tremendous. It's called the slabs and it's on his YouTube channel. And we'll, we'll throw a link in the show notes, but, uh, Macaskill's great. He's, he's, he's a pretty humble guy. He's, you know, he's cut from that, that Red Bull cloth. Um, but I think, you know, he does a little talking at the end of this video and he kind of comes across as this sort of, just sort of nerdy, enthusiastic guy. Um, and, uh, and he's in his home of Scotland for this one on the Isle of Skye. And he's, uh, he, uh, hike a bikes with his, uh, with his downhill mountain bike to the top of a well-known uh, climbing route called the slabs, uh, the do slabs. And, uh, and then he rides down and, uh, it's, it's just an impossibly steep, um, really technical riding on these, these narrow drop-offs and, uh, you know, it's all shot beautifully with, with drones and with well-placed camera people. Um, and basically he, he hikes up to the top of his bike and then, and then heads down and finishes at this incredibly pristine, beautiful lake at the bottom. And I think the combination of the scenery with his riding skill is, is just mesmerizing. And it's, it's not a long video, but, um, and then once you, once you watch that, if you're not familiar with Danny McCaskill, just click around his, his YouTube channel and watch some of his older videos. And the guy's just incredibly good. So, yeah, he sure is, you know, Gashani and I really were, were planning to go to Scotland last year before everything before the dung hit the fan here. And, uh, uh, it, this video just made me want to go back even more. I think it'll be one of the first places we, we go when, when all this is over and we can travel comfortably again. And, uh, I really want to get to the Isle of Skye and I'd love to, I'd love to climb this peak. It just looks amazing. |
| Jason Heaton | So it does look amazing. Yeah, no, this video is incredible. A great pick. A few people sent it to us via email as well. So thanks for everyone who sent that in. He really is a remarkable guy. It was also my introduction to Band of Horses, the musical act. Oh, okay. Yeah. He put one of their songs in a video before he was with Red Bull. Okay. Which I think is mostly filmed around a city, probably a city somewhere near where he lives. Yeah. But it's more trials based stuff. So the balance work. Right. On various like city elements. Yeah. |
| James Stacey | Like tops of fences and stuff. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And then this is, this is a little bit closer. This one is a little bit closer to what he's been doing with Red Bull, which are these chase videos. Yeah. where some of them are in, you know, he did that one, like in not like Portofino, it was like a, like a coastal city. Right. Right. A European, a coastal European city, maybe Portugal or something like that. But, uh, and that ended with this like giant jump into the ocean. His videos, his videos are super fun. And like, well, I think you said this in our Slack that he's like the, the Candide Thovex of mountain biking, which is super, you know, there's something really kind of playful and, and fun loving about what they're doing. It's like, it's, it's silly. Yeah. At a certain extent. So dangerous. But then it's all, all of it is so dangerous and belies so much skill and balance and practice and time. Yeah. McCaskill's done some, uh, all, all this stuff is great. So that's definitely, definitely worth a watch. Yeah. What have you got? So, yeah, for my pick, I went with, um, uh, the recently relaunched top gear America on motor trend. So motor trend is for those that don't know is, is of course a very famous and well loved magazine about cars, but it's also a full digital publication platform, including a lot of like TV grade shows, like a lot of shows. Um, um, they, they have their own app. It's kind of like a Netflix for cars, uh, lots of great hosts and everything else. And, and they recently did a deal, I guess, with the BBC to get a top gear on that platform. So if you want to watch all the old top gear with Clarkson and Hammond in May, that's all on there. If you want to watch some of the newer stuff, I'm not really sure how you get that without a BBC player, but part of this whole deal is that they're doing a Top Gear America, which a couple other people have tried in the past. It's a difficult sort of thing to replicate. The lightning in the bottle effect of the original Top Gear has been something that people have been chasing for a while, and it really comes down to the chemistry of the hosts. Anyways, this new one, they're three episodes in so far, but it's an interesting mix where they've got two sort of famous people and one guy that is in my world famous, but is more known to be more of an automotive journalist than an entertainer. So they've got Dax Shepard, who you might know from many different things. He's an actor. He's been in lots of TV shows, married to Kristen Bell. You've Rob Corddry, who's from also an actor and a comedian. You know him from various, you know, comedy network stuff, as well as Ballers. And, you know, he's been in a lot of stuff. And then finally, you have Jethro Bovingdon, who, if you're not really into the car scene, the car automotive journalism scene, you wouldn't know, but he's one of the better hosts. a British guy, a very talented driver. He's funny. So he's a good host. He's a great pick for a top gear. Absolutely. And the three of them come together and, and, you know, a lot of it is going to be about them kind of building their chemistry into the show. But for the first three episodes, super watchable, really fun. If you've got a motor trend on demand account, definitely worth your time. And if you don't, the accounts really not that expensive and there's, Like tons and tons of shows on there. You can, you could be more of a race fan. You could be more of an off-road fan. You could be wanting to watch build shows. You could be wanting to watch, you know, shows about, uh, the way that cars are covered or built or designed or whatever. It's, uh, it's been, there's tons and tons of stuff on there. Um, you know, they, they, they made a really, if anyone from motor trend is listening, you made a weird mistake canceling, uh, ignition and head to head Johnny shows. I thought they were fantastic. They're the reason I subscribed to the app originally. was to see those shows, you know, before they would make it to, uh, to YouTube. So if anyone from MT is listening, can you guys get Johnny back on a, on a show or two, that'd be fun. But otherwise the, the lineup's great. And, and I've really enjoyed a top gear America so far. |
| James Stacey | Oh, nice. I mean, I think a lot of times with, with a lot of these, uh, paywall, uh, content providers, you know, it's so low risk to pay the, you know, three, four, seven, eight bucks a month. And then you, you just binge, whatever you want, get the most out of it. And then if you want to continue, you do, but if not, you know, So it's, you know, for a few bucks to try out even a couple of episodes of Top Gear America to see if you like, it isn't much more than, as they say, the proverbial cup of coffee. So yeah, it's a good, good idea. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. So there, I couldn't remember what I paid for it, um, but they have a free trial, so you don't have to pay anything. They say that they have over 8,000 episodes of automotive content, which definitely sounds right. There's a ton on there. A lot of it is produced by them as well. So the quality is very consistent. Yeah. And it looks like they're asking after the trial, it's either $5 a month or $45 a year. |
| Unknown | Okay. |
| Jason Heaton | Not much at all. Which really doesn't seem like much at all. You know, a little cheaper to go for the year ends up costing, you know, less than three months of your Netflix. If you like cars, I absolutely think you should be subscribed. There's always something to go in and click around and learn. I've enjoyed it quite a bit. Nice. All right. That was a good episode. Oh, for sure. And, you know, as always, thank you so much for listening. You can hit the show notes by Hodinkee.com or the feed for more details. You can follow us on Instagram at Jason Heaton and at J.E. Stacey, and you can follow the show at The Graynado. If you have any questions for us, please write TheGraynado at gmail.com and keep sending in those voice memos for our upcoming Q&A. Finally, please subscribe and review wherever you find your podcasts and music throughout a siesta by Jazzar via the free music archive. |
| James Stacey | And we leave you with this quote from Henry David Thoreau, who said, Success usually comes to those who are too busy to be looking for it. |