The Grey NATO - 126 - Watch Discomfort Zones
Published on Thu, 08 Oct 2020 06:00:17 -0400
Synopsis
Jason Heaton and James Stacey, hosts of The Grey Nado podcast, discuss their personal comfort zones and discomfort zones when it comes to different types of watches. James expresses his struggle to appreciate dress watches and find one that suits his lifestyle, while Jason shares his lack of connection with chronograph watches despite understanding their appeal. They exchange perspectives and suggestions on potential dress watches and chronographs that could change their views. The episode also features an ad segment sponsored by Seiko, highlighting their new Prospex Built for the Ice Diver US Special Edition watches.
Links
Transcript
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| James Stacey | Hello and welcome to another episode of The Grey Nado, a Hodinkee podcast. It's a loose discussion of travel, diving, driving, gear, and most certainly watches. This is episode 126 and it's proudly brought to you by Seiko and their new limited series Prospex built for the ice diver watches. We thank you for listening. James, uh, Been a while, but super excited to be back and we've got a great topic and a good sponsor. It feels like it'll be a good episode. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I think this is going to be a good one. I'm going to give the same warning that I've given several times right at the top of the episode. There is some construction noise. They seem to be, everybody upstairs just seems to be playing with whatever sander they can find. They're just standing directly above me and I guess just sanding the floor above my head. Uh, so if you hear, if you hear some, some sanding sounds, I apologize. Um, but otherwise I'm, I'm well into my second cup of coffee and, uh, and, and yeah, feeling pretty, uh, maybe not too rambly, but, uh, I'm sure there'll be some, some light rambles on this episode as well. So my apologies for rambles and sanding sounds. |
| James Stacey | I'm glad we're back to kind of our morning routine here. I think we both are a little perkier before noon. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. We've kind of abandoned working around the construction. It's now just part of the, the TGN soundscape. Yeah. So kind of got to do your best with that one. But cats coughing, people sanding. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The cat, the cat thing I left in and we got a bunch of comments on it. I thought that was funny. Yeah. But, you know, the since then it is funny because you you had mentioned that it had been a little while and it does kind of feel like a little while since that last episode. And I was surprised by what kind of how much people enjoyed that one. It really had such a loose topic. and has proven to be quite popular. So I'm thrilled by that. And I don't think this episode will be any huge departure from that. It's a loose topic. It's very watch-based, but it's kind of a loose watch topic. But before we get to that, you mentioned that the sponsor, we'll get to more of that. I'm pretty blown away to have Seiko sponsoring an episode of the show, especially because this is probably what we talked about in the first episode. Probably so many years ago, but before we get to a kind of a bigger, exciting ad break in the middle, what have you been up to with some more of these fall days? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I mean, after our last episode, I went out and did something, you know, full on autumnal. Ghoshani and I went for a hike last weekend. You know, we had the two day weekend and we went hiking one day and I did this cars and coffee thing on Sunday, but it felt good to get out, you know, fall colors, this was the year I thought, Oh, we'll really be able to soak them in and enjoy them. And boy, they've, they've like come very quickly and they're slightly past peak now. And we've got a cabin trip this weekend, but it's like, I just hope they hang on for a few more days. Cause we've got a few days up north and, uh, I've been looking forward to, you know, just seeing the, the full display up there, which is spectacular. And even on our hike, which was a little closer to home here. Um, a lot of the, the trees had already, had already dropped and turned, but Still just just beautiful. It was sort of the last of the real balmy Fall days just before the temperature dropped and so we were out hiking I was in a t-shirt and just a backpack and we Tromped around the woods and took some photos and brought a flask of tea and it was It was great. I just just kind of reveling in that sort of stuff this year as we've discussed and yeah, and then the next day There's a local kind of umbrella group called the intermark group that uh, hosts events for a bunch of the local car ownership clubs, like the MG club, the Triumph club, the Citroen club. Um, and they hosted, they've hosted two cars and coffee things in the parking lot of a, uh, kind of a, an indoor market. Uh, so it's all outdoors, you know, well spaced, et cetera, for, for COVID times. And I took, I took the Land Rover and you know, I, Didn't realize how much I missed that type of experience having you know been kind of shut in all this time and kind of just you know talking to you about cars and yeah and to go and and just kind of soak in all these beautiful old mainly British cars there were a lot of MGs and Triumphs and Jags and Lotus a couple of Lotus Jensen Healey's and Jags etc and Um, it was just a lot of fun. I stayed for, you know, three and a half hours and there was a food truck there and I just kind of sat out and soaked it up. So, uh, it was a very therapeutic weekend to get out and hike and check out some old cars. And then, like I said, we've got a cabin trip this weekend. So, uh, yeah, all in all, it's been, it's been a great, great few, few days and weeks here. How about you? You've been, you've been getting up north too. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, sure have. Yeah, project property moves forward. The bathroom is in. It's looking pretty good. I successfully wired a not overly straightforward lighting scenario in the bathroom, which I'm quite proud of, with only minimal help from my friends who are electricians. Yeah, it's been good. And like you said, with the fall colors, I'll be back up there and Probably when this airs, I'll probably be up there just sipping a cup of coffee with hopefully a little bit cooler weather. It's been kind of warm in Toronto the last few days. I went for a run yesterday. It was, you know, mid-20s, which is, you know, low 80s in Fahrenheit. But the scene up there has been great and the colors were kind of in a middle phase. There was some of that really bright, really red oranges and yellows and, and, and that sort of thing. And, uh, uh, but I, I think, I think it'll be even, even better, you know, over the Canadian Thanksgiving weekend, uh, which will be a couple of days after this episode comes out. Very cool. And, uh, and I got a chance, the other, the other thing I haven't done in years and years and years, uh, you know, it's end of season. So some, some of the, uh, the other folks on the property were, uh, removing their boats from the water, fishing boats and ski boats and that sort of thing. And I got a chance to go for a little lap of the lake. I haven't been on a boat on that lake in well over, probably over a decade. And it was just beautiful. There's no other boats out because it's kind of after season. Two other boats on the bay, that sort of thing, and did a nice lap. And you get to eyeball some of the nice cottage properties and dangle your fingers in the water as you coast along. It was great. That was a pretty killer weekend, you know, getting the bathroom, a running bathroom checked off the list is obviously huge for a cabin. And then, yeah, to get the boat right in. And we had a really nice time. The weather was super good. It's so nice to sleep in a cold tent. It's such a fun, kind of perfect. I promise that's not a plane taking off or taxiing just outside of my outside of my home that's sanding. But yeah, it's great. And campfires are never better than September and October. So that kind of stuff will continue. I was super happy with it. And yeah, other than that, I've got back and it's just been kind of keeping up with all the kind of stuff that's coming out this fall. There's some pretty exciting announcements heading up. There's a really fun one happening the day after this episode comes out that we can't talk about. Uh, but definitely if you catch this on Thursday, get ready for, uh, for Friday, there's some, uh, some, uh, very TGN, uh, sort of thing we'll be hitting the world. Uh, and it's, uh, I've, I've had a chance to see it and it's absolutely gorgeous. Beyond that, you've got a couple rover repairs on the horizon before it gets too cold to skin a knuckle on the undercarriage of a very long vertical. |
| James Stacey | Oh, there's nothing worse. Nothing worse than like wrapping a knuckle in like 30 degree weather. Yeah, when that wrench slips, it's over. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, when I headed in for some work at the shop earlier this summer, I was told that the front prop shaft splines were worn and it should get replaced. And so, uh, that looks like a, uh, you know, when you look at the manual and they tell you like the level of difficulty and it's like one wrench to five wrenches, and this is about a two or a three. So I think I can handle this one. Um, you know, it's just kind of four bolts that hold the prop shaft at each end. This is for the front differential, uh, for the four wheel drive. And, um, so I think that part arrives today. So I'll try to tackle that maybe next week, sometime, and then I'll actually have four wheel drive to get through the snow. Perfect. And then I think our long road trip that we took a few weeks back might have been the last, the last straw that broke the camel's back for the rear hub seal on one side, which started the sort of telltale leak that sort of sprays oil around the rim. So I've got that kit on order as well, which is a little more involved repair, but I think I'm going to, I'm going to tackle it. And you know, yeah, like, as you said, I got to get all this done before before winter hits. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, short, short of boring a friend's garage on a Sunday afternoon or something. If you're lucky enough to know someone that has an empty garage in the winter, which is probably not that common. There are always a couple things that you're like, Oh, I'll get to it this summer. And then it's the fall. And then you're like, well, it's the minute that it's freezing. I can't fix this. Yeah. So yeah, or even not even fix stuff. Like I've got a couple things I want to do for the Jeep just in terms of small modifications. I'd like to remove the subwoofer from the back. It's, you know, the Jeep is really genuinely designed, you can look at it and you kind of understand this, but they're designed to be mostly useful. But this is a Sahara, which is kind of the pseudo luxury trim. So it's before you get to a Rubicon, which is more of your rock crawler, you know, has the more serious axles. It has locking diffs and that's like, you know, electronic locking diffs and that kind of thing, sway bar, disconnect. But with the Sahara, you don't get all that kind of stuff, but it's got leather seats and a paint matched top and the rest of it. It's meant to be, I guess, a little bit fancier. Fancier Jeep is such a silly thing to me, but it's meant to be a bit fancier. I like it quite a bit. I think the leather's a nice enough feature. I wouldn't have been picky one way or another, but if you can get a dark green on tan leather for any vehicle, that's never a bad decision. Yeah, but it has the upgraded stereo and it wouldn't matter what stereo you put in a jeep. It's going to sound terrible. I mean, it's a big box with fiberglass. It's like sitting in the hull of an older boat and just randomly putting speakers in places. Yeah. So the tweeters are up on top of the dash. So that's all you really can hear. There's some there's some kind of mid woofers in the doors, but those are mostly covered by your legs because it's a flat side like a slab right and then mine has this speaker bar that's connected to the roll bars so the people in the back seats have two woofers kind of above them or a mid mid mid speakers above them and then there's a subwoofer in the back but when i drive the jeep now it's full it's full of stuff i'm going to or from this project property or it's full of my kids stuff there's always you know a big kit in the back in case i have a breakdown or a problem and the subwoofer is actually towards, it's on the edge of the lift gate. So the ingress point is pinched by the, by six inches by the subwoofer. So I'm just, I have the two pieces, the two Mopar parts. I know the part number, but they've been very hard to source so far. There's not a lot of Jeeps floating around at wreckers around Toronto, unfortunately. And the, you know, the, the option on eBay is well-priced, but then the shipping is $400, which is 3.5 times the price of the part. So that's not going to work. I might call around to a couple of Jeep dealerships and see if that's a better route. But yeah, it's basically you can remove the whole thing and then I'll simply relocate the 12 volt, the rear 12 volt power adapter, the cigarette adapters in the back. I can drill a hole and pop that into the new piece, but I got to source those pieces first. So that's on the list to do. if you happen to have been someone who, you know, if somebody listening happens to have these parts in their garage or something, be sure to reach out. But something tells me there's probably more people who have the subwoofer sitting around in their garage and have already done this up to date, because it just means that you'd have essentially the opening narrows almost like where the subwoofer is. So when you're trying to slide things in or out, it's always in the way. Yeah. So I understand people wanting it and maybe, maybe the day it was new with the top off, you could, you could really get a sense of that sub hitting nice and hard, but I, I typically turn the base down in vehicles. I hate that rumble. Yeah. Um, uh, so yeah, that, that, uh, that's on, on the list of things to do. I might do a lighting array. So when you open the. The tailgate you'd get some light. Otherwise, you pretty much have to have your flashlight on in your phone or machine in your pocket or something like that. So, huh. Uh, yeah, we'll see if I get to any of those before it gets too cold. Uh, we're having kind of these weird swings. I don't know if it's the same in Minneapolis, but you know, I'm, I'm still getting used to kind of spending this much time in Toronto and it can be really warm and then just fair, like it can, it swings back and forth, but the weather's been sunny. Google today specifically told me it's a beautiful day, so I'm going to take it at its word. Uh, perfectly good day to record a podcast and then probably go for a run. Yeah. Anything else new? Anything else before we get into a wrist check? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I just wanted to give a quick shout out to Forstner Bands. I talked about Forstner a while back. Did you get the flat link? I got the flat link bracelet. |
| Jason Heaton | I know so many people that are so jazzed about this thing. |
| James Stacey | It's amazing. Forstner makes these aftermarket steel bracelets primarily for Speedmasters, but you can use them on other watches. They did that sort of mesh comfit One which I also got in fact I have all three of theirs now that I think about it because then they did a bond clip Kind of ladder style steel which I'm not as keen on probably because I bought it with too wide of a an opening for lugs, but regardless this flat link with the fitted end links for a Speedmaster is just tremendous and Shipping is always very fast with them. The pricing is reasonable. I mean, this is $150 bracelet, but to source the equivalent vintage Omega would be exponentially more And it's got a fold over really solid clasp. Great solid end links so they're not the folded style and they fit perfectly. It's very easy to mount and I got the all brushed version. And just to clarify, I didn't get it for free or anything. I actually ponied up for it and bought it. But I'm really happy I did. I'm looking at it now. It just looks great on the Speedmaster. |
| Jason Heaton | So, highly recommended. Yeah, there's a couple folks in the in the Hodinkee slack that are, you know, big speedy heads and have the Hodinkee 10. Oh, yeah. 10th anniversary speedy. Yeah. And they a couple of them have gotten these flat links. And it looks so good on that watch. It really does. Yeah. A clever thing. And yeah, the talk about a brand that kind of, you know, has kind of come out of nowhere. And I know that you really like that Comfit bracelet. It's a super cool looking Super cool looking thing. So that's neat that they're continuing on that path. A decent aftermarket bracelet, even one for $150 is really not unreasonable if you look at what it costs to buy a modern bracelet for anything. It's not even close to unreasonable. I mean, it's always nice. And there's also a huge jump in quality between the stuff you see for $30 or $40 and then that next level where you're going to find Forstner and Some of the strap code stuff that they do for Seiko where everything is solid and it uses, you know, screwed links and stuff like that. It makes it a lot easier to size. That's the kind of stuff alone can be worth the money before you bend one of the little collar slides and then the brace that's never going to go back together and the rest of it. So I've been there with some of those cheaper ones. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. Very cool. Yeah. Very cool. What do you have on this week? |
| Jason Heaton | Uh, today I've got on, I'm just, just writing it up. So by the time this episode comes out, the, uh, the post will be, uh, well live. It'll actually go up, uh, almost a week before this, uh, this episode airs, but, uh, the, uh, the Oris, uh, diver 65 chronograph, uh, Holstein edition 2020. So this is that full bronze. Oh yeah. Um, I've had it for a little while because I wanted to give it a chance to kind of get extra patinated. Yeah. and it just looks like nothing else. It looks old and beat up and then the light hits this super gold brushed dial and it really pops. I know the watch, you see the images of the original, which is basically why I asked to borrow this from Oris, but you see the images that came out when the watch was brand new and it all kind of looks like a gold watch or at least gold adjacent somewhere between yellow gold and rose gold. And then a lot of that's kind of from the tone that comes from this very bright brushed gold tone dial. But when you let the rest of the metal darken out, it gets this kind of double contrast where the case and the bezel are actually quite dark and have all this texture and kind of character to them. And then the dial remains this, you know, crystal clear, super legible gold with these dark sub dials. And I think the effect in the end is so charming. Such a fun watch. |
| James Stacey | I wonder if, um, Oh, I assume they do. When, when a brand designs a bronze watch, if they, um, you know, before they make their final decisions about it, if they actually have to, you know, patinate it or allow it to get to its kind of quote unquote worst level of patina before, to assess how it's going to look. Cause you know, that's, that's what people should expect. |
| Jason Heaton | I would assume that comes down to like, whether or not, like my guess is when they did the first Carl Brasier back in, I think 2016, uh, for Basel, my guess is that they, they had obviously you know the alloy you're using, so you can predict how it will age. But it would depend one alloy to another. And there's people who buy these bronze watches and don't actually want all the patina, so you have to kind of polish them up or clean them up and remove it. And then other people, especially if you live somewhere salty, you get all the color, the greens, and you get the kind of chunkiness that comes with the texture. I think it's great. And as interested as I've been in past ones, like the two Bray Shear models especially, which are 2016 and 2018, they seemed kind of too limited at 2000 to spend a lot of time with. But I was lucky that Oris had... There's only 250 of these. And I was pretty lucky when I asked if Oris happened to have a loaner for the press, and they said they did, and that it was not tasked at the moment. And I've had it for a while. It's just kind of been sitting. And if And if I'm just kind of out and around my place, I've been wearing it around, not wanting to, of course, damage it or anything like that, like you would with any review watch, you wanna be pretty careful, but wanting it to kind of pick up some character from my environment, from my atmosphere, et cetera. And yeah, I dig it. It's fun. I think if you're gonna go for a big watch, this is now one of my favorite big watches. It's 43 millimeters, so it's pretty big. I do think it's big enough to feel... too big on my wrist, but then the bracelet kind of helps. And the one thing that I haven't been able to get used to, and I think it's what makes it kind of extra fun, is it's so heavy. With the bracelet, it has that kind of feeling of a precious metal, where there's no point in the day do you really forget it's on your wrist. And yeah, I've been super happy with it. I think that they've done such a nice thing with this design over time. I think it's something that would be fascinating to see at 40 millimeters. assuming an SW510 would suit that sort of case size. You could slim it out a little bit. And so this is 16 millimeters thick with the crystal. So 43 kind of balances that thickness in many ways. And yeah, I think on whole, it's not something that speaks to me as strongly as like my Hodinkee LE65, but for something with a chronograph that still maintains all that style, and then it's just so much bronze. It just doesn't seem like another watch, which is always fun, right? Yeah, yeah. How about you? What have you got on today? |
| James Stacey | Well, I swear we didn't plan this, but I'm also wearing a bronze watch. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, because I changed mine up. I have something else in the notes here. |
| James Stacey | I mean, it's so strange. You know, you and I never wear bronze and then to wear this bronze watch on the same day. I just got this yesterday. This is the Vertex Bronze 75. This isn't a brand we've talked about at all, probably on the show, but... They make such nice stuff. They really do, and I, just in full disclosure, I had done some work for Vertex way back before they even launched. Some consulting work and some writing, and so this is sort of a very late payment for some work I did for them, and I'm just, I couldn't be more thrilled. It kind of came out of the blue, and it's a tremendous watch. I've never owned bronze. I don't think I've really even worn a bronze watch for more than, you know, a day at a time. Um, and I'm just thrilled with it. So Vertex is an old brand, uh, old brand name, uh, that was best known for being one of the dirty dozen, uh, uh, watch wrist waterproof, uh, watches that were made for the British army in World War II. Uh, brand ultimately went defunct and, you know, during the quartz crisis and Don Cochran, who's the great grandson of the founder of Vertex re started the brand and did it with this M 100, which is a bit of an homage to that. World War II watch and it's just such a cool watch. It looks like a dirty dozen watch. In the photos it looks big, but it's actually a 40mm watch, quite slim. This is 11mm, so it sits nice and flat on the wrist and it's got a hand-wound, top-grade ETA, I guess it's the 7001 movement. And this one is the bronze version. They made a limited edition to commemorate the 75th anniversary of the end of World War II in Europe, the European campaign. And, uh, yeah, I mean, you know, I've had it for all of 24 hours, but, uh, I, I've put it on like three or four straps. I've got it on a boon strap now, and it's got these luxuriously long hands and these big blocky markers. So the, The numerals that are used for the dial markers are like they're cut out of like solid chunks of Luminova and they just sit really three-dimensionally on the dial. Yeah. And, uh, you know, it feels great to wind it. It wears really surprisingly kind of flat and small, but, but still has a boldness to it that I like. So I can't wait to see it patina. I think, I think it's, uh, it's really fun. I, you know, bronze is, is a material that, you know, when you were talking about the Oris piece that the weight of it and and just kind of the contrast and the look. I love the idea of a bronze watch. I love the idea of a bronze anything. It just feels so old-fashioned, so nautical, so just heavy and durable. And to have something like that on your wrist is really quite thrilling. So, yeah, really excited about this one. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, the Vertex stuff is so nice. You know, I had a chance to meet Don a couple times, but actually, weirdly enough, we also ended up on the same press trip once with Aston Martin. and in Austria, and the watches are gorgeous. The proportion, it's really a lesson in proportion. I think you can see that even from the images. I haven't seen the bronze one. I have seen the steel. It's super, super pretty. They don't make a lot of them. They're not cheap watches, but they also kind of shouldn't be. It's one of those things where there's a high level of care, things like the solid luminous markers, the size, the movement, like all of it kind of comes together nicely. And yeah, I think they make, I think they make a really, really, really pretty thing and great on them for continuing with that. And congrats to you for getting the bronze on. I'm excited to see how, like what your environment, especially through, you know, maybe a winter with some salt on the roads and that sort of thing. Yeah. Yeah. What that gets as far as some color, maybe a bit of that green would be pretty beautiful on that watch, I think. Yeah. Yeah. I can't wait. All right. Well, those are two great watches. And, uh, and yeah, pretty weird to both have gone bronze when neither of us ever wear bronze. Um, and yeah, I had put something else in our notes. Uh, I had originally planned on wearing one of my doxes, uh, for this episode, but, uh, I got deeper into this write-up and haven't taken this watch off. So, but before we get to this week's main topic, our sort of watch comfort zones, we want to take a moment for our ad break. And this week we have another amazing sponsor. It's Seiko. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I mean, how crazy is that? You know, I mean, we're several years into this and we've talked so much about Seiko. We both love Seiko and to have them join the ranks of a TGN sponsor is just super exciting. I think, you know, it's a real milestone for us to have Seiko come on board. |
| Jason Heaton | Absolutely. I couldn't agree more. And this week we're talking about their latest release, the Seiko Prospects Built for the Ice Diver US Special Editions. So these are exclusive to the US market and They celebrate Seiko's past in adventuring in cold weather and even colder water. From JARE, that's the Japanese Antarctic Research Expedition, to the oldest man to ever summit Everest, Seiko is launching a trio of gorgeous Prospex Special Editions based on their popular SPB Sumo dive watches. |
| James Stacey | And these Seiko Prospects built for the Ice Diver Special Editions, they offer three different variations and they're each meant to capture a variety of color found in glacial formations. So they've got a green dial that is to hearken to the deep green of the ocean. That's the SPB-177. They've got the icy blue of the SPB-179. And then there's a kind of a cool gray dial version on the SPB-175. And they each come in a special edition presentation box along with a Prospex branded mini maglite flashlight. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, who doesn't like that, right? And 200 meters water resistance, a 45 millimeter wide steel case, a sapphire crystal, and Seiko's latest gen 6R35 movement, the Prospex built for the ice diver. Special editions have 70 hours of power reserve and all three come fitted to a matching solid steel bracelet. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, these are really lovely watches. Obviously, we're big fans of Seiko dive watches in general, but I think that Sumo case is a really popular shape, and I think it's kind of cool that they used this shape for this special edition. And one of the things that's intrigued me about Seiko's past is they do have this kind of arctic and mountaineering aspect to their dive watches, which is really cool. I actually had a chance to take my own SRP-777 under the ice a couple of winters ago, and obviously it performed just fine there. But, you know, I think it's neat to celebrate kind of a different type of heritage in terms of kind of cold weather and under ice stuff. And I think they also do a really nice job with color. I think especially with green over the years, Seiko's done a really great job. So I like that SPB-177 the most. That'd probably be the one I'd go for. |
| Jason Heaton | And man, I know I can be a broken record about grays, be it NATOs or otherwise, but for those listening, the SPV-175 is very, very, very pretty. And should you want some other color in your life, the other two models look excellent while offering a really different take on similar inspiration. With the main idea here being the kind of variety of colors you'd see in glacier formations as the environmental light changes. So sometimes you have these kind of rich greens, sometimes these more light lustrous sort of blues, and other times, maybe a cloudy day, you've got all these deep kind of tonal grays. And I think they did a really nice job capturing that aesthetic and applying it to a watch that references their kind of background in cold weather adventure. Available from any Seiko Luxury Retailer in the US, the Special Edition models are in stores starting this September with a list price of $900. You can hit the show notes for all the details or visit bit.ly slash Seiko Ice TGN. That's bit.ly dot l y slash Seiko I C E T G N for more details. |
| James Stacey | And we'd like to extend a huge thank you to Seiko for supporting this show and quite literally making it possible. Now let's jump back into the show with our main topic. |
| Jason Heaton | All right. Main topic, like you said, let's let's do it. We're talking watch comfort zones. And the idea is all of us kind of have a space that we like. And you and I typically default to watches that we now have prescribed as kind of TGN-esque watches, which maybe TGN is the podcast-esque version of these watches that we like. You know what I mean? Like one is not specifically the impetus of the other. Yeah. Along with having kind of zones that we know and love, maybe that's dive watches, maybe that's pilot's watches. It could be any sort of genre. There's always going to be some that you don't know. Like in music for me, it's going to be country music. I don't really get it. I have a tough time warming up to it. There's examples that I really like that are kind of vintage, but the new stuff I don't really get at all. It doesn't speak to me. I've tried, it doesn't always work out. And I think much like with various genres within music or film, you're going to have genres of watches that have never really spoken directly to you. And maybe sometimes you've tried, maybe sometimes you just see it and you hate it. There's all different kind of ways of coming at it, but we thought it'd be fun to kind of talk about our personal watch comfort zones, or more specifically, our non-comfort zones, our discomfort zones within watches. And yeah, I think it should be kind of fun. Jason, why don't we start with your discomfort zone? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I'm not comfortable with dress watches. I want to be comfortable with dress watches. And I think my problem is I've just been stuck in a rut for over a decade with dive watches. It was the first thing I ever bought. Buying a dive watch led me to diving and kind of a career in and studying dive watches and it fits my lifestyle. But I just love the idea of a dress watch. I see people wear dress watches and I kind of aspire to be as comfortable in that sort of genre as I am with other types of watches. It's kind of like when you see somebody who's comfortable wearing a nice suit. I'm never comfortable wearing a nice suit. Uh, it's nice to be versatile and I want to be that person, but I think, you know, the idea that I've been working from home since, you know, 2004, I seldom dress up besides like wearing a nice sweater and some khakis. Um, and I just kind of hate to have to remember to take a watch off if I go do something. So I always default to, you know, something like, you know, on one end, you know, a Garmin or at the other end, something like, uh, Rolex Submariner and that's as dressy as I get and I don't want to be that way. I think You know, I think I have yet to find the right dress watch that would suit me and I think I need to get this notion out of my head that It's something I have to wear every day You know, I think a dress watch, you know for some people who have an office job lawyer banker, you know salesperson, whatever They can strap it on in the morning. It's part of their uniform. And they really want to get that watch that they like to look at on their wrist every single day. I think for me, it's kind of the opposite. I need something that becomes a very special watch that I pull out and put on for a special occasion. Or if I want to admire it between special occasions, I don't have to necessarily wear it. I can just wind it up. I can look at it through a loop. I can polish it. Um, you know, take a picture of it, whatever. Uh, and I've tried, you know, I have a couple of dress watches I've got. Um, right now I've got a, Grand Seiko GMT. I think it's called the SBGM 021 that I bought in Tokyo a few years ago. And I don't think I'll get rid of that watch, but I just, I never wear it. Uh, Gashani likes it. We, we both kind of share it. Um, she doesn't wear it very much either, but you know, like right now I'm wearing kind of a cotton Henley shirt and sweatpants. Um, you know, to wear a kind of a glittery, fragile ivory dialed dress watch just doesn't kind of fit. Um, I don't know, that's where I'm at. I guess, you know, the other, really only the other dressy watch I had was when I was in Germany years ago. I went to a vintage shop or antique store or something and I found an old Glashütte Spitzomatic, which would have been from the Cold War era from the 60s. Again, you know, beautiful domed acrylic crystal, ivory dial, kind of dainty lugs and a thin strap. And it was a beautiful watch, but I, you know, I sold it after a year or two. I just, I never wore it. Um, but I want to find something. So, you know, maybe, maybe you can offer some input, uh, here, but, uh, there's gotta be some watches out there that, that I can, I think it has to strike a balance too. It can't be a watch that's so expensive that I feel like I have to wear it a lot, but I also don't want something, something so cheap that it's just not interesting, you know? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, nah, I mean, I think all that's fair. And some of that I've definitely dealt with. I think I really, I like wearing dress watches, but I don't typically like wearing them as the result of needing to dress up. I think that wore off faster than any dress watch I've ever owned. The idea that like, oh, I'm wearing a suit, so I'll need a watch to go with a suit or I'm going to this sort of event. Think about it in terms of the realities of our existence, the silly existence that is a professional watch writer. When you're a hypothetical, I'm on a press trip with brand X and it has either a black tie or a formal or something. And I understand there's different opinions on wearing a watch for black tie. Um, especially if it's, if said event is in someone's home versus in a location, uh, like a, a party location or something like that. But, uh, putting that kind of stuff aside, you're, you're, you're asked to dress up more so than the normal sort of, uh, semi considered casual wear that you would wear on a press trip. Maybe you've got a blazer on, or maybe you're wearing a shirt with a collar, but you're not going much further than that typically, uh, until there's that dinner. And then I found that when I had a dress watch or even two or three dress watches, it was never the right brand. So you'd be out with said with this brand. And then if I just wore any, if I wore anything, typically if I just wore a simple old vintage watch, it flew right under the radar, but none of those were necessarily dressy. Like these days it would be that Buran. Minstop would probably be the closest thing I have to a dress watch. And it's not a dress watch. It just isn't. It kind of, it's a dress watch in the same way that like, you know, in that it comes from a time when people used to dress up. Right. But I think it would have been more of a sort of middle ground between a casual watch and a dress watch. I agree that there is something super fun about having that beautiful old Omega Seamaster or Constellation and that being the kind of thing you put on occasionally when you want to. I like to think that there's a there's like an alternate reality. Jason Heaton, maybe, maybe he had an injury somewhere in his thirties and he didn't, he stopped doing all of the hands-on adventuring and he became more of an erudite, uh, uh, a scholar, if you will. And there's a lot of sitting at home with a pipe and reading. And I feel like, I feel like that Jason, this alternate, you know, and it's really only, it's a small, it's a small thing that, but eventually, you know, 10 years down the road, the path is very different. Right. It's that small change. Right. That leads in two different directions. And I think, you know, if you weren't, yeah, like you said, if you weren't diving and if a watch didn't essentially bring you into diving, maybe you would have gone down the road. And by now, instead of a couple of incredible dive watches, you've got a beautiful Lange or, you know, a fantastic sort of at one time ignored Patek Philippe that's now kind of had its come up and people are about it. Um, yeah, I could see, I could see that being, being a, a different version of Jason that somewhere in a, in a parallel universe. |
| James Stacey | I like that idea a lot. And that might be me in five or 10 years as I'm getting older. But I also feel that I've always liked that idea of it's kind of old fashioned, you know, it was the guys in the sixties who, you know, I think of like Don Draper on Mad Men. I remember there was an episode where he's out like cutting the grass. He got home, took off his dress shirt and was out there in his undershirt. you know, and like slacks and like a dress watch, like cutting the lawn, you know, and he's still wearing the same watch. It was probably some Hamilton or Omega or Jaeger LeCoultre or something. And there's, there was a time when, when people had one, maybe two watches or maybe a dive watch, you know, you didn't have one unless you were diving or sailing. Um, and, but on the other hand, You know, I like that kind of notion of you've got one kind of cool watch that you wear regularly on a leather strap. And if you go to do something specific or hard or tough or rough, you switch over to something else. But the mistake I've made in the past is thinking that what I need is a dressy watch that can do other things. And I think then it's such a compromise that it just doesn't work. So I think specifically of an Omega Aqua Terra. You see that watch and you think, oh, it's kind of a dressy watch. I could wear that as my dress watch, but it's a Seamaster. It's part of the Seamaster family. It's 150 meter water resistant. It's kind of chunky. It's sporty looking. And ultimately I get bored with it because it doesn't have a bezel. It's not a chronograph. Um, so I, I often feel like I either need to go full on vintage. And I think back to that, uh, Gerard Perregaux dress watch that you used to have, which was just beautiful. Um, or something like a Max Bill, from Junghans or one of the Hamilton Intramatics or a Nomos. Something that doesn't cost a fortune that I won't feel so bad about not wearing regularly and is properly dressy but still can be pulled off with jeans and a, you know, like a flannel shirt or something. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I mean the other thing that you might find is maybe, because you have a big wrist, so I think some of the older dress watches, a vintage dress watch is going to look really almost like probably maybe even too small. That's up to you, of course, but the other thing you might be able to find and they were made by all sorts of like vintage American brands are the big rectangular watches. So they're not like a tank, but they're in the same, I guess, vein because they're rectangular. But, you know, these are the they were made by Buren and Waltham and Hamilton, and you see them from all sorts of brands. A lot of the brands don't exist anymore. Sure. And I know that you're not a yellow gold fan, so you'd have to find one that's not gold plaque. But a lot of them were, you know, they were still 48 millimeters lug to lug and they'd fill your wrist at least in one direction. Yeah. And maybe just the change in shape from a circular watch with a bezel to a sort of cuff style something like a, like a, uh, uh, uh, you know, Cartier has done this really well with, uh, the tank's intrigue, I think, or the reverse. |
| James Stacey | So that kind of shape that sort of art deco, maybe a little bigger than that. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I could, I mean, a reverse. So absolutely. And the nice thing is, is that some of these, they made them fairly large. I mean, reverse those, the larger ones or the smaller ones, they all kind of, they don't depreciate very much. Yeah. Uh, reversals are like tanks. Like they kind of have a floor and then they sit at that floor forever. Yeah, you'll see some of these ones like a like a Waltham or I'm trying to think of another with some of these American brands that are in, you know, kind of a chunky rectangular deco we sort of case much larger than what I would attribute to a reverso or a tank a little bit more risk presence. Yeah, a little bit less. I'm not sure the word svelte or or you're just a different but but still super dressy and kind of ornate and you see them and they're really inexpensive. I'm sure that if you found one on eBay, you'd still have to get it serviced or whatever. But if you also, if you're only wearing it every now and then for a day, who really cares what the timekeeping, some of these, the seconds, there's no seconds hand. Yeah, true. Right. So I, you're not going to really sweat those sorts of details. Um, I, I, yeah, I think, uh, I think the other thing that I've learned kind of more so since coming on with Hodinkee is there's a, there's a, a whole way of wearing a very dressy watch in a casual manner. that just takes a little bit of consideration, but it doesn't typically require a vast change in outfit versus what you'd wear with a dive watch. Yeah. You know, maybe a little bit less Eddie Bauer than you and I currently wearing a mech fleece while we record this. So maybe not fleeces and stuff, but like you said, like a nicer pair of pants, a tidy shirt, maybe even one that you intend to, you know, tuck in. If Matt Horanek is listening, he's definitely now deleted and removed our entire podcast from his phone. I apologize, Matt. I love you. And obviously, if I if when let's go with when I need some sartorial advice, you're on the list. But yeah, I think a lot of it comes down to kind of kind of considering it as a whole. with a dress watch. I'm a huge fan. My problem right now with dress watches is there's not one that I want that I can afford. Just the extent to which I think it would be so fun to have a tank or a Saxonia Ultra Thin or a really lovely kind of older Calatrava and just wear it with jeans and a t-shirt and a decent pair of shoes and that kind of be like this not so much dressing up, but it's like relaxed all together. Um, there's, there's a certain elegance to that, that I don't think I've ever been able to pull off, but I've seen other people do it and I, and I kind of aspire to it. It's a, it has that sort of grandpa charm to it, which I like. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. I think, you know, when, when I was talking about, you know, a 50th birthday watch, um, earlier this year, last year, um, you know, for years, the joke between Ghoshani and me was that, you know, for when I turned 50, I wanted a long, And I was always looking and, you know, the least expensive Lange's new at the time, this was years ago, it was like $18,000 for a, uh, I think it was a Saxonia. 1815 Saxonia. 1815. Yeah. Beautiful watch. I mean, I'd still love one. I love the Ricard Lange family. It, what I like about it is it's based on old nautical deck watches, like pocket watches. And you put that on your wrist and maybe it's like a, the, the more affordable version is something from Stoa or something or |
| Jason Heaton | Or not quite true vintage Breguet marine. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Like those talk about something that does depreciate pretty aggressively. A tank kind of has a floor. I don't know what the floor on a simple three-hand or two-hand Breguet is. Yeah. But I mean, in that case, it will actually, there was one on Hodinkee shops vintage drop in the last two weeks. I don't remember the price, but I want to say it was under four grand, but it was like 34 millimeters. was small. So you have to decide if that would work. I think with the right strap, but that's the other thing that you and I wouldn't be that used to is pairing a strap with a really thin watch, like with a truly thin watch, right? |
| James Stacey | You can't wear like a shell cordovan or kind of chunky leather thing or definitely not a Bund or a NATO. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I don't think you could do the NATO or the Bund for those. No, but I think with a strap, that's kind of the right thickness. I think some of those watches are super charming, and they've been so ignored because they have a little bit of that taste of the 80s that for a while, certainly in the amount of time that you and I have gotten into watches, that was the hated range. Yeah, yeah. Even Pateks and Vacherons and APs from this era really weren't that popular, even up until a couple of years ago. If you read that laborious Royal Oak Perpetual Calendar piece I put together. If you say the words Royal Oak Perpetual Calendar now, it's like saying the word Ferrari. It has a cachet built in just to those four words. Yeah. And when those came out, they were the most expensive things in the world in steel. And then for a little while, I found auction results from the early 2000s for yellow gold Royal Oak Perpetual Calendars. that cost less than a sub today. Wow. Wow. So I mean, that's 20 years. So there's inflation and the rest of it, but people were buying these for like 11, $12,000, right? And I guess to be fair, a sub is what, um, eight grand or something. Yeah. Right. Right. Between eight and nine. So let's say a Daytona, which I think is 11, seven or 13, seven, something like that. Um, so for around the modern price of the Daytona 20 years ago, somebody out there went to Sotheby's and bought a exceedingly rare, like so rare. Handmade perpetual calendar from... And now a steel one is six figures, right? Yeah, yeah. From those watches. So yeah, I think if you could... There's definitely still a growing kind of knowing contingent within the collector community. You see it with John Reardon's Patek company, which is called Collectability. And it's a very specific aesthetic of the late 70s and some stuff from the 80s. And I think that the come up on that is still on the horizon. And I think we'll see some of these watches, which were very expensive watches in their day. And they're just not worth as much now because the sizing is maybe not ideal. It's 35 or 33 instead of 39, which is everybody wants right now. But I think there's a huge amount of attention especially if you can get into a precious metal. I think that the value statement in the precious metal world is still super high, especially when you talk about brands that aren't Rolex, AP, Patek, Vacheron. So my guess is you could find like an A-plus brand out there, a huge big name brand that's known for a hauteurology, and you'd be really surprised by some of the prices for these watches that are just left of the core, just left or right of the core. |
| James Stacey | Yeah, I feel like I need to go in one of two directions. It's in one, on one hand, go for the, um, the old, you know, American brand dress watch from the sixties, as you suggested, or, um, you know, I guess it's three directions I could go there. There's that direction. Then there's what the second thing you suggested, which is go with a top brand in maybe a less desirable era or size or look, if it appeals to me, obviously, or do I go modern? with something like a Max Bill, an Intramatic, or like a Nomos Orion, something that is modern, well-built, keeps decent time, maybe more modern sizing. A Nomos Orion is a very handsome, you know, built-in glass hoot, a beautiful watch. You can flip it over and look at the movement and admire this watch and wear it. It's probably a little more versatile, but then do I end up in my same boat where I'm like, eh, I've spent you know, three, four grand on something that I'm not wearing and I start to feel guilty. And then I like, I'll sell it and get another dive watch. You know, I don't know. I'd love to hear people's opinions. You know, I'd love to hear people chime in and tell me if they've had similar dilemmas or, or, you know, some sort of an informal poll in either the Hodinkee comment section or, or through the graynado at gmail.com. And just, you know, just tell me if anyone's had this similar journey. |
| Jason Heaton | For sure. Did you catch that? It's a shop exclusive for Hodinkee. I apologize if this is sounding like an ad. Obviously, Hodinkee directly supports the show, so... The Intramatic, right? But yeah, so just this week, the week that we're recording this, so this is October 1st, but I believe yesterday on the 30th, Logan and the shop team launched a new version of the 38mm Hamilton Intramatic that has a champagne dial. Definitely, yeah. I'm looking at a picture of it now. I've had this watch, the steel and steel Intramatic. I also have had an Orion, and the Orion is a lovely thing in photos, and then it's just the proportions are off on wrist. It's the lug, it's so much lug. Yeah. I think if you have the right wrist for it, it's an absolutely gorgeous watch. I think otherwise I would go with something else from them. but it is that that Orion is kind of the dressy thing. For the money, I don't know that you can do better than the Intramatic. And this new one has kind of this like goldy champagne dial, which really gives the watch an entirely different character. Yeah. I'm not wild about the strap that it comes on. It's kind of a featureless brown leather strap. But I think with the right strap, maybe with a strap with a little bit of a texture or stitch or something. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Maybe something with a stitch. I'm not sure. It would be something I'd play around with. I think it would be just gorgeous. I think on the right strap and it looks great on the brown one from Hamilton, but a really good looking watch and a good addition to the team. I would offer up a fourth option. which is just find yourself. You'll have to pay market price for these because otherwise you don't know what you're getting with vintage Omega. But an Omega Constellation Pie Pan, it's like mid-century perfection. And I would say that if you wear it and you just maybe just cinch the bracelet ever so slightly too loose, and it's going to be just perfect. Jeans, T-shirt. It might mean that most of the time you lean towards a better sweater or a better blazer versus a Patagonia and a thing. And maybe when you're at home with the pipe on the back cooking on your grill or whatever, this would be a nice sort of watch. And there's something, for me, there's something about a dress watch that feels like I don't have to do anything. Like a dive watch kind of says like, well, you should be diving, you should be running around, you should be banging this into stuff. There's something so... There's a luxury to a dress watch, which is the luxury of sitting still, I guess. I don't know. Yeah, true. That's how I kind of see them. I don't know. I should find a better way of voicing that concept, but there's something kind of resolute and purposeful with a dive watch or a big pilot's watch or something, and there's something so just kind of... I'm just a watch about a dress watch, and it doesn't suppose as much as far as... you know, its capabilities or the wearer's capabilities. |
| James Stacey | Yeah. And, and I think I'll close out my little section here with, you know, just a thought. And that is, you know, as I mentioned, when I got my Omega Planet Ocean years ago, it really compelled me to learn to dive and, you know, maybe, maybe the same experience, you know, buying a decent dress watch that I really like. And if I want to wear it a lot, we'll, you know, we'll help me up my sartorial game. You know, maybe I'll, I will start wearing, nicer sweaters. I mean, it's a little tough these days because everybody's at home. You're not really seeing people. So there's less motivation to actually get dressed up or look decent. But, you know, who knows? I mean, it doesn't take that much. And rather than err on the sloppy side, you know, maybe a good watch would kind of have that effect. Maybe it would up my whole game. We'll see. I don't know. |
| Jason Heaton | Hey, you never know. I'm sure that we'll get lots of suggestions. email and otherwise. But yeah, I think I think DressWatch is the other thing of note is, you know, every single time that we start our recording. Yeah, I should I should start clicking record before we say it. And I'll just start including it at the end of the show. But every time I say I'm looking at the notes and I go, oh, yeah, maybe this time it'll be an hour. Well, right. Right. We're at nearly 57 minutes and we have yet to to get through half of the. Yeah. The main topic. So another let's dive into your episode. |
| James Stacey | Let's dive into your problem with chronographs, because we need to solve this. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, for sure. I have tried, and for whatever reason, yeah, my watch discomfort zone is chronographs. If I zoom out, if I use just my... I want to inform people about something, it's fine. I can experience all of these great chronographs and understand why people like them. But I'll be honest, short of... short of maybe three that I can think of offhand, or not even offhand because we made the notes and I gave it some time. So three that I can think of with intent. I don't know of anywhere I went like, oh, I would like to own that. That's something I would like on my wrist. There's some vintage chronographs that I absolutely love, but that world is so specific that I would attempt to buy... I'm sure I would attempt to buy some gorgeous old Galet multicron or similar and it would have the wrong movement or something that I didn't spend three months researching about correctly, but I find those to be absolutely stunning. But yeah, for me, it's something about they just seem fussy in general. I've never really warmed up to the classics of the genre. I like a vintage Daytona because of the size. It was that 38, 39 millimeter kind of perfect proportions on a great bracelet. And I've had a chance to see 14 karat solid gold versions on the expanding bracelet. That's something I could get behind, but that's also a six figure watch. Everyone should be able to roughly understand its appeal, but I'm not spending that kind of money on watches. Even more of a hit to my general watch nerd cred is I've never warmed up to the Speedmaster. be it old ones or new ones or vintage inspired ones or ceramic ones. They're all beautiful watches. And then I put them on my wrist and the only one that I ever put on them was like, oh no, this is legitimately incredible. Was that brand new? It was from, well, brand new from a little over a year and a half ago, I guess they launched it at Watches and Wonders, but that solid gold 50th anniversary, you know, full moonshine gold Speedmaster. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I thought that one was pretty awesome, but obviously I should. You know, I really like the original version of that. I was lucky enough to check out Roberts at an Omega event years ago at a NASA event in Dallas. And was it Dallas? Where were we for that, Jason? Houston. Houston. At a NASA event in Houston. And yeah, those ones are gorgeous. I have a big love for the racing dial, aesthetically. The 2004 Japan LE racing dial, the gray orange. But I've never had one of those on my wrist. I've had lots of 3570s and a good buddy back in Vancouver let me borrow his... It was a 145022, 68 step dial, I think. Um, I'd have to go back and check. It's in my Instagram anyways, but I think that's roughly what it is. But then I put them on my wrist and I just, it doesn't really speak to me. Uh, I don't really know why I like a watch. I like watches with, you know, dive, like water resistance. And typically that makes a chronograph even bigger and more fussy. I mean, this, this Oris dive chronograph that I spoke about earlier is great, but I would still default likely to a normal 65, you know, three hand with or without, without the date. When you start to add in the thickness of the movement and the chronograph module and the screwed crowns and this and that, it ends up just kind of adding bulk to the watch. And then I find when I actually go and use them, the little indication, unless you've got a, what's the Lamania 5100 is central minutes. Unless you're running one of those very cool watches with that movement, the little indication is so tiny. Sometimes I can't resolve between say four and five minutes. Like for hours, they're great. If you have one that has a 12 hour scale, but there's a lot of chronographs, this Oris included that have a maximum, you know, register of 30 minutes and 30 is pretty easy to read. That's pretty simple. But then when you get into 60 and it's being shown on one sub dial or the planet ocean chronographs that put the hours and the minutes on one sub dial, depending on the movement that some of I just find by the time I used it, I go like, why didn't I just use one of like my garment, like as a big digital display that I can read fairly simply, a garment, a Timex, like a lot of times when it comes down to a chronograph, I just prefer, like so far I've often preferred digital. I love the digital chronograph on the aerospace because it was so unobtrusive and yet so legible. Um, so yeah, it's, it's, it's a mix of just kind of like, it feels like I've, I have a bunch of features on my wrist that I'm not going to use. And if I did try and use them, it wouldn't work that well for me. Uh, and there's something just kind of pure about a three-hander or even a GMT, you know, GMT is a function that like I absolutely adore and I find very useful and, uh, and I just don't use, I don't use a chronograph that often. |
| James Stacey | I mean, I think, you know, there are two sides to a chronograph, whether you like it or not, and it comes down to function and kind of usability factors, and it also comes down to aesthetics. And I think your remarks about legibility of being able to read the sub-dials is legitimate. I have the same quibbles with so many of them, especially as I get older, my eyesight's getting worse. It's just, it's so difficult. I think the way around that part of it, that discomfort, would be to seek out those that overcome that. Some watches have actually, like you mentioned the Omega, and IWC I think was even before Omega with that integrated clock face style. sub-dial that integrates the minutes and the hours. Um, I think it was on the yacht club chronograph and, um, you know, something like that. But I think for me, a chronograph is, is an aesthetic thing. I like the tactile instrument look to it. I love a good set of pushers sticking out the side. To me, it's just, it has this asymmetrical interest to it. Um, what about, um, what about just switching gears real quick here? I saw, I guess I pinged you with it. Analog Shift was selling that ceramic, early IWC Flieger chronograph. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, not the doppel, yeah, yeah, the ceramic one, yeah. |
| James Stacey | But the doppel chronograph also. I mean, those 90s era 39mm Flieger chronographs from IWC are just beautiful little watches that have this tool aspect to them, but they wear well. Yep. You know, so aesthetically, how do you feel about chronographs? I mean, do you even like pushers on a watch, I guess? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, no, I'm not against pushers. I find that whether or not I have to remember to screw them down or not feels like a pain. But I have other watches that can't get wet at all, so I don't know why I would necessarily care that much. I think some of them I really love the way they look. I have a little list of a few that I absolutely love and would own, and one of that is the Zen 144 GMT, which I did own. And that's a fantastic watch, but I found that most of the time I was just using the GMT feature. It's cool that it has both. It was fantastic because they had found a couple ways to work around the thickness of the watch. You know, with hooded lugs and I eventually sourced a decent looking bracelet for it. And that's a watch, one of the few that I actually, you know, regret selling. That's a pretty great watch, but it went to a good guy and he's taking good care of it. So that's okay. The other one I remember really enjoying, but it didn't help at all. It was aesthetically gorgeous, but not that easy to read was that Longines Big Eye. Yeah, I like that. And that's a great watch with an interesting and usable movement for a fair price. But then the minutes register, which is the big eye, it doesn't have a scale. It's just markers. So the hours are hyper legible, the running seconds super legible, the watch is just the right size. I think it's really, really pretty and a watch that I would absolutely own, probably my favorite Longines right now. But the Big Eye, as aesthetically cool as it looks, isn't that legible. I understand, I imagine each marker is, you know, one minute, so you just have to kind of deal with, you know, these larger markers that kind of give you, you'd learn, you'd figure it out. But it's not that intuitive by default. I also adore the 38 millimeter version of the Royal Oak Chronograph, which they announced a year and a half ago-ish. A pretty gorgeous watch, super fun, but I'm never going to spend that much on a watch, so not a whole lot of purpose there. And then the other one that has always stood out in my mind when you talk about chronographs that I think are gorgeous and functional would be that Zinn 910 SRS Anniversary. Was that the split seconds one? That's the split second, yeah. Oh, I love that one. I love that one. Yeah, so you and I took that meeting together way back in the day. Yeah. Way back in the day being what? I guess three years ago, two years ago maybe. But that watch is absolutely stunning. A light dial, dark markers, split second chronograph, limited edition. Expensive in the world of the price point that people typically attach with Zinn, but it's one of their more special watches, kind of a flagship thing. and all other marks considered, not that expensive in terms of its competition and its ability and that kind of thing. And those ones are great and beautiful and super legible and the rest of it. But yeah, I haven't found one that speaks. And maybe what I should do is kind of combine both of our things and find a dressy chronograph. Stop making it seem like it needs to be a tool. And just let it be something that's pretty and fun and has like an added complication. And certainly I'm sure the world of vintage dressy chronographs isn't one that needs my money. I'm sure that's a pretty hot market. At least that's the way that I would perceive that part of the watch vintage world. But there's some absolutely gorgeous watches in there too. My guess is at some point I would be buying them and I would either never use the chronograph or if I did, I'd still be wondering like, you know, Why didn't I use some other method of timing this that was just much easy to refer to? I time things like some food for my kids or the five minutes I have to wait to check the oil in the Jeep. I often wonder what people are using these chronographs for. |
| James Stacey | I think we have a common problem here with both of our picks and that is that we default to this notion of it has to be functional. What will I use this for? What can I use it for and what can't I use it for? I think what I'm trying to achieve with dress watches is maybe a more subtle appreciation or just exploring a different part of appreciation. And I think, um, with, with a chronograph or with a dress watch, the concern about water resistance, when I really think about it and you touched on it, um, is how often am I really in the water? You know, I mean, I take a shower landing it never, but like, yeah, I mean, this, this sort of hypothetical scenario that I always sight, you know, oh, what if I fall in a pool or what if I need to jump in a lake to save somebody? It's like, okay, you know, these are rare, very strange hypothetical scenarios. And for the most part, if I'm going to a lake to go swimming or diving, I'm not, I'll just leave the chronograph or the dress watch at home. And yeah, no, you're true. I think a vintage kind of dress chronograph is one that you wouldn't have to feel like you needed to use for any specific function. And you could maybe appreciate it or maybe, you know, going back to my, Junghans Max Bill idea. They make that beautiful chronoscope that's a very delicate watch with a domed, very scratch prone crystal. Maybe that's not the ideal choice, but you know, something along those lines, I usually think of chronograph as such a, a tool watch, you know, the pilot's watch or a dive chronograph or something. But I think to err on the side of a more delicate dressy one might be one that inspires you to just sort of pick up and slowly wind and you know, maybe take off the back and watch the, Mechanism work as you use the pushers or something like that that isn't necessarily something you feel compelled to wear and time things You know, I don't know. |
| Jason Heaton | I feel like we both have the same have kind of the same issue with different types of watches Yeah, I think that the solution is that we both just need to buy long us. I'll buy a chronograph You buy something super dressy Yeah. And we'll just see how it works out. I mean, it's a small, small lift for sure. Sure. Yeah. Uh, I like that, you know, we each get paid roughly one longest value per episode of TGN. So it should be super simple, small, a small sacrifice, but I, you know, you, you look, you, you do look at some of these. I think, I think what I should try is, is to give a, like a, a vintage, nothing super fancy, not a long or something like that, but to give a vintage chronograph a try. Something a little bit dress, maybe on the dressier side so that I expect less of its functionality. Yeah. And just kind of give it a run. There's some lovely galets and lamanias and all sorts of stuff out there like that, that maybe get a little bit of that mid-century sort of warmth, a yellow gold or gold plaque or something like that. Maybe that's the solution. It is something that I think we should both endeavor to attempt in 2021. Yeah. We can look back on episode 126 at some point as a follow-up and see how you fared with a dress watch and I fared with making a determined effort to find and appreciate the world of the chronograph. Yeah, I like that plan. |
| James Stacey | That's a good idea. |
| Jason Heaton | If you're listening and you have any sort of suggestions, dress watches, chronographs, maybe you have an old vintage chronograph or a great dress watch that you think one of us would dig and you need it out of your immediate area, drop us a line, thegraynadoatgmail.com. And of course, when you're listening to this, it will already be October and we have not recorded September's Q&A. I'll just be as honest as possible with that one. We will get to it, but there's plenty of time to still get questions in. We're getting questions every day. I think we'll try and make the next one an even bigger episode than normal. People seem to like these Q and A's, so maybe we'll just go along and get to as many questions as possible. But should you have a question for us, talk it into your phone, keep it pithy, keep it around a minute, and send that voice recording to thegrenadoatgmail.com and we will add you to the growing list. A huge thank you to everyone who's already sent in their questions for past Q and A's or with the hopes of being in one of the future ones, but we will get to September's ASAP, probably on the other side of Jason's upcoming cabin trip, which is a pretty good way to come back into the work week with a Q&A episode. In the hopes of this not being one of our longer episodes, what do you say we head into final notes? |
| James Stacey | Yeah, definitely. I've got two. I've got a short one and a slightly longer one, so I'll jump in first. My first one is an article on the blog of a website called af0210strap.com. The article is... How did you find this? |
| Jason Heaton | Unless that's just the most clever piece of SEO we've ever come across. |
| James Stacey | The article is called Milestones in the Development of the NATO Strap, which I felt is so appropriate for the GrayNATO podcast. I guess so. So the AF0210 strap was the code number given to the cotton canvas straps that were put on to dirty dozen watches in World War II. So now you can kind of see my train of thought here, wearing a Vertex that led down a bit of a rabbit hole because one of these straps came fitted on this watch. And so I went to this website, this guy that makes these really cool retro style straps, and he has a Kickstarter going right now where he's actually reproducing what he claims is the original NATO strap from 1954, developed by the RAF for pilots. You know, talk about niche interests and really deep dives into very specific subjects within subjects. This guy is something of an expert in military issue nylon straps or fabric straps. And this particular article that I'm linking to here is called, you know, Milestones in the Development of the NATO Strap. And he goes back to that 1954 strap and even beyond, back to World War I when they were fitting pocket watches onto wrists and the leather straps that used a second under piece of material to hold the watch on and kind of the further development until we finally get to this one developed by the RAF in 1954. And you know, I really, I really like what he's done here. If I would go even beyond this article, if you just kind of click around his blog and take a look at his products for that matter, I think the straps are really cool. He just has a number of really interesting stories about the development of some of these straps. I learned from my friend Myron from Roverhaven Straps, who's an active member over at the Military Watch Resource, that this guy who runs this site and sells these straps is actually an Episcopalian minister who kind of does the stuff on the side. really an interesting deep dive and kind of some cool background on the development of our deer NATO straps that we love so much. So check that out. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, absolutely. Probably somebody we should, I don't know, pencil in for a show at some point. Yeah, seriously. Yeah. It could be a super interesting thing, but I'm looking at the straps now. I might just have to order one of these up. He sells a number of them, but they look really, really good. Yeah. Super fun. Well, that's a great first pick. I'm also excited about your second pick. Yeah. But I'll drop mine in here. I just have the one. It is a new album from the band Fleet Foxes. I know I've spoken about Fleet Foxes in the past when we did, was it a TGN Desert album? Oh, yeah. I don't remember what the context of our music show was, but I know that I cut some of their music into an episode once, Ocean Grown from Helplessness Blues. But this was sort of a surprise album. If you follow the kind of main guy from the band, the lead singer, uh, Robin Pecknold on Instagram. You should, he's one of my absolute most favorite follows. Um, but if you follow him, you would have seen, he's been working on an album for, for a while as you do as a professional musician, I suppose. And I think the timing, of course, the timing of the album changed with COVID and the rest of it, but they, he surprised, uh, launched the album on the Equinox, uh, at 6 31 PM, something like that, right, right at, right at the Pure Equinox and the album is very much kind of about the transition from summer to fall. Oh, nice. And it's... I waited, my brother was making fun of me, we were at the cottage property working and he was asking me what I thought of this, because they're probably my favorite band. And I said, I haven't listened to it because It came out just before I left for the cottage and I didn't want to listen to it on cheap headphones. Yeah. I want, I wanted to listen to it on a proper set of speakers. So when I, when I made it home, uh, from that, from that work weekend, I, uh, I put them on the calves and it's, uh, it's man, uh, I've, I've been through it maybe 10 times so far. And, uh, I absolutely, I absolutely adore it. I'll drop in a little bit of, um, Some audio from one of my favorite songs on the album called Can I Believe You? We'll drop it in here. What a surprise it is to, you know, see on Instagram a kind of teaser that something's happening tomorrow, that it's called Shore and kind of hoping that it's a whole album and not just a song or two, but, you know, really being ready to be happy with anything, given the general climate, especially around things that make you happy, like an album from your most favorite band. And then to see this is 15 songs. It's absolutely gorgeous. A really, really special thing that I'm thrilled is in the world. So a huge thank you to Fwee Foxes and Robin Pecknold. I mean, he's great. You should follow both of them. The band has their own Instagram and he has his and both are great. And you can kind of look back and there's there's elements in Can I Believe You? You would have already heard a clip of this, but there's a kind of chorus singing around the main refrain of the song. And that chorus was actually just I think it was between four and 500 people. Robin had asked for people to essentially mimic a vocalization and send it to him via Instagram, and he took all these files and blended it in to make it sound like a chorus. So yeah, there's some interesting crowdsourcing to some of the work, and there's some other voices on the album that are certainly worth Googling as they're from within the sort of Fleet Foxes sphere, but aren't all, you know, professional musicians or people of, of, uh, intense notoriety, but just huge amounts of skill and thoughtfulness. And it really is just a beautiful way to end, end the day to click this on and close your eyes and, uh, listen to it a bit. I've, I've, uh, I've really, really been enjoying it. |
| James Stacey | Oh, nice. I'll, I'll check that out. I think we're definitely building up to, uh, a, uh, a TGN sort of music club episode. I think we've talked about it for quite some time, and you've talked about Fleet Foxes before. You've turned me on to some other stuff, and I think I've shared a few with you, and I think we should do that in one of our upcoming episodes. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, we definitely should. I remember, I guess it might have been a Desert Island thing, because I put in some color blue or color blue for you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And kind of blue, thank you. Yeah, the Miles Davis and some Fleet Foxes. And yeah, if that's something that you think you would like to see from us in the future. We've mentioned music a few times, and obviously we've invested full episodes into things like movies. If you'd like to hear a similar format to the film club, but for music, let us know, drop us a line, thegranadoatgmail.com. And if that's something people would enjoy, I'd be more than happy to make that a topic before the end of the year. We're kind of working through our calendar now, but that'd be fun. Yeah, but by all means whatever whatever streaming platform buying music find it on vinyl whatever it is that you do to listen to your stuff sure is Absolutely, it's just it's so it's so good Listen to it. Enjoy it. I hope you dig it as much as I do. |
| James Stacey | All right I'm gonna bring us out with something that was it was very apropos given all of your cottage construction work this summer. This is an article from, I think it's, uh, let's take a look. July of this year called we quit our jobs to build a cabin. Everything went wrong. This is an article on outside online, um, by Brian Schatz and Patrick Hutchinson. So these are a couple of guys that, um, they, they did this. They went out to somewhere in the cascade range in Washington and decided to kind of give up their mundane desk jobs and pool their money and sell their stuff and move into the woods and build a cabin from scratch. And, you know, we all have these romantic notions of, you know, living out of a van or buying an old Defender and touring the country and working by, you know, tethered phones and that sort of thing. And these guys went out and they did it. And, you know, as most of these things tend to be, it was less glamorous than you think it might be. But they learned a lot. And it was just an entertaining article. I think there was a bit of humor in it and I just learned a lot. But what a tremendous amount of work. I would never aspire to this. We've talked about fixing up an old cabin or cottage like you're doing, but I would never do this. Sounds like a nightmare to me. |
| Jason Heaton | I wouldn't even approach what I've done this summer without some level of help, my brothers and other people who have some level of, some greater level of, of just how to approach various problems. Yeah. Um, and when it comes to this, to start with a piece of land in the Cascade range, and I mean, one of the most beautiful places I've ever been. Yeah. I've spent time, uh, down in, in Glacier, Washington, et cetera, Woolley. And of course on Baker and, and in these spots are just, it is, it's this Jurassic park, or if, if, or if you'd rather, uh, uh, early X-files, sort of jungle forests. Yeah. Pretty common to the areas around Vancouver and of course Seattle and the rest. It's something fantastic, but I read this the day it came out and I remember thinking, wow, this is... These guys are... Yeah, we quit our day jobs to build a cabin, everything went wrong and then the sub line is, and it was awesome. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Um, but yeah, you, the, the, everything from the photography to, um, to the, the explanation of everything they had to do. And then, and then you add this much greater challenge, like where even with the stuff I've been doing this summer, I have power. Uh, I don't really have to haul things up a Hill. I just drive up in my car and take it off of a trailer or whatever. This is like remote. They're building, they're building an entirely, you know, secondary source, uh, off the grid sort of, uh, option. And that included, you know, digging post holes and the rest of it all the way up to framing an entire building and then finishing it. And yeah, this in many ways lived up to, like, if you would ask me, oh, how hard do you think it would be? I now have an illustration, but I think I would have guessed it was as hard as these guys kind of said it would be. The end result is frankly gorgeous. Stunning. It's gorgeous. |
| James Stacey | I mean, this is such a beautiful job. This isn't just some little, you know, hunter's shack. This is full on. This is beautiful. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, for sure. A great post and a solid pick on your part. It's definitely something I read and really poured over and chatted about with a few folks, and then didn't add it to my pocket to make it a final note. So I'm glad that you had the wherewithal to do so, because I think this is absolutely worth your time to read. A great story, well told, and I think a very realistic thing, covering both the emotional turmoil and uplifting elements of this project, and also just the general physical challenges. Yeah. And the financial challenges, which, you know, these things never go to cost, right? Right. But I look at a couple of the photos of their final product versus what I've put together at this family property outside of Toronto. And yeah, we're not operating on the same level. I'm really just trying to keep an old farmhouse above ground, basically. and anybody who's inside it relatively comfortable. But what they've got here is absolutely gorgeous. Yeah. And yeah, they did a beautiful job. And it's a great story. Cool. Well, it would fit into that. It would fit into that book that Outside put out that I bought a couple of years ago, a couple of years ago, Out There, their tour of general misadventure. I think this would be a strong addition to that book because it has kind of all those sides to it. But A great pick, man, for sure. I would endeavor to do something like that someday, but probably from a kit. So maybe start somewhere with a concrete pad and then put an A-frame on top of it. I could see definitely doing that kind of work, especially as I get a little bit more comfortable with construction. But this is a whole different thing. They're on a slope in the middle of nowhere. Digging footings, hauling concrete and timbers. All by hand, all in their free time. Crazy. Huge lift, but a super fun post. And as always, that that time has come. Thank you so much for listening. You can hit the show notes via Hodinkee.com or the feed for more details. And just a huge thank you to Seiko and their new prospects built for the Ice Diver US Special Editions for supporting this episode. You can learn everything you need to know at bit.ly slash Seiko, I-C-E-T-G-N. You can also follow us on Instagram at Jason Heaton and at J.E. Stacey, and you can follow the show at The Graynado. If you have any questions for us, please write TheGreyNado at gmail.com and please keep sending in those voice memos. We love to hear from you. Finally, please subscribe and review wherever you find your podcasts and music throughout is Siesta by JazzArt via the free music archive. |
| James Stacey | And we leave you with this quote from Johnny Ox, who said, don't let the tamed ones tell you how to live. |