The Grey NATO - Ep 111 - The Isolation Tapes // Tudor

Published on Thu, 14 May 2020 06:00:23 -0400

Synopsis

Jason Heaton and James Stacey discuss the watch brand Tudor, reviewing their various model lines like the Black Bay, Pelagos, and Heritage Chronos. They analyze Tudor's brand re-launch and how they have carved out their own identity separate from Rolex while still leveraging design heritage. They cover vintage and modern Tudor models, sharing their personal experiences and opinions on the watches.

Transcript

Speaker
Jason Heaton Hello and welcome to another episode of The Gray Nado, a Hodinkee podcast. It's a loose discussion of travel, diving, driving, gear, and most certainly watches. This is episode 111, and it's kindly brought to you by our friends and colleagues at The Hodinkee Shop. More on that in a bit. Hey, Jason, how you doing?
James Stacey I have to admit I'm a little groggy. I'm running a little slow today. For one thing, we're recording a little later in the day than we usually do. I don't know if that makes a difference, but I also did a little booze-based baking this morning and sampled some of the ingredients and kind of put me in kind of a sleepy stupor. But I'm not out and out buzzed or drunk here just to preface this, but you know, I don't I don't really drink anymore other than the occasional dram of whiskey. And so when I have four ounces of beer, that's the rest is going into a loaf of bread. Uh, it kind of knocked me out here, but I've adequately caffeined up. So I'm, I'm good to go. There you go.
Jason Heaton How about you? Well, uh, I'm sober, um, um, and not, not thrilled about anything today, if I'm honest, uh, just, just kind of having a, not an off day. I'm just not really about it. I think, uh, today would have been better spent just, staying in bed. Yeah. You know, binging a television show or something like that, but Tuesdays are Tuesdays and you still have to respect the flow of time.
James Stacey Well, speaking of binge watching, I've got a good one for you. If you ever get back to that, uh, this could have been a final notes, but I'm kind of throwing it, throwing it up here on top. Uh, Kishani and I have been binging this French spy series called the Bureau and it is just superb. We, someone had mentioned it, um, to her via an Instagram post that she put up about Homeland, I think, because we finished season eight of Homeland, which of course Homeland is great. But someone said, Homeland's incredible. Someone said, try The Bureau. It's a French series. And it's better. It's better than Homeland. And we're on season, there's five seasons, I think, four are available. And we're about midway through the fourth season in like a week. Is it subtitled? It's subtitled. There are some actors that might be familiar from Homeland that pop up along the way and from some other places. Just a really smart, well-acted, cerebral, kind of slow build. You know, Homeland is kind of, you're always sort of quivering as they go through the shows. Carrie Matheson's kind of a high strung central character and the show kind of revolves around her and the Bureau is a little more spread out among a few stories and characters and it's, boy, it's superb. So anyone out there looking for a good kind of espionage, you know, world affairs sort of program, this is a This is a great one. The Bureau. Pro tip.
Jason Heaton That's great. Yeah, I haven't I haven't really been watching a ton of TV, you know, after the the film club from last week, I watched a couple of movies, some from the film club and some not. But yeah, I haven't I've been a little bit behind on on TV, which is weird because, you know, theoretically, more time would mean more watching, but it just hasn't worked out that way. That's not a bad thing. You spend time doing other stuff, I guess. No, no, no. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I've been, you know, back into you know, trying to put some daily time into the guitar and the piano. Um, you know, the, the guitar thing, it was something that I used to play quite a bit. And then, uh, I lost the calluses on my finger maybe over the last six months or so. Um, well, I guess not these six months, six months before March and, uh, and just, just kind of working my way back up to that. So there's good days where I can play for a while. And there's days where I think I make it through about four bars and, uh, and just decided hurts too much.
James Stacey I had a boss once, uh, several years ago who, um, when I first met him, I didn't know what his hobbies were. And I remember always noticing that the, uh, the thumbnail on his right hand was extraordinarily long, like kind of creepy long. And, uh, sure enough, he was a, he was a accomplished guitarist and, um, using it to pick. Yeah. And, and he had a nice voice and he wrote some music and we used to go listen to him play. But I always thought before I knew that, I was like, Oh, that's a really strange little sort of little quirk, but that was the story. Yeah.
Jason Heaton Yeah. I mean, other than that, on this end, you know, we always seem to do a weather update. It's a, it's not nothing special these days. We had some snow, which is weird, but I think, you know, judging from Instagram, a lot of places that you wouldn't have expected to have snow had snow the last little while, uh, spending a lot of time just around the house on like little projects, stuff that I always kind of meant to do, uh, you know, got some tools out and, and properly fixed a few things and sanded a few other things and that kind of stuff. Uh, And then just probably spending most of that TV time on Craigslist in Ontario. I don't know if they have it in the States, but I think probably not. There's another sort of Craigslist competitor called Kijiji.
Unknown Oh, no.
Jason Heaton And it wasn't a thing in Vancouver, so I think it might be a fairly localized thing, but it's much more popular here than Craigslist is. You kind of have to use both if you're serious. But with people being home, these sites seem to be flooded with new stuff. And you can do a lot of it, like I've done a few things where it's like just pure porch pickups, like you don't see the person. Yeah. In Canada, I'm sure there's probably 20 options for this, but in Canada we have interact e-transfers, so you can send somebody money like immediately right from your bank. So you can do that pretty easily just with an email address. So you can do these kind of pickups of just kind of random stuff that like stuff where you don't have to be too worried about testing it or trying it or anything like that. So I'm not buying much in the way of say audio equipment, but in terms of like simple furniture and stuff like that, hard goods.
Unknown Yeah.
Jason Heaton Um, there's, there's a lot of options and, uh, that's been kind of fun because it's, it gives you kind of an excuse to, uh, to get in the car and, and, uh, go pick something up. And that's been a nice kind of a little, little source of projects, which has worked out so far. Um, and then assuming that the, the weather actually turns, cause I know you have some updates on, on the Rover. Assuming the weather actually turns, this may be the week or maybe even this weekend to attempt to put the soft top on the Wrangler.
James Stacey Oh, very cool. Yeah. Oh, that'd be great. I mean, that's actually exciting news. I mean, that's kind of a sign of a new season and it's just a whole new diversion for you. That's great. Suddenly I'd have a convertible. Exactly. Yeah. Wow. So where are you going to store the hard top? That's always my conundrum when it comes to the Rover.
Jason Heaton Yep, that's a wise question on your part. I'm not really sure. I have a garage, it's just a question of the space. And I also wanna make sure that... I have some ideas on how I can store it, but I want that to be safe for the top, because I really prefer the Jeep aesthetically with the whole top. It's a painted, factory painted hard top, and it comes off in kind of... If you imagine the back of any Jeep is that one side window, the rear window, and then the facing other side window. Yeah. and then a roof. And it's exactly the same whether you have a two door. Well, it's not the same bit, but it's the same design, whether you have a two door or four door. In my case, there's panels that go in front for the four door. Those are the ones that would be over the driver and the front seat passenger. But you do have to... It's not like the rear piece is four pieces and it comes apart. It's one. It's almost like a clamshell. I do have to find a place for that, and I definitely don't wanna leave it outside. It is... they're very expensive, especially when you start talking about paint matched ones. Oh, sure. And the paint option on my Jeep is a weird one. So if you ever had to try and replace it, it would be a problem. So I want it to be inside preferably and cared for. So I'm just looking into options of what I could build as far as a little trolley. Oh yeah. That might even allow me to remove it and reinstall it alone. So I'm just looking into a few options like that, but Once that's sorted, then I have to bring in all of the soft top pieces, which were delivered in, you know, when I bought this used Jeep, was delivered in like a box and a series of Ziploc bags, and then just some loose, huge pieces, the whole top and everything else. So I have to bring that inside and actually do like a bit of a manifest and make some notes as to the condition and see if anything needs a repair. But I have, I didn't, the Jeep didn't come with a toolkit, so I rectified that in the last few days. So at the very least, I could go around the block with the doors off now if I really wanted to, something like that.
Unknown So that can be fun. Yeah.
Jason Heaton Oh, nice. But yeah, I would say that's probably the next on the horizon, but I would like the weather to stabilize, not so much that it's not warm or cold, but that it's not snowing. That's all. Yeah. You know, May being May, a different May than when I was a kid, I guess. Yeah, right.
James Stacey Well, it'd be nice to have a decent stretch of days that if you're fine tuning the soft top, you know, you can do it without, you know, numbing your fingers or something. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, I keep thinking one day I'd like to put a soft top on the Land Rover. It's got the factory, you know, hard top, but it just looks so good without a top on it. I love the way it looks with those old school hoops and the canvas top, but like you, I don't really have good storage options for it unless I make like a little garden shed out of the hard top somewhere, put it out in the backyard and store stuff in it.
Jason Heaton Yeah, I mean, it's an option. I mean, a lot of them are that stable. I just worry about things like, um, animals or stuff eating away at the seals around the window, which maybe is a less of a concern for something as old as the Land Rover, but like the Jeeps, it's all in nice condition. Yeah, yeah. And I'd rather preserve that because I have no intention of ever not having this Jeep, I'll just drive it into the ground over the next 15 or 20 years or whatever. It's one of those things where I think that it is really cool to have the soft top on any of these vehicles, but like you, I vastly prefer the look and the function and the ability to drive on the highway and have something approaching a non-yelling conversation.
James Stacey Right.
Jason Heaton Right. In the Jeep, especially, you know, two little kids in the back seat who don't understand why I have no concept of what they're saying between my relatively poor hearing and, you know, a 60 decibel interior noise. So.
James Stacey Well, speaking of highway driving, I'm actually without the Land Rover these days. It's in the shop. Oh, yeah. I'd mentioned the overdrive installation that was going to be happening and that is in. Currently, but I have not seen it yet or driven it because while it was in the shop, I had, um, this place, which specializes in Land Rovers, kind of do a bumper to bumper assessment of what it needs and that sort of thing. And they said, you know, you're, you're, you've got one of the leafs leaves in your leaf springs, uh, is broken. And so you're going to need some new springs soon. And the exhaust is getting pretty rusted and whatever. So I was like, you know, why not just keep it there and order in the parts. And so those, I've got some new. Parabolic springs and a stainless steel exhaust being sent over to the shop. I think UPS says it's arriving there tomorrow, so I'm hoping they can get to the work on Thursday and Friday. Fantastic. And I'll have it by the weekend. So I think with the overdrive and some cushier new springs and a quieter exhaust, I think it should be not interstate ready, but at least I can take it up to 60 miles an hour and be comfortable, if not loud. I'm excited. That'll be great. I'm very excited. Yeah, I'm super excited. I've been without it for eight days and it's kind of like separation anxiety. I just, when I'm home, I like to look out the window and see it parked there. And even if I'm just taking it to the grocery store, it's nice to, you know, these days, given our strange circumstances, it's become a bit of a, you know, jail break to kind of get out and even go for a short drive.
Jason Heaton Uh, so a little diversion. I agree entirely for sure. Uh, and more so as the weather improves, no doubt as the, these things tend to run a little bit better and squeak a little bit less when it's warm. Yeah. Yeah, well, I think that pretty much covers what's new aside from a watch, which I'll save for our wrist check. Do you want to chat about the little companies for this week?
James Stacey Yeah, so we're going to do a little something different this week. You know, usually we spotlight a small company that maybe is facing some challenges in these odd times. And this week I just wanted to give a shout out to a fellow podcast, the Beyond the Dial podcast. So this is a sort of a friend or colleague across the business from us, Alan Formello, who is a freelance writer. He's done some work for Gear Patrol and Rob Report and Bob's Watches. And Alan started his own podcast last year at some point and he calls it Beyond the Dial. And I've listened to a few episodes and it's got a different take. It's kind of a one person podcast where he brings in a guest every now and then, but he kind of likes to muse and get philosophical on things like watch design and collecting habits. And, uh, you know, just kind of an intelligent take on things, watches. And Alan's a diver and he's talked about some of the travels. He's, he did a nice post or a nice episode on diving with a Rolex and Bonaire. And, um, and he maintains a pretty, pretty active Instagram feed that goes along with the podcast. So you can check out beyondthedial.com or at beyondthedialpodcast on Instagram. So hats off, Alan, keep it up and best of luck.
Jason Heaton Yeah, Alan's a sweetheart and it's a solid show for sure. Definitely a different take on the idea of a podcast, which I appreciate. And he has a kind of a fresh perspective and certainly lots of interests that align with TGN.
James Stacey Yeah. Hey, so I'm excited to hear about the watch you're wearing. This is our weekly wrist check here and You've got something new and exciting in the house. Yeah. Tell us about it.
Jason Heaton Yeah. So those who already follow my Instagram will have seen it, but I've got the doxa carbon. So the, uh, the sub 300 carbon Aqua lung us divers limited edition, uh, you can tell I've been practicing that name, um, is, is on wrist. I, uh, I got it, uh, yesterday. Uh, so we're recording this on a Tuesday. It came in Monday. I have it for a few days to shoot photos and kind of prepare a We'll call it a bigger hands-on for Houdinkis. I think it's how it's going to work out. But honestly, the short of it is like I love it. It's more than I expected it to be. It really feels both like a sub 300 and entirely special, which I think has to have been the goal when you're making something like this. Otherwise, like why make a carbon version of a 1960s dive watch? It really has that kind of duality of the difference between an old or even a modern but you know quote unquote simple royal oak like a 15202 and then compared to something like like an offshore carbon or the ceramics like it's the same it's a shape that you know yeah and a format that you understand that that maybe already feels at home on wrist obviously with Jason and I we have DOCSIS and I'm a big fan of the brand but suddenly it's rendered in a way where every time you look at it or when you realize it weighs nothing. Like I haven't weighed the watch itself. It came in on a cut to fit rubber strap that was a little bit too big for my wrist. So I popped it off the strap, put it on a NATO and you barely notice it's there. The easiest comparison I can make is it feels a lot like the Aerospace that I had, which is a titanium, a very thin, very small 40 millimeter titanium watch. And if I put that on a NATO, I would forget I was wearing it. And that's the same thing with this. And then you look down and it's this knockout punch of yellow and all this texture. And there's a weird... How would I describe it? If you understand the way that an opal, the opalescence, the fire in an opal moves around, they've managed to recreate that with a bit of an effect on the dial. So obviously there's no color because it's just carbon, but the way that the light moves from one you know, sort of blade or edge of the carbon to the next is really kind of fun. Uh, and, and it's really just something to look down and have. It's so weird of an effect.
James Stacey Yeah, I can imagine. I mean, it's, it truly is like a new species, you know, it's like encountering, you know, a familiar bird, but in a whole different color or, you know, size or something, or it's, yeah, that's, uh, that's crazy. I, we, we did talk about it on the last show and I'll look forward to reading your impressions in your article, but, uh, Yeah, I'd love to get my hands on one of those one day and kind of just see. There's kind of two schools of thought when it comes to a really lightweight watch, whether it's carbon or titanium. Some people like the heft, they like to feel, that's part of the experience is to kind of have a bit of weight on their wrist. But boy, there's something special about putting on a really light watch. I enjoy that sensation of just like, it's a big watch or it's kind of something that looks like it should be heavy, but it's like your wrist feels nothing.
Jason Heaton I love that. And I would say that typically, usually I think, I could say whether I want one or the other from a given brand, the super light, more expensive experience that feels kind of special or the tried and true classic form fitting, respectful of its history steel. With Doxa, I now firmly want both. I cannot afford this watch, which is just the truth of it. I don't need another watch. I definitely don't need a third Doxa. That's exactly the same in case and size and use and And for all I know, may not be as kind of hard and rough and tumble as a steel version. I don't know. I don't have enough experience with forged carbon cases. But I would tell you if I had the money, it'd be an easy decision because it's so much fun.
James Stacey Well, it's the third. You've got the other two dial colors now. So this would complete the trilogy. Yeah.
Jason Heaton Yeah. This would lock in the trio for sure.
James Stacey Yeah. And boy, you know, it's one of those watches that you might love for The first month, then you might set it aside and kind of want to go back to something more traditional and steel, like your Rolex Explorer. But then I bet, you know, three years later when you are like at whatever replaces Baselworld or something, and you like decide to wear something just funky that people haven't seen in a while. And, and I don't know, it's one of those real statement watches, you know, whether it's just for you or for, for other kind of watch nerds, it's just so cool.
Jason Heaton It's a statement and it's like, um, it's like the compound niche to the second power. Yeah. Because DOXA is already niche. You wear a DOXA and you go to a watch event or you go to the Hodinkee office and like 95% of the people there won't even look at like notice or care.
Unknown Yeah.
Jason Heaton And you'll get one or two of the guys or someone over there will be like, Oh, that's, you know, that's a this or that. And they kind of know what's going on. And it's not that people don't know what DOXA is. It's just, it's kind of a brand that you either adore or you don't think about.
James Stacey Right. Exactly.
Jason Heaton When it comes to, especially when you, if you don't have like a strong understanding of their history in the dive watch space. Yeah. So certain, it's just a niche appeal, which I think is, is part of why I like it. And I don't think you choose to like Doxy. I think you just kind of get it if it works for you. And, and there's something really great about the steel ones. And then you go a step further by this thing being, you know, two times more expensive. It weighs nothing. It looks crazy. It feels really good. And it just like it it's they've compounded the niche kind of weird oddball charm. And, and, you know, it's funny because there is that there's that analogy to the way that forged carbon is made. under pressure and kind of cramming a lot to make something that's hard and durable. And I think that there's the same could be said in some ways for the philosophy behind what is it? You know, they're going to make 300 of them. Yeah, right. Whether or not they decide to make a bunch more and we'll have versions in pro and SR and without the SeaRambler or without the Aqualung or whatever, who knows? But right now there's 300 of them. My guess is they're not cheap to make. It feels like a fairly high quality thing. uh, in, in your hand. And I don't think that's something that you can cheat, especially when you move out of steel and into a, you know, a very light, you know, difficult to finish material like forged carbon. So, uh, I'm thrilled to have it. It was kind of Doxa to, uh, to send it our way or to send it my way. And, uh, you know, for the next few days, it's, it's not leaving the wrist. So that's my wrist check.
James Stacey Very cool. Well, uh, I have a good segue into our main topic today with what's on my wrist. Um, I have, I've got this old Tudor Submariner, it's the reference 9401-0, the snowflake hand, no date, black dial version of the Tudor Sub and it's from 1976. So cool. Yeah, I've had this for several years now and I had it, you know, brought up to snuff, fully restored and I've had it diving a few times and it's just, it's a cool watch. It's got this high domed crystal and a nice fade on the bezel, had the lume on the hour hand kind of Stabilized so it doesn't crack and fall out like so many of them do and It's a watch I haven't worn in a while and every time I pull it out It's it has a different appeal to it than than a Rolex sub and and I always enjoy wearing it and it looks good on any kind of strap and whatever so The reason I'm wearing that today is because our main topic today is a brand focus episode Which is something we have done in the past just a couple of times. We did one late last year episode 96 But today we're talking about Tudor
Jason Heaton I'm excited. It's a funny thing because with these brand profiles, these kind of brand focus episodes, it can be kind of hard to pick a brand. And when you suggested Tudor, I thought like, well, on one hand, that's a great choice, but also like, are we going to tell anyone anything they don't know about Tudor? Yeah, right. You know, it's a pretty big brand. And then I look back at the other brands we had done and it's Rolex and Seiko. And then we just, you know, and then, you know, 60 episodes later, we did Doxa. So, yeah, I'm excited. I think there's a ton here. to talk about. And the nice thing is I think we can skip a lot of the really basic stuff because it is just kind of a well-known, understood brand from a lineup standpoint. But I think that there's some interesting stuff in the vintage side, and I think you would have the experience on that. How do you approach a brand like Tudor for vintage? Because they, like everything else from Rolex and of course Tudor and lots of vintage dive watches, have become quite a bit more expensive in the last few years.
James Stacey Yeah, I feel like Tudor is sort of the brand of two different stories or the tale of two brands in a way, because the vintage stuff was so closely tied with, of course, Rolex, because it's a sub brand of Rolex. And so traditionally it was, you know, Hans Wilsdorf's idea was let's make equally high quality watches, but more affordable for people. And so they kind of almost mimicked all of the references or categories of watch that Rolex was making, but put, you know, at a movements or third party movements in them to, to bring the price down. And so you've got the Submariner like mine, um, or the earlier ones, uh, kind of had an early sort of big crown version. And then the, probably the most famous or long lasting one was the one, I think it was called the reference 7928, which was kind of the equivalent to Rolex's 5513. That same case, basically, with a Tudor dial, and they used to have rows on the dial, and then they went to the shield. And then they made the Submariner right up until the 90s, when it was the reference 79-190, which had those triangular markers, which I've never quite warmed up to. It had the Mercedes hands. But a lot of people liked those, came in a blue dial, black dial. Came in a pretty small version as well. Yes, it did. Actually, they had a 36 millimeter version of it, which is you are still pretty affordable if you can pull it off or if you're a woman and you've got smaller wrists. And then, of course, I mean, some some just beauties like the Monte Carlo, which doesn't have a Rolex equivalent, the kind of the home plate dial version with the orange and the gray and the black, just a beautiful watch that they later recreated in that heritage chronograph. And then there was a Ranger, which was kind of their version of a of an Explorer. that was a bit of a rare piece. And then the Oyster Prince, which I had an Oyster Prince for a while. I sold it a few months ago. That was kind of their version of a Datejust with us. You could get it with a smooth bezel or you could get it with a fluted bezel or some other iterations. But I guess looking at vintage Tudor, yeah, the prices have gone up. I think people look at it as a nice alternative. You know, vintage Rolex has gotten so stratospherically expensive that it's virtually out of touch for kind of the average collector who just wants to get into it. And Tudor is a nice alternative and they're super high quality watches with Rolex crowns and cases. But, you know, frankly, I mean, if you kind of left the conversation there, there wouldn't be much new to talk about other than what we talked about, maybe with Rolex, other than some beautiful watches, well-made, more affordable than Rolex, but the look is Rolex. And I think I'd like to kind of turn the page and talk more about what's happened in the past Gosh, when did they relaunch 2010 or 2009? Yeah. Look at how they relaunched with all of these new references that when you look at it, it's not Rolex at all. It's, it's its own brand. It's really, they've really done an amazing job of launching what's essentially a whole different, um, whole different name, whole different brand.
Jason Heaton Yeah. And I think what's interesting on what people maybe don't, don't think about as quickly with, with Tudor is they've been, they've been able to build a heritage line. which recalls watches that were heavily based on Rolex watches without now looking like Rolex watches. Yeah. Which I think is kind of an interesting little tightrope to walk. Right. Like to make the new Heritage Chrono, you know, look like a Monte Carlo or a home plate, et cetera. That's one thing. But to make their diver both hold on to some of what made Tudors style interesting back in the day without becoming a sort of within brand homage to the Submariner. Yeah. I think that's kind of a remarkable thing and they've been rewarded for that work. Yeah. Because these have become de facto options at their price point.
James Stacey Right. Yeah. And I agree. And I think what you get is the reputation and the provenance of what Tudor has always been and these hints of heritage designs, more than hints really. I mean the, the, the bezel fonts, the, the markers, but they've mixed it up just enough and increased case sizes and done different things with straps and bezels that, um, it, it, it's like what people always wanted Rolex to be was to have a little fun, you know, let your hair down a little bit, um, introduce bronze or a red bezel or a black case. And, Everybody knows, you know, it's kind of a joke now, you know, Rolex will never do that sort of thing. You know, they just don't do that stuff. And I think the common theory is that, you know, Tudor has been Rolex's little effort to have a little bit of fun and we've been rewarded with it. I think it's great.
Jason Heaton Yeah. I mean, like even just to focus on the Black Bay, which I think is the one that most people listening would have the most experience with, obviously we know people who have Pelagoses and Rangers and North Flags and even Heritage Chronos, but the Black Bay has just become ubiquitous. Yeah. Among people who wanted a... In many ways, I would say, obviously, a new vintage style watch that skips some of the pitfalls. So you're not looking at the tan loom. Typically, there's obviously... There's examples that did go that route, but on whole, you're looking at a modern expression of a vintage watch. And I think that they offer enough variety, whether it's, you know, dial color, bezel color. Early ones were, of course, EDA powered, and now we're into in-house movements, which is, you know, remarkable for the price point that they're claiming.
James Stacey You know, the Black Bay, just kind of the basic black dial, red bezel with a leather strap is a $3,400 watch, $3,475.
Jason Heaton Right. And we're not going to sit here and say that's a cheap watch or like this, you know, an entry level option or something. But if you want to get into a luxury market, that's making a solid product with a really nice movement and it wears really well, that's a lot of watch. And if I remember correctly, the BB 58, which is largely the hot model right now, is a few bucks cheaper. Yeah. Who knows how long that lasts or if this year, due to what happened with Baselworld and such, we end up seeing new versions of the 58 as we now have a handful of versions of the BB 41. But it's kind of a fun thing, and they do these all black versions, the Black Bay Dark. They do... Obviously, you can get them in a burgundy bezel with kind of a gilt dial, the black dial, the blue bezel on the black dial with the white metal markers and hands. There's a lot to love here, and that's really only one line within what is a lot of really successful stuff. I've over time... I don't think I understood it when it first came out, but over time, the Black Bay chrono has really grown on me. Yeah, same here. And don't get me wrong, sure, it would be a bummer if you're trying to use the chronograph when that hour hand is over the register, but I don't know how much I would care. One, I'm not really a chronograph guy, so I don't know how much I would actually use it, but putting them on wrist, there's something about that case size that just makes more sense when there's a lot more going on on the dial. Yeah. It's a little, you know, when you get the crowns and then now you get the steel and gold version, which I'm very much a fan of, especially off of the bracelet on some sort of a strap. And then that's, again, it's insane because we're still within just Black Bay and we haven't gotten to the bronze options. We haven't gotten to, you know, they do a full chrono dark.
James Stacey Yeah, right. I just noticed that. I didn't even realize. I mean, I probably knew it at some point, but I just, I saw that on the website and I was like, oh yeah, they make a chrono dark and then Well, and then even in the Black Bay family, there's the non-diver ones. There's the Black Bay 36, the Black Bay 41, these kind of more... Yeah, the BB-36 is like a modern day Explorer.
Jason Heaton Yeah, yeah. And a modern day 1016. I think the black dial on a steel bracelet is an absolutely killer watch. They're really special. And then if you wanna go more into my tastes, The Black Bay GMT. I mean, it's a category killer. It is a watch without competition, solid movement, great-looking bezel, great-looking watch. I think the only thing that I would say is if you've had the chance to put on a 58 and a 41, like to have them together, and obviously 58 is in reference to the year, 41 is in reference to the size, So a 58 would be more like a Black Bay 39. And that two millimeter difference to case width, I don't think is that important, but there's a difference in thickness. Yeah. And I think that's something of value. If you've ever put on a Black Bay, let's say this was say five years ago or something, you put on a Black Bay when they were new and really fresh and you thought, this is a little bit too tall for me. It has a very chunky appeal that I like, but it's probably kept me from ever really considering having one of my own. Yeah. The 58 sits a little lower. It's a little bit less lug to lug. Obviously it's two millimeters less case width. And I don't think, I don't mind a 41 millimeter watch at all. I mean, I just raved at length about a 42 and a half millimeter watch, but I think there's just a lot to love. And the fun thing is, is they just keep developing the whole lineup. Like in the next year or two, I'm sure there'll be several more black bays to enjoy and to consider. So if they're not necessarily hitting your zone today, Uh, I think that there'll be, there'll be more and more. And certainly if they make a 58, uh, GMT, you can, you can take my money whenever you want it. Uh, same, same really, uh, you know, uh, I'm, I'm excited to see what they come up with in terms of different color versions of the, of the 58.
James Stacey Yeah. I mean, I guess the question comes up when Tudor comes out with new versions of, of the Black Bay is, you know, how many is too many, you know, iterations, should they spin off a different name or, I mean, let's face it, if you just took the Black Bay family, and kind of spun it off. You could almost have its own standalone brand. You know, you could call it the Black Bay, whatever. I mean, they've got a chronograph that has nothing to do with diving. It's got a tachymeter bezel. You've got the smooth bezel 36, which is more of an explorer type. And then you've got all the divers and it doesn't bother me. It's a little bit, I kind of chuckle every time because, Oh, you know, you can almost guess like, Oh, it's another Black Bay. And I, I kind of sit back and wait and you're like, what can they possibly do? fresh with the Black Bay and they keep doing it. There's like something for everybody. Like if you like that basic look, the snowflake hands with the round markers, you know, you've got all black divers, all black chronos, you know, smooth bezel steel in different sizes. I mean, it's two tone.
Jason Heaton It's incredible. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. I think it's great. I think this is the one that everybody probably knows for the most part. I think where to go next is one that I think was kind of a hit when it came out. but has kind of been overshadowed by the entire lineup of the Black Bay, and that would be the Heritage Chrono. I think that's probably still my favorite design from a tutor in the 41 millimeter case. I adore, and I think you and I have had this discussion before, probably it was a couple years ago, but I feel like I remember it where you were saying that your preference is the black gray dial. I love that. Yeah, that's my favorite. Yeah, and I love that blue cream dial is... definitely the move for me. I think these are really killer things. If I was going the road of a chronograph, I love that not only do you get a very much a motorsport kind of inspiration, but then you get a 12-hour bezel, which I would find very useful. I think if there was a kind of thing where maybe I had continued on a path of working in the automotive industry, this would have been something that I started to wear. Maybe pick one up and have it as my, oh, I'm traveling for a car gig, as they just kind of suit the vibe. I think they're gorgeous watches in any of the three sort of basic colorways. There's more of a gray dial, there's obviously a black dial, and then there's this remarkable kind of cream and blue color that I really, really am crazy about and always have been. These are super fun and they obviously tip back to the Monte Carlo and the home plate dial and all that kind of stuff. Jason, have you ever spent any time with these? Have you ever owned one?
James Stacey I never have. I've often dabbled or considered picking one up. I love it. I've got a good friend here in town who has one that I suppose I should ask if I could spend a little time with it because I've loved them since they first introduced. I think this was the one that they came back to the U.S. with when Tudor relaunched here was the Heritage Chrono and it just stole my heart back then. I think if there's one gripe that some people have is or two gripes it's it's not in-house and it's too thick and it's you know like not an integrated chronograph movement, which doesn't bother me personally. And, you know, when I go for a chronograph, I don't expect super thin. And I think this is a 150 meters sports watch anyway, so I don't really care how thick it is, but I could see that being a move for them. I certainly hope they keep this watch in the lineup and it seems like it would be a logical next step to, to put their in-house chrono movement from the Black Bay chrono into this. We'll see.
Jason Heaton Yeah, so I believe that movement, that's the MT5813, and I believe that's the one they get in their partnership with Breitling. So Breitling gets the movement that's in the three-hand date manufacture movement that I think it's the 5612 that's in the rest of the black bays that aren't chronographs basically, give or take. And Tudor has this kind of trade where they get the proper in-house chronometer certified chronograph with a 70-hour power reserve, and it's a good tool. Chronograph movement, and one that's more befitting the cost and the name of Tudor, versus something from an off-the-shelf brand, which isn't necessarily better or worse, as much as it's kind of a perception thing where this allows them to differentiate themselves at the price point. which I understand as much as I'm kind of here or there, and I think you are too for the most part on in-house movements or the importance of in-house movements. A really good in-house movement is worth its money, but I don't think they're all instantly better than ETA or Salidas. In this case, if Breitling made it, I actually am inclined to think it's probably a pretty great movement. They've been making the BO1 for years and it's proven itself, I think. Yeah, you know, it would be interesting to see that movement go into the Heritage Chrono. And who knows, maybe they'll do a Heritage Chrono kind of 58 that brings the sizing down a little bit. My guess is a lot of that's controlled by the movement. So if they're switching off of one movement platform to another, maybe the size can change as well.
James Stacey Yeah, yeah. I think the other watch from their Heritage Collection that doesn't get talked about much, Had a bit of fanfare when it came out, was the Ranger. I spent some time with the Ranger. I have to admit, of the watches kind of in their heritage collection, that's the one I probably like the least. I find it less compelling than the others. But, you know, solid watch. I remember when it came out, it had the Boone strap, which of course I go on record as loving, and then a bracelet. But, you know, Who knows where these are going to go in the future, whether these watches stay in the collection or not. I think it's still a solid field watch, but I think when you line it up next to now, like the Black Bay 36 or the 41 with the smooth bezel, it kind of doesn't have the same punch to it.
Jason Heaton Yeah, I agree. I think between the two, I would go with the Black Bay 36. There is something that I really like about the Ranger. I remember reviewing it way, way, way back in the day. But it's also a watch that not unlike the 214-270, the modern 39 millimeter Explorer from Rolex. Yeah. I think it would have been just fine at 36 or 37 millimeters. Obviously, with the direction that Tudor's taking with their watches, 41 is kind of their home base. And then they maybe express in a different direction like they did with the 58. But yeah, I think this is a fun watch. Obviously, this one has not been upgraded with the in-house movement. This still uses a 2824. But a great-looking watch, solid lume, really kind of like a nice rough-and-tumble style. I really like the hands on the Ranger, and I remember being pretty happy with the watch in general. And it's definitely not too big. At 41, I just think it might be sweeter at 36 to 38, something like that. Yeah. Yeah, I totally agree. Obviously, this is like basically fully conjecture on Jason and I, just sharing opinions. Yeah. They're not having any trouble selling any of these watches, or they probably wouldn't continue making them. But yeah, I think the Rangers are pretty neat. The North flag is the real outlier in that lineup. I think it's such an interesting watch. And obviously, you and I both know this guy, Brett Curry, who we've talked about a bunch on the show before, this fantastic photographer from California. He's the only guy I know who owns one and wears one. Yeah. And I'm not saying that there aren't... I'm not saying there aren't other people that own or wear one or it's like an unheard of watch, but it's such a cool thing and Brett wears it really well and it's always kind of a treat to see that on his wrist when you get to catch up with him. I think it's a watch that really, because of the integrated bracelet style, it feels a little bit like an older IWC and it has this kind of great case, it sits pretty flat, it's a lot of dial, really good loom, and then it's this interesting feature set with the date and the power reserve. And I think this is a watch that people don't talk a ton about. It made a splash when it came out. I mean, they produced these big videos of being out on the tundra with sled dogs and everything else, and it was very exciting. But it's 40 millimeters with an integrated case. You get integrated case and bracelet, and I think the bracelet's one of the best parts of the watch. It just wears really nicely on wrist, which is what the whole reason of having an integrated bracelet is to control how it sits. And yeah, I think this is a killer one that doesn't get a lot of fanfare, and maybe this is the kind of thing that they'll iterate in some direction. You think all that black and all that yellow, and I'm sure this is the Doc's at Carbon talking to me, but it would look pretty cool in a full black finish as well.
James Stacey It would look really good, yeah. Yeah, this is one of those watches that I suppose would appeal to either one of two people. It would be the guy who has a lot of other watches, and he wants to kind of add something quirky and unique to his collection. Or it's the guy who walks in, you know, isn't a watch guy and walks into a Tudor retailer or looks at this on their website and says, I'd really like the look of that watch. And I don't want to mess around. I'm not a guy who changes straps or cares about a traditional shape or some heritage. It's like, it's dynamic, it's bright, it's colorful and it's rugged. And like, you could own that and be like the cliched one watch and just wear it all the time. You know, if you're, a photographer like Brett or a polar explorer or a, you know, desk worker, whatever it is. I mean, you could just slap this thing on and it would look really, really cool on wrist. And, um, yeah, I like that. I mean, I think, you know, now we've, we've bridged over from the heritage stuff into the North flag. And of course the other elephant in the room that is a favorite of ours in their kind of modern elephant, for sure. Titanium elephant in, in their modern lineup is of course the Pelagos, which is, I love this watch probably the, one of the top five sort of TGNable watches, I would say.
Jason Heaton Very good NATO. Yeah, and you've owned one, so I don't... I've reviewed them, I've played around with them, I've worn them around, you've dove with them and all that kind of stuff. So it's... I think it's an incredible watch, I think it's a huge value for what you're getting. It's a strict tool watch, which I'm sure works in some ways to its discredit to a more general audience, but to the right person, It's something else. I had one in Mexico several years ago, the blue one on the blue rubber strap, and I took it diving several times. Yeah. And what a thing. It's perfect. It is. It is perfect. It's a little bit big, but in such a perfect way, like a ploprof or like a great planet ocean or like a sea dweller. It's big, but with purpose. And then the titanium makes it light. The quality of that rubber strap is incredible. Mm-hmm. And then you can just leave it on the bracelet and put it right over a five mil wetsuit. Yeah. Because you get the trick clasp with the spring loaded and the extension, and I've done it. I mean, I've helped people put it on their wrist and engage that spring system. It's foolproof and they're such, such good dive watches.
James Stacey I think it's become one of only a handful of really modern benchmark watches that when any other watch pops up, people say, yeah, but the Pelagos, you know, and, you know, in terms of price point, in terms of, uh, you know, capability, I mean, 500 meter water resistant, that titanium, that great clasp, um, just ceramic bezel, fully matte, everything's matte. You know, there's just, there's not a shiny bit on this watch. And, and my personal favorite of the collection is the left-hand drive, the LHD one, slightly tempted loom and that little splash of red writing. I think it's just, I love that watch. It's super cool. Yeah. Yeah. Pelagos. Um, you know, we talked about the, the sin you 50, I think it was last week or the week before. And, uh, this came up as well. I mean, I think there are very few examples of truly non heritage inspired.
Jason Heaton You could argue that the hands, I guess, or yeah, I would say the hands are the only way you could get around it, but yeah. Yeah.
James Stacey But you know, just a truly modern, like clean sheet of paper kind of dive watch. And I think that the Sin is one. I think there might be a couple more, but this one for sure is at the top of the heap. I think this is, this is truly in my mind, um, you know, I'm not quite prepared to say this is the best dive watch available, but you know, it's close.
Jason Heaton I mean, I think it's gotta, it's gotta be in the running. I mean, the best is so subjective, but if you're making a list, I don't think you're making it without the Pelagos for sure. Yeah. And the funny thing is, is if you imagine, if you imagine, um, being told that you're buying a dive watch to go diving all the time, like this is now your professional diver to some extent, and someone else is gonna cover the cost. They don't really care what you buy. There's not a lot of price sensitivity here. Yeah. I would go Pelagos before anything from Rolex. Yeah, oh, for sure, personally. I mean, as much as I love a Submariner or anything else, there's something perfect about the Pelagos, whereas the Submariner feels like, well, which reference do you go with? Do I go date or no date? How am I going to get a rubber strap? You're not, unless you go entirely third party, and then you won't get the clasp and all this kind of stuff. And the fun thing about the Pelagos is I think it It's not their cheapest watch by any stretch. It's one of their most expensive watches. It's one of the most technical watches. It has some features that you and I roll our eyes about, like with the helium escape valve, but it is a true professional watch. This is a watch that you could definitely use if you were, say, a saturation diver. It's a watch that you could use if you were a professional instructor and dove every day of the year for however long. I mean, it's a true tool watch, but it does so without any reflection of past... I suppose, like you said, aside from those hands. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I love it. It's great. I absolutely love it. I would be so thrilled to see them iterate on that line, a GMT or a Pelagos 58, as silly as that naming sounds. All black. Yeah. And all black LHD. I mean, jeez. Yeah. I mean, there's lots. It's fun because they've made all these little kind of playgrounds these little sandboxes, and you can kind of pick up one thing and take it to another. And absolutely no word from Jason or I as to whether or not any of this will ever exist. It's just kind of dreaming. I think the idea of a Pelagos GMT has been something we've talked about since early days of the show. It would just be the most flexible kind of worldwide-ready dive watch. And I think it'd be fun to see, especially now that they've already developed a full GMT movement for the Black Bay GMT. So who knows? There's some pretty solid, fun photoshops running around the internet of ones from past years, even several years ago. So it could be fun to kind of imagine that, but it's always hard to say which way they'll go. And part of that is because they have so many options. And the other side of that is, of course, is they are a part of Rolex. And that means that you don't talk a lot. Yeah, right. Cards to the chest. Really, it's not even cards to the chest. They get the cards, they pull them off the table, they put them deep in a back pocket, and then they just kind of... You just get poker face. That's what you get for the rest of the time, and that's fine. This is what makes Rolex Rolex, and that includes... And you don't have the power of today's Rolex without what Tudors become in the last decade worldwide, and certainly in North America. Yeah, true. It all... It's absolutely important to the overall brand.
James Stacey We would be remiss if we moved on from this discussion without talking about the Black Bay P01. For sure. You know, when that thing came out at Baselworld last year, or was it the year before? It was last year. Yeah, last year's Baselworld. Boy, controversial watch. I remember, you know, the presentation and kind of all the backstory behind it. And it's one of those watches that Um, I always have a bit of a conflict when it comes to watches that have to be explained too much. You know, I think a watch kind of in my mind, you know, you look at it, you like the look and it should stand on its own in that regard. And that one was one that, Oh, it was, you know, it's based on a prototype that was developed for the Navy and this and that. And it has this interesting locking bezel and whatever. Um, and, and I think, you know, that's so much of what we heard. And when, when we first saw it and had a brief, moment at Baselworld and maybe a few hands-on weeks after that, you know, you start to learn about this watch and how it feels to wear and after kind of the initial controversy died down, it turned out to be kind of a neat looking watch. I think, was it Cole that did a hands-on post for it?
Jason Heaton Cole did a long hands-on, which I'll put in the show notes. I think it's the definitive write-up as far as a perspective on this watch. People got really upset because they thought that there was going to be a sort of reissue of a vintage watch from Tudor's past that's been very popular with collectors. And instead, Tudor put out this kind of oddball, charming, but weird, and you can't really put your own straps on it and all these other things. And if you don't know the P01, you have no idea what we're talking about. I'll put that in the show notes as well. But Reed Cole's assessment of it, I think this is closer to... I mean, this is a brand... We just spent the last 40 minutes listing dive watches that they make. Yeah. And then people get so upset when they make something that's maybe not the most wide audience sort of market. Yeah, right. And give them a break. It's a cool watch. I thought it was really good on wrist. Obviously, a little big lug to lug, but that strap really helps in the way that the strap articulates at the lugs. I love the dial. I love the 12-hour bezel. I would love to see that dial, that hand, that 12-hour bezel on a BB-58. Yeah. I think it would be killer. I think they made a cool thing. I think they essentially made their own pro cloth. It's kind of a weird, funky thing that's only going to apply to a few people. I already rambled on ad nauseum about Doxa and their niche appeal, and I don't see this as being very much different. This is fair to say that I don't have the perspective of some hardcore Tudor collector. I'm kind of a product specialist would be the easier way to see the way that I interact with these things. So I'm just interested in whatever's interesting and I found this watch to be interesting and really nicely made and connected to a very personalized part of Tudor's history.
James Stacey You need to step back and look at the perspective that we talked about earlier at the show that when Tudor came back as kind of a reinvented brand, it became the fun line of Rolex or the fun brand that Rolex never could be and I think this is a classic example of taking some chances and just doing something so bonkers that if 20% of the people that look at it like it, great. It becomes one of those cult or niche watches that in 10 years everybody's like, man, I wish I'd appreciated that more when it came out. Now they're not available anymore, you know, or whatever.
Jason Heaton Yeah, absolutely. In a decade, you'll be at a Red Bar or at a hangout or whatever, and one guy will have one of these, and that's going to be what everybody wants a rough shot of. And that's how it goes. I mean, you see this with some, like I mentioned earlier, with some IWC stuff. I mean, they made some really interesting, really kind of oddball, exciting, innovative sort of watches, whether it was the Deep Lines or the GST stuff or the internal crown divers and that kind of thing. And now when you see them, it's such a treat. It's like seeing a great car from the 90s. Yeah, that's so true. And you're like, ah, these were so cool when they came out and then everybody kind of moved on. And it's that circular process of what makes something kind of cool. And eventually all this stuff will come back around. And I would say that comparatively, you're going to see black bays everywhere for the next 50 years or longer. You're not going to see that many P1s. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's a cool thing. And, uh, and I also think that we've probably said what we need to say about Tudor, at least at this point. Um, you know, we, we know some people at Tudor and it'd be a treat to have them on at some point, uh, on the show, maybe, maybe sometime when, uh, travel exists and that kind of thing. So we will certainly, uh, you know, see if we could get some more perspectives on the brand, uh, whether it be from a collective or maybe even from a corporate, uh, as possible. But if you have any perspective, any questions, any comments or feedback, please send us an email to thegraynadoatgmail.com. And of course, if you have any questions that you would like part of our Q&A episode, which will be in about two episodes from now, record it onto your voice memo app on your phone and then email it to thegraynadoatgmail.com. And please keep those questions coming. We've got a ton already in for the next episode, and I'm already looking forward to getting to those answers. Before we move into homework and even some alcoholic bread that Jason spoke of earlier in the episode, let's get to a quick ad break for Hodinkee Shop. So as we've been saying with all of the Isolution Tape episodes, Hodinkee is supported and that's all of the projects at Hodinkee, which we're fortunate enough to be included in here at the Graynado. We're fully supported by the Hodinkee shop. So if you're looking for a strap, a book, a new watch, some tools, whatever it may be, if you'd like to support the Graynado or Hodinkee radio, or just simply Hodinkee at large and all the people that make these great things kind of come together and keep everything moving during these kinds of weird times. hit shop.hodinkey.com and pick something up and consider it a vote of confidence for what Jason and I do and for what the team does at large. We would certainly appreciate it.
James Stacey Yeah, great. So why don't we jump right into homework and then final notes. Yeah, let's do it. Well, I've got a bit of an oddball one today, although I'm not sure it's any stranger than my buy stocks homework from a couple episodes ago. Yeah, so I think as we've kind of been homebound for the past month or two, I've been dabbling a bit more with baking. I'm doing a lot of cookies and we've made a few pies around here lately. And I found a really good recipe for a beer bread, which is about as simple a baking recipe as you can possibly get. There's like four ingredients. One of them is like a can of beer, um, which I'm guessing most of our listeners have around the house, uh, whether non-alcoholic or alcoholic or whatever kind. And so I, I took it upon myself and I took one for the team here before the episode, you know, we recording this in the afternoon and I, I had an hour this morning and I just whipped up a batch and did a sample loaf and man, was it good? Um, I used a, there's a local microbrewery called Indeed and they make this milkshake IPA and I popped a 16 ounce can and used 12 ounces and drank the other four as I mentioned. Just added it to three cups of flour, some salt, some baking powder and a little bit of sugar. You just mix it up, throw it in a nine by five baking pan and put it in the oven at 375 for Gosh, it was about 35 minutes and it was perfect. I drizzled a little melted butter on top and sliced it up and it has a slight sweetness to it, kind of that beer taste came out really nicely. And, you know, all told, I had about, with the prep and the baking, it was like a 40 or 45 minute project and really satisfying, just a really fun thing to bake. Sounds easy enough that I could do it. Yeah. Well, you know, I do my best here. You know, for a lot of people you see during this, uh, sort of pandemic shutdown time, I feel like baking has become kind of a thing. And a lot of people are doing sourdough starters and loaves of bread and things. And I figured I'd start easy and boy, I'm glad I did. So yeah, try it, try it out. We'll put a couple of recipes in the show notes. The one I used was from the cooking section of the New York times. And I realized that their link might require a subscription. So I found another one on the King Arthur flour website that uses self-rising, um, flower, so it's slightly different. But yeah, give it a try.
Jason Heaton How about you? So my homework this week is actually pretty simple. Several weeks ago, I suggested just change around a room in your home, just move the furniture to a different spot. And I stand by that as being pretty solid advice to just to make your kind of general space feel new or fresh, especially if you're spending even more time in it. I think when we said that, we thought a lot of these kind of isolation scenarios might have lasted weeks, not months. So my next one is something that I've been getting to, simply because I have now been home longer in my current home than I have been in my home for several years, is fix something. Or take three hours on a Saturday morning and do all the little fixes, whether it's the four or five pictures you plan to hang, or it could be almost anything. Everyone's house, I mean, obviously there's going to be exceptions, but most people have a few things around their home that need to be fixed or maintained, or maybe your desk is a mess of wires and you need to do some cable management or something like that. Hit those projects. The dividends of having the space feel cared for, there's like a mental health side of it that I really appreciate and just kind of finding these little things and none of them took all that much time. or special tools really. And if you have everything done, maybe, maybe refinish something, you know, sand and stain something or paint something or whatever. Uh, but if you don't have everything done, you know, pick a room and get it ready. Uh, make it feel like it's your space, put some time and some effort into it, and then feel the rewards of that every time you kind of walk through or stand in that space.
James Stacey That's yeah, that's a really good one. And I mentioned a couple of episodes ago that, you know, if I don't get around to this stuff now, I'm going to be kicking myself when the world gets back to normal and I'm traveling and too busy to hang a picture or fix a light fixture or clean out the garage, which I finally did. And it felt really good. I put up, I hung some hooks and got some of the, you know, yard stuff hung up and cleared off the workbench and it felt really good. So I'll, I'll definitely take this to heart and try to keep the momentum up.
Jason Heaton I think you'll, you'll feel really good when you're done. And that room for the next several weeks will, uh, will feel like, like you wanted it to every time you went in. Yeah. Great. All right. Let's get into final notes and then, yeah, we'll put a bow on the show. All right.
James Stacey Mine is truly one of the best pieces of long form journalism I've read in, boy, recent past. This was recommended to me by a handful of people in the past, gosh, couple of days. I think it just published less than a week ago. But most notably, a guy named Frank Park, who's a listener, he sent this in. to our email box and so thanks Frank for that. It's from the New Yorker and it's an article called 36,000 Feet Under the Sea. And it's, I didn't do a word count, it's got to be upwards of 10,000 words by a writer named Ben Taub. And as you might guess, it's about the Five Deeps project that was initiated by Victor Vescovo, the billionaire Texan, former naval intelligence guy, pilot, private equity guy, I mean, just a, just a fascinating person who took it upon himself to have a submersible custom built for him that could go to the deepest point in all five of the world's oceans. And, you know, this was a story that I thought I knew, uh, I had met Victor and gone on a press trip with Omega last year to London, um, where of course they debuted that ultra deep watch that accompanied him on all the all the dives and was strapped to the outside of the submersible. And that was pretty amazing. And he's just a really dynamic, interesting, quite pleasant guy, um, with a really interesting background and, um, and seriously ambitious, but this story was really well done. And there was some nice sort of animations and graphics and spectacular photography from, from the expedition. And it just follows the whole project from its initiation through each of the five dives. And the article is kind of broken up by those dives. And the way that the project was described was so different from how you picture kind of a typical, you know, world-class record-setting expedition with, you know, high polish and discipline and that sort of thing. You know, it talks about the state of the ship that they had bought to undertake this expedition, you know, was pretty rundown and had to be fixed up. The crew was a little bit cowboy. Um, you know, their protocols were basically developed on the fly that the submersible was being hotwired and rebuilt, you know, during the voyage to one of the sites. And, um, that's not to say that it wasn't a highly professionally done expedition, but it was just very different from kind of the typical, um, you know, scrubbed and well-packaged and well-disciplined expeditions that you often read about. And this was just, just a superb article. I really loved the writing. I love the photography and, uh, definitely worth worth a read, and it will take you a while. I had to do it in a couple of sittings. It's a very long article, but worth the time.
Jason Heaton That sounds incredible. What a story, and I was definitely, I think we're all in the market for a little bit of a long read, so that's great. Yeah, good one. Good pick, good pick. Who doesn't want to be under the ocean these days? Seriously, yeah. Mine is actually a series from Outside Online. It's also, certain elements of it are also a YouTube feed, and it's called, so A lot of us probably know Wes Seiler, and he used to have a website called Indefinitely Wild, which he may still have, but it's now kind of packaged within an element of outside. And it's all sorts of different things about just preparedness and learning how to do things outside and all of these various kind of tutorials on how to become more comfortable being outside and in nature and with all sorts of different scenarios. And I've really been enjoying these series that he had on YouTube, which is all done through outside and it's called Rewilding. So it covers a wider range of things that, you know, there's 10 or so videos in the playlist that I found. And it's everything from, you know, how to take good photos of wildlife on your phone, you know, four ingredients to a perfect night outside, how to boil snow for drinking water, how not to drive like an idiot this winter. I assume that was posted last fall. How to get your car unstuck from the snow, how to cook the best steak in the world. And then most recently he's been doing more and it's not all video, but I'll link to a bunch of it in the show notes on, you know, how to kind of do outside nature-y things during the current COVID crisis. So he did a video recently on how to get outside safely during a pandemic. And he's doing stuff on, you know, how do you socialize a dog when they can't meet other dogs? He has a bunch of dogs if you follow him on Instagram. You can learn about the only time you're supposed to drink bleach, how to properly cook chicken, is it safe to go on a camping trip during the pandemic. I think there's a lot here and I really like the way that it's really a no garbage sort of way of bringing these facts to people. And some of it's, you know, it has that kind of tone of preparedness and knowledge. And I think for some people, you have to work your way up to understanding that kind of perspective. Obviously, this is a guy, I don't know Wes personally, but this is a guy that knows what he's up to with these things and he takes it seriously. And that's obviously something you've seen with all sorts of these kind of outdoor specialists that you meet or survival specialists. that you meet through your television, whether it be a Bear Grylls or otherwise. Wes is an entertaining guy, a good writer, and I just like that he's continued making his product, but he's tuned it to actually be helpful during a time when... I think a lot of us, if you listen to Great NATO, there's probably a good section of us that are wondering like, all right, so if they tell me that the state park is open or the nearby campground is open, how do I do this without causing a problem?
Unknown Oh, yeah.
Jason Heaton of really make the most out of a chicken breast when you're cooking it, that could be helpful. I could always learn how to cook a chicken breast better, but I think things like how to prepare for camping during a pandemic, you know, that sort of thing. How do you do this properly and with some forethought and some planning? I think this is a good way to consider.
James Stacey Huh, nice. Yeah, I'm not familiar with this, but I've read Wes's pieces in outside and I think he's a guy who If I remember correctly is a bit of an overlander and he's he's had some stuff related to some of the old 4x4s he's owned as well, which Yeah, for sure.
Jason Heaton So he recently put out a video about he he did a whole not an additional a new build Because he was he got married just around the time that the kovat crisis broke out But he did it in Cabo if I'm not mistaken Like but he drove all the way from wherever it is. He lives in the in the mountains, huh? uh, with his wife and his dogs and everything else. And it was in a ranger. He's got a video. I'll link that too. This is great. He's, he's got, he's got a little bit of something for everyone. Whether you're into the four, the four by four kind of overland life, uh, or, or you just want to do a little bit of camping with your family and not feel insecure about the whole process or, or like you're putting anyone at risk. I think this is a good starting point. And, uh, and I like that Wes says, you know, continue to put this kind of stuff out.
Unknown Nice.
James Stacey Good one. Yeah. Good solid episode again. We went from Film Club last week to Tudor this week. Tudor. Solid homework and final notes. And as always, thank you so much for listening. You can hit the show notes via Hodinkee.com or the feed for more details and thanks to the Hodinkee Shop for supporting this episode. You can follow us on Instagram at Jason Heaton and at J.E. Stacey and be sure to follow the show at The Graynado. If you have any questions, please write to thegraynado at gmail.com and please keep sending those voice memos to the same address. Please subscribe and review wherever you find your podcasts. Music throughout the show is Siesta by JazzArr via the free music archive.
Jason Heaton And we leave you with this quote from Ralph Waldo Emerson, who said, to be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment.